The Shindo Experience

[kev313]

Originally Posted by jdandy

Ankkor.......In my opinion, you are correct in your observation. Perfect adjective, too.

This really just makes my observations that much sweeter.

[jdandy]

Originally Posted by kev313

This really just makes my observations that much sweeter.

Kev.......There must be something special about Shindo gear and the "experience". It seems those who buy into the Japanese components and the mystic of ownership all sing the same praise. There is nothing wrong with commitment to a brand that makes you happy. Being firmly entrenched in another camp, I understand completely.

[magoo]

Originally Posted by kev313

I'm very happy that Shindo does have a very very level entry level. I started there with Montille and Aurieges.

$15,000 is my rough guess at the cost of those amps, plus the "correct" cables.....I know this is Audio Aficionado, but entry level?? Good job you have to keep the stock power cord

[kev313]

Originally Posted by magoo

$15,000 is my rough guess at the cost of those amps, plus the "correct" cables.....I know this is Audio Aficionado, but entry level?? Good job you have to keep the stock power cord

Entry level for Shindo. As I said, I'm not a pricing apologist. I wish everything was cheaper too! The fact of the matter is that 15k might be close to the average system cost of a Stereophile reader. I realize in this scenario you still need a source and speakers, pushing a system to maybe 20?

That would not get you the cheapest item of Kondo gear, btw.

I really don't know what else to say except I sympathize with your point. There is a spiral upwards in price in the high end and I don't enjoy it either. Like many many other hobbies though, some things aren't designed to be afforded by anyone.

Damn capitalism.

[kev313]

Originally Posted by magoo

$15,000 is my rough guess at the cost of those amps, plus the "correct" cables.....I know this is Audio Aficionado, but entry level?? Good job you have to keep the stock power cord

One additional point to consider: The volume is low, these items are handmade, the build quality is exquisite as is the sound. In other words, although expensive in an objective (outside the world of high end audio) sense, you get a lot of bang for your high end audio buck.

I made the decision that the price was justified. I don't know where you are on that scale, but I certainly recognize that not everyone needs to agree with the way that I spend my money. Like my wife.

[bart]

Originally Posted by kev313

There is a spiral upwards in price in the high end and I don't enjoy it either. Like many many other hobbies though, some things aren't designed to be afforded by anyone.

Damn capitalism.

Yeah, like when you want to buy a little simple boat nowadays...

[kev313]

Originally Posted by Volks

I respect Shindo as a brand and I have had the chance(3) now to hear diff Shindo systems ... 1 at a Dealer and 2 in a Buddy of a Buddy's system and I can safely say that the Brand/Sound/Image is not for me in the least, but I can understand and respect how some may love and enjoy the sound for sure.........I am glad the brand exists and fills the "Niche" its created.

Truth here. Shindo isn't for all, I'd imagine. Just like Magico, or Mc, or Esoteric, or red meat, or football, or anything, I guess.

To the extent that you suggest that Shindo created this niche (which is not entirely clear...you may not be suggesting this, but you may have if you meant to type "it's". Sorry, trust me I'm definitely NOT the internet grammar police as I'm the prince of typos, just want to address this point if it is, in fact, that which was intended), I would suggest that is not accurate. Shindo fills it nicely, but you'll find many of the low power tube, high efficiency, vinyl crowd here. Very often it will be the same crew who happily scours ebay for vintage transformers, carts, WE components, Klangfilm (hint...switch to ebay.de) and the like.

[Jerome W]

Originally Posted by magoo

I can't help wondering how else you'd form such an opinion other than by listening?

Now before I write anything, let me first say - In the event my numbers ever come up on the Euro lottery, I would be on a plane to LA heading for Pitch Perfect armed with an open mind and a cheque book.

Now for a little bit of Devil's advocate;

This forum taught me that a brand called Shindo exists, and that it's the holistic fusion of one man's idea of how music should be reproduced, less a product and more a chain of interconnected pieces, which *must* all be used together, amps, speakers, cables, TT etc.

All of which is fine - but I already have a system, and like most people I suspect, it's developed and changed over the years as I've learned what does and doesn't work for these ears. So you read about Shindo & you think.....yep, that sounds like the sort of sound you enjoy. Now, according to the oft repeated mantra - there's no point buying say a Monbrison to pair with my Snappers & WW cables, because I simply won't be getting the Shindo experience, unless I spend more cash on power amps, which then wouldn't pair with my little Harbeths....and so on.

The end result is an enormous bill, and a load of hi-fi I would need to sell privately rather than trade in - because I can't even buy these products legally in my country. Second hand is also not an option, as there's absolutely no way I'd part with that kind of cash without any dealer / product support in my country. If my Snappers go bang, I send them to their distributor, they will be fixed, in the UK; it matters not one jot that I bought them second hand from Poland!

Now, it's my guess that if I simply ignored the advice and bought a Shindo pre, inserted it in place of my Cary, I'd actually get a healthy dose of the Shindo magic & would love what I heard. I'd also have a well matched system, powers amps with enough watts & the correct impedance match to my speakers. Heck, I'd even take it's lid off and try out different tubes because to me, that's a part of the fun of valve amps......except that would be akin to heresy too.

Synergy takes many forms, it's sometimes found in unlikely combinations. Buying it top to bottom is certainly one approach, and I have no doubt a full Shindo system is an utter joy to listen to.......but it's not the only way, and while it might be effective, to me it lacks some of the romance of making one's own journey, mistakes and all. As it stands, what you call the Shindo experience is an elusive dream for many of us. It would maybe be better to sometimes be open to simply "what works" in the real world, at present, it rather comes across as a closed shop - unless you can go the whole hog, don't bother. And if you happen to be european, really really don't bother!

As you so rightly said Kev, there are many versions of reality, mine's just a view from over the pond

Excellent post Matt.

But I would clarify one point.
The full Shindo sound / spirit is obtained from Shindo cart to Shindo speakers. No doubt about it.
But how many Shindo users use a full Shindo system ?
A Shindo preamplifier is a great way to have a real taste of Shindo.
My Snappers never singed so good than when driven by my Giscours preamp. And I bet that even the Aurièges would already be exceptional.
If you find a Shindo preamp that you could try in your system, and if you can live without a remote control and a L/R balance, jump !

[kev313]

Originally Posted by Jerome W

Excellent post Matt. But I would clarify one point. The full Shindo sound / spirit is obtained from Shindo cart to Shindo speakers. No doubt about it. But how many Shindo users use a full Shindo system ? A Shindo preamplifier is a great way to have a real taste of Shindo. My Snappers never singed so good than when driven by my Giscours preamp. And I bet that even the Aurièges would already be exceptional. If you find a Shindo preamp that you could try in your system, and if you can live without a remote control and a L/R balance, jump !

Totally agree. I was going to post the same in response to Omodo. But I've always been partial to preamps. I really think that a Shindo pre brings a lot of the magic to any system. Put another way, if I was faced with some financial catastrophe, I'd sell my VR last. Maybe my Aurieges phono. Tough call.

[Alberto]

Originally Posted by magoo

$15,000 is my rough guess at the cost of those amps, plus the "correct" cables.....I know this is Audio Aficionado, but entry level?? Good job you have to keep the stock power cord

Cheap it ain't. But when I look at price I take several things into account:

1) Will I be itching for something else soon, or will this satisfy me for a looooong time. There's a big cost in buy, sell, buy something else, etc.

2) When I sell it, how much of a hit in depreciation am I going to take. How easy is it to sell.

3) How much, how often will I listen to it? Will it make me want to listen more. The more I use it, the lower the cost/hr.

When I take all these things into account, Shindo is a kind of bargain:

1) I've had my Shindo for several years now and no desire to look elsewhere. I am 100% satisfied.

2) If I were to sell it, I can easily get 70-80% of what I paid for them (that was the case with the Auriges and Montille ... though I wish that I hadn't sold them.

3) It makes me want to listen ALL THE TIME and for a really loooong time. Turning it off takes a lot of will power.

No brand is ideal for everyone, but the evidence is that Shindo hits all the right notes (pun intended) for many of us.

Bottom line: when thinking about price, one has to factor in many variables and, in that light, Shindo is for me a kind of a high-end bargain.

Alberto