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Generic Active Crossovers vs Bryston BAX-1 Crossover
Hi Folks, The above comments on the Bryston BAX-1 Active Crossover has motivated me to write this short explanation. Can the Bryston BAX-1 Electronic Crossover be used with other active or passive loudspeakers? The short answer is ‘NO’ due to a very critical design factor regarding how ‘loudspeaker drivers’ and ‘passive or active crossovers’ interrelate with one another. Generic active electronic crossovers provide the customer with a 'generic' approach to speaker adjustments. By that I mean you can choose the slope and the crossover point and sometimes the Q but they do not take into account the ‘Sound Power’ or total radiated energy of the speaker. ‘Sound Power’ is the result of the loudspeakers radiation pattern into the listening room. The two most critical parts of any loudspeaker system choice is the listening ‘Room’ and the loudspeakers ‘Sound Power’. Recognizing how the room imposes its boundaries (floor, ceiling, walls) on the speaker and how that speaker radiates its energy (polar response) into a specific room is critical to the understanding of the overall performance of any loudspeaker. DIRECT and RELECTED SOUND: When you are listening to a loudspeaker in a room you are always listening to a balance between the ‘Direct Sound’ and the ‘Reflected Sound’ from the boundaries of the room – this is referred to as the ‘Sound Power.’ It is that balance between direct and reflected energy which changes depending on the frequency radiation pattern (polar response) of the given speaker and the boundaries of the room the speaker is placed in. Dipoles, Bipolar, Omnipoles, Direct Radiators, Horns etc. all behave differently due to their specific radiation patterns and therefore exhibit different power responses in any specific room. The ‘direct sound’ is the sound radiating from the front of the loudspeaker and the ‘reflected sound’ is all the sound your ears perceive after the sound waves have interacted with all the different boundaries in the room. It is important given real world conditions that the on axis response and the off axis frequency response of a loudspeaker be as uniform as possible. The smoother and more uniform the on and off axis polar response of the speaker the better the tonal balance between the direct sound and the reflected sound will be. In other words, the reflected sound will have the same overall tonal balance and sonic characteristics as the direct sound if ‘on and off’ polar response is smooth and even. CROSSOVERS: So when you design a ‘Passive’ or ‘Active’ crossover for a specific speaker you are attempting to achieve the best Sound Power possible. Generic crossovers have their place but recognize that without sophisticated anechoic chambers and very specialized measuring tools getting the ‘on and off' axis as smooth as possible with the various drivers and speaker cabinets out there is not an easy task. The Bryston BAX-1 Active Electronic Crossover on the other hand is designed with a specific Bryston speaker in mind (Model T, Middle T and Mini T) We design and manufacture all our own drivers as well to facilitate optimizing the sound power. The Model T has different software than the Middle T and the Mini T has different software again. The reason for that is we put each of the Model T's in our anechoic camber and we make over 300 measurements but vertically and horizontally around the speaker and adjust the software to provide as accurate as possible the best ‘Sound Power’ for the specific Model T speaker. Hope this helps explain it a bit. Sorry this went on a bit longer than I planned. james Last edited by James Tanner - Bryston; 09-10-2018 at 01:58 PM. |
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Hi Soundmig,
Thank you for your kind comments - much appreciated. The problem is that these measuring systems and using gating techniques etc. are fine for nearfield direct on and off axis measurements but they can not measure the reflected energy with anywhere near he same accuracy as an anechoic chamber. And the number of measurements necessary to fully understand the sound power and the adjustments needed to be made can be overwhelming. james |
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Hi
Yes it is very time consuming - can take 100 hours or more per speaker to dial it in and then there are the blind listening tests after the the fact to ensure which 'family of curves' is preferred. james |
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What are the 'Family of Curves"?
The family of curves is made up of amplitude response measurements taken in a sphere around the speaker in an anechoic environment. The performance you hear in your room is a summation of this family of curves in varying degrees of weighting. In the design of each Bryston speaker we begin with anywhere from 120 to 300 measurements depending on the size of the speaker. From there each curve is considered both individually and as groups with particular algorithms applied to each curve in the group and then each group against the whole. From this collection of measurements we published the Bryston Listening Window and Sound Power curves for each product. james PS - I sent Ivan a pic of a sample of this measurement so he can post it. |
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Family of Curves
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Ivan FLORIDA MX136, MC1.2KW(10) MC2KW(2), MCD1100, MS750(2) MVP881, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT-2 SUBS(2) HT3F(2) WS350(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) XCS350(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" MOTORIZED SCREEN, CINEMA-TECH SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES Reference System: ACCUPHASE A300 AMPS, C3900 PRE-AMP, DP1000 CD/SACD TRANSPORT, DC1000 DIGITAL PROCESSOR, DG-68 DIGITAL EQUALIZER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, PS1230 POWER SUPPLY, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WW PLATINUM CABLES CAPE COD MX150, MC501(2) MC1.2KW(10) MC2301(2) MR88, MVP881, MCD1100, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, ESOTERIC K-01X 30th ANNIVERSARY (BLACK) SACD/CD PLAYER, G02-X CLOCK, HT3F(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(4) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) KALEIDESCAPE STRATO & TERRA SERVERS 80-TB, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" SCREEN, SONUS FABER STRADIVARI, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, FORTRESS SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES Analog Rig: CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD, UNIVERSAL ARM w/ Da VINCI' CART, 2nd UNIVERSAL ARM w/ GOLDFINGER STATEMENT CART, HRS-MXR REFERENCE RACK-GLOSS BLACK w/ M3X SHELVES, AESTHETIX RHEA SIG PHONO-PRE, BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, WW PLATINUM CABLES Reference System: BURMESTER 911MK3 AMP(3), 088 PRE-AMP, 089 CD PLAYER, 100 PHONO PRE-AMP, 948 POWER CONDITIONER, ACCUPHASE DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, AVID ACUTUS REFERENCE SP TT, GRAHAM PHANTOM II SUPREME ARM, BENZ MICRO LP-S CART, GRANDIOSO P1X/D1X STACK, G1X RUBIDIUM MASTER CLOCK, N05 NETWORK PLAYER, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, SONUS FABER AIDA SPEAKERS, JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(2) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) WW PLATINUM CABLES Library System: GRANDIOSO M1 MONOBLOCK AMPS, C1 LINESTAGE PRE-AMP, K1X CD/SACD PLAYER, G1 MASTER RUBIDIUM CLOCK, E02 PHONO-PRE, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, AERIAL ACOUSTICS 20T V2, AERIAL SW12 SUBS(2), CANTON REF K1’s, VPI HRX TT w/ SDS POWER SUPPLY, ORTOFON CADENZA BLACK CART, KLAUDIO RCM, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2, SHUNYATA OMEGA QR’s, WW PLATINUM CABLES Esoteric/Bryston System: ESOTERIC C02-X PRE-AMP, P-02X TRANSPORT, D02-X DAC, G02-X CLOCK, BRYSTON 28B3 CUBED MONOBLOCK AMPS(4), BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2(2) EVEREST 8000 POWER CONDITIONER(2) ALTAIRA CG & SG HUBS, AMR-DP777-SE DAC, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, QUADRASPIRE RACK, WW PLATINUM CABLES Accuphase/Canton System: ACCUPHASE E800 INTEGRATED, DP570 CD/SACD PLAYER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, PS530 POWER SUPPLY, CANTON REF K3’s, CANTON REF K5’s, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS MXR REFERENCE MAHOGHANY RACK w/ M3X2 SHELVES, WW GOLD CABLES |
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The First wave of Electronics has arrived.
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Ivan FLORIDA MX136, MC1.2KW(10) MC2KW(2), MCD1100, MS750(2) MVP881, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT-2 SUBS(2) HT3F(2) WS350(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) XCS350(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" MOTORIZED SCREEN, CINEMA-TECH SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES Reference System: ACCUPHASE A300 AMPS, C3900 PRE-AMP, DP1000 CD/SACD TRANSPORT, DC1000 DIGITAL PROCESSOR, DG-68 DIGITAL EQUALIZER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, PS1230 POWER SUPPLY, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WW PLATINUM CABLES CAPE COD MX150, MC501(2) MC1.2KW(10) MC2301(2) MR88, MVP881, MCD1100, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, ESOTERIC K-01X 30th ANNIVERSARY (BLACK) SACD/CD PLAYER, G02-X CLOCK, HT3F(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(4) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) KALEIDESCAPE STRATO & TERRA SERVERS 80-TB, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" SCREEN, SONUS FABER STRADIVARI, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, FORTRESS SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES Analog Rig: CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD, UNIVERSAL ARM w/ Da VINCI' CART, 2nd UNIVERSAL ARM w/ GOLDFINGER STATEMENT CART, HRS-MXR REFERENCE RACK-GLOSS BLACK w/ M3X SHELVES, AESTHETIX RHEA SIG PHONO-PRE, BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, WW PLATINUM CABLES Reference System: BURMESTER 911MK3 AMP(3), 088 PRE-AMP, 089 CD PLAYER, 100 PHONO PRE-AMP, 948 POWER CONDITIONER, ACCUPHASE DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, AVID ACUTUS REFERENCE SP TT, GRAHAM PHANTOM II SUPREME ARM, BENZ MICRO LP-S CART, GRANDIOSO P1X/D1X STACK, G1X RUBIDIUM MASTER CLOCK, N05 NETWORK PLAYER, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, SONUS FABER AIDA SPEAKERS, JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(2) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) WW PLATINUM CABLES Library System: GRANDIOSO M1 MONOBLOCK AMPS, C1 LINESTAGE PRE-AMP, K1X CD/SACD PLAYER, G1 MASTER RUBIDIUM CLOCK, E02 PHONO-PRE, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, AERIAL ACOUSTICS 20T V2, AERIAL SW12 SUBS(2), CANTON REF K1’s, VPI HRX TT w/ SDS POWER SUPPLY, ORTOFON CADENZA BLACK CART, KLAUDIO RCM, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2, SHUNYATA OMEGA QR’s, WW PLATINUM CABLES Esoteric/Bryston System: ESOTERIC C02-X PRE-AMP, P-02X TRANSPORT, D02-X DAC, G02-X CLOCK, BRYSTON 28B3 CUBED MONOBLOCK AMPS(4), BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2(2) EVEREST 8000 POWER CONDITIONER(2) ALTAIRA CG & SG HUBS, AMR-DP777-SE DAC, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, QUADRASPIRE RACK, WW PLATINUM CABLES Accuphase/Canton System: ACCUPHASE E800 INTEGRATED, DP570 CD/SACD PLAYER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, PS530 POWER SUPPLY, CANTON REF K3’s, CANTON REF K5’s, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS MXR REFERENCE MAHOGHANY RACK w/ M3X2 SHELVES, WW GOLD CABLES |
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As Flounder, from Animal House, would say... "OH BOY IS THIS GREAT"!
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VAC Master Line stage on Stillpoint Ultra SS VAC Signature 200iq monos on Stillpoint Ultra SS, MX-150 Parasound JC-1s (3), A-21 Kharma dB11-s Mains, Cremona M (center) Grand Pianos (rears) JL Audio Gotham G213 V1(1) F-112V1(1) F-112V2(1) Clearaudio Innovation Wood, Benz Micro Gullwing SLR Dynavector XX2 MK2 Ortofon Cadenza Bronze Audio Research Ref 2se phono Lumin X1 Lumin S1 Oppo-205 AudioQuest Hurricane HC, Tornado HC(2), and Thunder HC, Diamond RJ/E PS Audio P-10(2) AC-3, AC-5, AC-10 PCs. (6) dedicated 20 amp circuits, (6)Furutech outlets. (1) GDX-DR-NCF, (2) GDX-D Gold, (3) GDX-D Rhodium AZ Absolute Copper, and Clear Day Audio solid silver Bal ICs. WW Gold Eclipse 7 speaker cables. Rob |
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^^^
+1
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David St. Hubbins "I believe virtually everything I read" |
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