Front end digital foundation

[kubla36]

Originally Posted by For The Love of Music

Good to hear your efforts were positive.

I have a Cisco one at work, that was in the $1,000’s and was tempted to try this but never did.

eBay is your friend. A 10/100 Cisco 3560 can be had for cheap.

[For The Love of Music]

Originally Posted by kubla36

eBay is your friend. A 10/100 Cisco 3560 can be had for cheap.

Thank you but never tried it, meaning I ended up with the AQVox SE, a switch modified for audio

[Puma Cat]

The Uptone Audio EtherREGEN Ethernet switch is going to be released soon, and I have sneaking suspicion it is going to stomp all over the AQVox and base SOtM Ethernet switches. I've read extensively about its development. For one thing, it will not be passing low-impedance and high-impedance AC leakage currents down the Ethernet cable (btw, shielded Ethernet cables where the shields are not "floating" are particularly bad for this), which wreaks all sorts of havoc on digital bitstreams. Its also going to have a very, very good clock. Alex and John Swenson at Uptone have put a considerable amount of R&D into the EtherREGEN, even down to how the transformers in the switch are wired (or "tapped", in transformer-speak?).

[Puma Cat]

Originally Posted by kubla36

eBay is your friend. A 10/100 Cisco 3560 can be had for cheap.

The problem in "generic"/consumer-grade/IT-type cheap Ethernet switches are 1) they also have cheap (i.e., poor) clocks which are responsible for clock phase noise, 2) they use switch-mode power supplies, which are noisy as all get-out, 3) are not galvanically isolated and 4) said SMPS pass low- and high-impedance leakage currents down Ethernet cables, into network bridges/streamers, and ultimately, DACs, increasing jitter and creating timing problems. Even a fiber-based Ethernet switch will pass clock phase noise from its el-cheapo clock. Come to think of it, 5) they probably suffer from "common noise" problems, as well.

Oh, and the DC cables to the el cheapo SMPS' use cause problems, too, unless they are very short, use a JSSG shield, and are configured in a star-quad configuration using solid copper wire.

[For The Love of Music]

Originally Posted by Puma Cat

The Uptone Audio EtherREGEN Ethernet switch is going to be released soon, and I have sneaking suspicion it is going to stomp all over the AQVox and base SOtM Ethernet switches. I've read extensively about its development. For one thing, it will not be passing low-impedance and high-impedance AC leakage currents down the Ethernet cable (btw, shielded Ethernet cables where the shields are not "floating" are particularly bad for this), which wreaks all sorts of havoc on digital bitstreams. Its also going to have a very, very good clock. Alex and John Swenson at Uptone have put a considerable amount of R&D into the EtherREGEN, even down to how the transformers in the switch are wired (or "tapped", in transformer-speak?).

There are so many variables, I’m not sure anything stomps over anything unless it’s in your setup.

In response to noise, my system is dark, like midnight black. I was complaining about a very faint hum on my Aurender, N10 and I thought I had found it earlier but noticed one of my dimmer switches affects this, it is so subtle I don’t care and I’m compulsive about detail.

Low and high AC impedance leakage may exist, I don’t know. I did try the iFi groundhog for 4/5 days and thought it worked but it actually took away resolution and dynamics. However this may be a solution for others and back to my opening statement of so many variables.

[Puma Cat]

Originally Posted by For The Love of Music

There are so many variables, I’m not sure anything stomps over anything unless it’s in your setup.

In response to noise, my system is dark, like midnight black. I was complaining about a very faint hum on my Aurender, N10 and I thought I had found it earlier but noticed one of my dimmer switches affects this, it is so subtle I don’t care and I’m compulsive about detail.

Low and high AC impedance leakage may exist, I don’t know. I did try the iFi groundhog for 4/5 days and thought it worked but it actually took away resolution and dynamics. However this may be a solution for others and back to my opening statement of so many variables.

There are so many variables, I agree. I think that some of the differences different folks are reporting are due to sometimes slight and sometimes considerable, configuration differences. Take for example your experiences with the iFi Groundhog. Some guys from that computer audio forum are reporting that things got better the more they "grounded everything", some guys experiences were that things were better, as in your case, when a subset of things were "grounded". So, at the end of the day, you go with what works. Personally, I admire your interest in trying things out and experimentation to see what works best for you.

Admittedly, my comment about the forthcoming EtherREGEN might "read" as a bit "emphatic", for the lack of a better term, but having read the extensive information and design criteria that Alex Crespi has described in how he and John Swenson are "pulling out all the stops" on the EtherREGEN, it's quite possible (maybe even likely?) it will raise the bar with respect to audio performance for an "audiophile-grade" Ethernet switches. They've gone through virtually every component of the switch, down to the wiring and number of the isolation transformers in the Ethernet receivers to optimize audio performance. They also created a "moat", much as they did with the LPS-1.2 power supply, separating the power on the "input side" from the "output side" so that low- and high-impedance AC leakage currents cannot cross over to the output side of the switch and be "carried downstream" by the Ethernet cable.

I've personally experienced a number of "breakthrough" products just in the last 2-3 months with respect to my digital front end. Getting the Shunyata Alpha USB cable was an absolute revelation, and completely re-set the bar, in my experience, of what a USB cable could bring to the quality of the musical presentation. Virtually the same thing happened when evaluating the late development versions of the just-released Shunyata Ethernet cables. Even the "entry-level" Venom Ethernet outperformed the Audioquest (incl. Vodka), Wireworld, and Supra Ethernet cables I got in to detemine which Ethernet cable to use for my digital front end. And, as good as those cables were (and they were all quite good), the Venom Ethernet considerably outperformed them in virtually every regard. It wasn't even a contest, in fact.

Then the Sonore OpticalModule arrived, and established a new level of performance for FMCs that is, I would surmise, comparable to the GigaFOIL.
And, as you've very accurately pointed out, the new power supplies and Ghent DC cables are bringing a lot of performance to the table, too.

The way I see it is, "its all good!" Its like all the new amazing new mirrorless digital cameras on the market now: We are "living with an embarassment of riches" these days.

As Hans Beekhuyzen says, "Enjoy the music!"

[For The Love of Music]

Originally Posted by Puma Cat

There are so many variables, I agree. My comment about the forthcoming EtherREGEN might "read" as a bit too "emphatic", for the lack of a better term, but having read the extensive information and design criteria that Alex has described in how he and John Swenson are "pulling out all the stops" on the EtherREGEN, it's quite possible (maybe even likely?) it will raise the bar considerably with respect to audio performance for "audiophile-grade" Ethernet switches.

I get the passion, honestly I do!

My point was made to not confuse people who interpret buying such and such will be a cure when it’s only a part of the process.

Let’s push forward!

[Puma Cat]

Originally Posted by For The Love of Music

I get the passion, honestly I do!

My point was made to not confuse people who interpret buying such and such will be a cure when it’s only a part of the process.

Oh, agree absolutely!

Folks should, whenever possible, get new components, gear, etc., "in for evaluation" in their own systems and own rooms before making purchasing decisions. There are just too many variables at play.

I've been thinking its too bad there isn't an audio equivalent of LenRentals, something like, "AudioRentals". Where folks could "rent stuff in" for a period of time to see what works for them in their own systems, rooms, and configurations. There are so many varaible and different tastes and sensibiltiies, so it would be cool to be able to try stuff out and see where things fit together best. You can do that with cables, but it would be cool to do with other gear, too.

Its all good, though! Soon we'll have three audiophile-grade Ethernet switches avaiable to choose from! More choices means more satisfied and happier customers.

[sid325]

With all the EtherRegen talk now, are you Gigafoil users still liking it? I got sidetracked and never pulled the trigger, but I’m still leaning toward the Gigafoil. Thoughts?

[For The Love of Music]

Originally Posted by sid325

With all the EtherRegen talk now, are you Gigafoil users still liking it? I got sidetracked and never pulled the trigger, but I’m still leaning toward the Gigafoil. Thoughts?

I do not take delivery until sometime January, and will be able to help at that point.