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  #11  
Old 04-26-2018, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Robert_Anderson View Post
Koetsu Black Goldline. I have loved mine for years, and I have over 30 in my collection.
Wow! Over 30 cartridge’s.
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Speakers: Von Schweikert VR-5 Anniversary MK II Front L/R, LCR-35 Center, VR-1 Rear L/R Sub: JL Audio F113
Amps: PS Audio BHK Signature 300 Mono, McIntosh MC207 Pre-Amp PS Audio BHK Signature and Gold Note PH-10 Phono Stage/PSU-10 Power Supply
Turntable: VPI HR-X 12.7 TONEARM (2) and SDS, Stillpoints LPI
Tape Deck Otari 5050B II2
Music Server: Aurender N100H
Cartridges: Ortofon Cadenza Black, Lyra Helikon Mono Digital Source: Oppo UDP-205 DAC: Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE
SSP: Marantz AV8801 Cables: Wireworld Electra 7 (P) Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7, Shunyata Delta NR (I) Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7 (S)
Wireworld Platinum Starlight 7 (USB)
AC Power Regeneration: PS Audio DirectStream P15 Power Plant and Shunyata Denali 6000s V2.
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  #12  
Old 04-26-2018, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Audiophilehi View Post
Wow! Over 30 cartridge’s.
Bob may have misunderstood the question



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MX136, MC1.2KW(10) MC2KW(2), MCD1100, MS750(2) MVP881, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT-2 SUBS(2) HT3F(2) WS350(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) XCS350(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" MOTORIZED SCREEN, CINEMA-TECH SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Reference System: ACCUPHASE A300 AMPS, C3900 PRE-AMP, DP1000 CD/SACD TRANSPORT, DC1000 DIGITAL PROCESSOR, DG-68 DIGITAL EQUALIZER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, PS1230 POWER SUPPLY, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WW PLATINUM CABLES
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MX150, MC501(2) MC1.2KW(10) MC2301(2) MR88, MVP881, MCD1100, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, ESOTERIC K-01X 30th ANNIVERSARY (BLACK) SACD/CD PLAYER, G02-X CLOCK, HT3F(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(4) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) KALEIDESCAPE STRATO & TERRA SERVERS 80-TB, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" SCREEN, SONUS FABER STRADIVARI, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, FORTRESS SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Analog Rig: CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD, UNIVERSAL ARM w/ Da VINCI' CART, 2nd UNIVERSAL ARM w/ GOLDFINGER STATEMENT CART, HRS-MXR REFERENCE RACK-GLOSS BLACK w/ M3X SHELVES, AESTHETIX RHEA SIG PHONO-PRE, BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Reference System: BURMESTER 911MK3 AMP(3), 088 PRE-AMP, 089 CD PLAYER, 100 PHONO PRE-AMP, 948 POWER CONDITIONER, ACCUPHASE DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, AVID ACUTUS REFERENCE SP TT, GRAHAM PHANTOM II SUPREME ARM, BENZ MICRO LP-S CART, GRANDIOSO P1X/D1X STACK, G1X RUBIDIUM MASTER CLOCK, N05 NETWORK PLAYER, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, SONUS FABER AIDA SPEAKERS, JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(2) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) WW PLATINUM CABLES

Library System: GRANDIOSO M1 MONOBLOCK AMPS, C1 LINESTAGE PRE-AMP, K1X CD/SACD PLAYER, G1 MASTER RUBIDIUM CLOCK, E02 PHONO-PRE, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, AERIAL ACOUSTICS 20T V2, AERIAL SW12 SUBS(2), CANTON REF K1’s, VPI HRX TT w/ SDS POWER SUPPLY, ORTOFON CADENZA BLACK CART, KLAUDIO RCM, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2, SHUNYATA OMEGA QR’s, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Esoteric/Bryston System: ESOTERIC C02-X PRE-AMP, P-02X TRANSPORT, D02-X DAC, G02-X CLOCK, BRYSTON 28B3 CUBED MONOBLOCK AMPS(4), BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2(2) EVEREST 8000 POWER CONDITIONER(2) ALTAIRA CG & SG HUBS, AMR-DP777-SE DAC, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, QUADRASPIRE RACK, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Accuphase/Canton System: ACCUPHASE E800 INTEGRATED, DP570 CD/SACD PLAYER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, PS530 POWER SUPPLY, CANTON REF K3’s, CANTON REF K5’s, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS MXR REFERENCE MAHOGHANY RACK w/ M3X2 SHELVES, WW GOLD CABLES
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  #13  
Old 05-05-2018, 05:03 PM
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So below are the specs for my C2500 that I use as a phono stage. Can someone let me know if this is a good match for the Grado Statement v2?

Thanks

Specifications
Frequency Response
+0, -0.5dB from 20Hz to 20,000Hz +0, -3dB from 10Hz to 100,000Hz
Total Harmonic Distortion
0.08% from 20Hz to 20,000Hz
Rated Output (Main)
2.5V Unbalanced, 5V Balanced
Maximum Output
8V RMS Unbalanced, 16V RMS Balanced
Sensitivity (for rated output)
High Level, 450mV unbalanced, 900mV balanced Phono MM, 4.5mV
Phono MC, 0.45mV
Signal To Noise Ratio (A-Weighted)
High Level, 100dB below rated output Phono MM, 75dB below 5mV input Phono MC, 75dB below 0.5mV input
Input Impedance
High Level, 22K ohms unbalanced, 44k ohms bal- anced
Phono MM, 47K ohms; 50 to 750pF, in 50pF steps Phono MC, 25, 50, 100, 200, 400 or 1,000 ohms;
100pF
Maximum Input Signal
High Level, 8V Unbalanced, 16V Balanced Phono MM, 80mV
Phono MC, 8mV
Tone Controls
C2500 Bass and Treble Control Curves
Voltage Gain
High Level to Record Output: 0dB High Level to Main Output: 15dB Phono MM to Record Output: 40dB Phono MC to Record Output: 60dB
Output Impedance
220 ohms
Headphone Impedance
20 ohms to 600 ohms
Digital Input Sample Rates
Optical: 16Bit, 24Bit - 32kHz to 96kHz Coaxial: 16Bit, 24Bit - 32kHz to 96kHz
USB: 16Bit, 24Bit, 32Bit - 32kHz to 192kHz
Power Control and Trigger Output
12VDC, 25mA
+12 +6 dB 0
-6
-12
20
50 100 200
500 1k 2k
Hz
5k 10k 20k
Specifications
29
__________________
Paul

Speakers: Von Schweikert VR-5 Anniversary MK II Front L/R, LCR-35 Center, VR-1 Rear L/R Sub: JL Audio F113
Amps: PS Audio BHK Signature 300 Mono, McIntosh MC207 Pre-Amp PS Audio BHK Signature and Gold Note PH-10 Phono Stage/PSU-10 Power Supply
Turntable: VPI HR-X 12.7 TONEARM (2) and SDS, Stillpoints LPI
Tape Deck Otari 5050B II2
Music Server: Aurender N100H
Cartridges: Ortofon Cadenza Black, Lyra Helikon Mono Digital Source: Oppo UDP-205 DAC: Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE
SSP: Marantz AV8801 Cables: Wireworld Electra 7 (P) Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7, Shunyata Delta NR (I) Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7 (S)
Wireworld Platinum Starlight 7 (USB)
AC Power Regeneration: PS Audio DirectStream P15 Power Plant and Shunyata Denali 6000s V2.
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  #14  
Old 05-05-2018, 08:21 PM
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audio bill audio bill is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiophilehi View Post
So below are the specs for my C2500 that I use as a phono stage. Can someone let me know if this is a good match for the Grado Statement v2?

Thanks

Specifications
Frequency Response
+0, -0.5dB from 20Hz to 20,000Hz +0, -3dB from 10Hz to 100,000Hz
Total Harmonic Distortion
0.08% from 20Hz to 20,000Hz
Rated Output (Main)
2.5V Unbalanced, 5V Balanced
Maximum Output
8V RMS Unbalanced, 16V RMS Balanced
Sensitivity (for rated output)
High Level, 450mV unbalanced, 900mV balanced Phono MM, 4.5mV
Phono MC, 0.45mV
Signal To Noise Ratio (A-Weighted)
High Level, 100dB below rated output Phono MM, 75dB below 5mV input Phono MC, 75dB below 0.5mV input
Input Impedance
High Level, 22K ohms unbalanced, 44k ohms bal- anced
Phono MM, 47K ohms; 50 to 750pF, in 50pF steps Phono MC, 25, 50, 100, 200, 400 or 1,000 ohms;
100pF
Maximum Input Signal
High Level, 8V Unbalanced, 16V Balanced Phono MM, 80mV
Phono MC, 8mV
Tone Controls
C2500 Bass and Treble Control Curves
Voltage Gain
High Level to Record Output: 0dB High Level to Main Output: 15dB Phono MM to Record Output: 40dB Phono MC to Record Output: 60dB
Output Impedance
220 ohms
Headphone Impedance
20 ohms to 600 ohms
Digital Input Sample Rates
Optical: 16Bit, 24Bit - 32kHz to 96kHz Coaxial: 16Bit, 24Bit - 32kHz to 96kHz
USB: 16Bit, 24Bit, 32Bit - 32kHz to 192kHz
Power Control and Trigger Output
12VDC, 25mA
+12 +6 dB 0
-6
-12
20
50 100 200
500 1k 2k
Hz
5k 10k 20k
Specifications
29
I don't have any first hand experience with the C2500 but looking at the specs it doesn't appear that it would be suited for the Grado Statement v2. The Grado with 1.0mV output would require the 60dB of gain provided by the MC section of the phono stage, but its recommended load of 47K is not supported (the MC section of the C2500 maxes out at a 1000 ohm load.) Many MC stages do not support such a high impedance which is not commonly needed with MC carts, but the Grado's MI design requires a relatively high impedance. As a result according to the given specs I don't believe that the cartridge would be a proper match with the C2500 phono section.
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  #15  
Old 05-05-2018, 09:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audio bill View Post
I don't have any first hand experience with the C2500 but looking at the specs it doesn't appear that it would be suited for the Grado Statement v2. The Grado with 1.0mV output would require the 60dB of gain provided by the MC section of the phono stage, but its recommended load of 47K is not supported (the MC section of the C2500 maxes out at a 1000 ohm load.) Many MC stages do not support such a high impedance which is not commonly needed with MC carts, but the Grado's MI design requires a relatively high impedance. As a result according to the given specs I don't believe that the cartridge would be a proper match with the C2500 phono section.
Thanks very much Bill. 👍👍 This is why this forum is so valuable.

Very much appreciated!!
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Paul

Speakers: Von Schweikert VR-5 Anniversary MK II Front L/R, LCR-35 Center, VR-1 Rear L/R Sub: JL Audio F113
Amps: PS Audio BHK Signature 300 Mono, McIntosh MC207 Pre-Amp PS Audio BHK Signature and Gold Note PH-10 Phono Stage/PSU-10 Power Supply
Turntable: VPI HR-X 12.7 TONEARM (2) and SDS, Stillpoints LPI
Tape Deck Otari 5050B II2
Music Server: Aurender N100H
Cartridges: Ortofon Cadenza Black, Lyra Helikon Mono Digital Source: Oppo UDP-205 DAC: Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE
SSP: Marantz AV8801 Cables: Wireworld Electra 7 (P) Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7, Shunyata Delta NR (I) Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7 (S)
Wireworld Platinum Starlight 7 (USB)
AC Power Regeneration: PS Audio DirectStream P15 Power Plant and Shunyata Denali 6000s V2.
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  #16  
Old 05-05-2018, 11:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audio bill View Post
I don't have any first hand experience with the C2500 but looking at the specs it doesn't appear that it would be suited for the Grado Statement v2. The Grado with 1.0mV output would require the 60dB of gain provided by the MC section of the phono stage, but its recommended load of 47K is not supported (the MC section of the C2500 maxes out at a 1000 ohm load.) Many MC stages do not support such a high impedance which is not commonly needed with MC carts, but the Grado's MI design requires a relatively high impedance. As a result according to the given specs I don't believe that the cartridge would be a proper match with the C2500 phono section.
Hi Bill....would it be possible to use the MM input instead of the MC?
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Speakers: Von Schweikert VR-5 Anniversary MK II Front L/R, LCR-35 Center, VR-1 Rear L/R Sub: JL Audio F113
Amps: PS Audio BHK Signature 300 Mono, McIntosh MC207 Pre-Amp PS Audio BHK Signature and Gold Note PH-10 Phono Stage/PSU-10 Power Supply
Turntable: VPI HR-X 12.7 TONEARM (2) and SDS, Stillpoints LPI
Tape Deck Otari 5050B II2
Music Server: Aurender N100H
Cartridges: Ortofon Cadenza Black, Lyra Helikon Mono Digital Source: Oppo UDP-205 DAC: Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE
SSP: Marantz AV8801 Cables: Wireworld Electra 7 (P) Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7, Shunyata Delta NR (I) Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7 (S)
Wireworld Platinum Starlight 7 (USB)
AC Power Regeneration: PS Audio DirectStream P15 Power Plant and Shunyata Denali 6000s V2.
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  #17  
Old 05-06-2018, 08:17 AM
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Paul - While the 47kohm loading would be correct on the MM input I don't think its 40dB of gain would be sufficient. From what I've read on the Grado Statement v2 the suggested gain is in the 54 to 60dB range and therefore generally recommended to use an MC input. It's possible that using the MM input may work in your system even with its 40dB of gain, but it's difficult to predict whether you'd be able to reach desired volume levels without restricted dynamic performance.

If you have the opportunity to try one in your system before purchasing it could be worth a shot but based on the specs I think you'd likely end up having insufficient gain. The Grado's requirement for high gain at a 47kohm load is rather uncommon and has been mentioned in reviews as a potential compatibility issue with many phono stage designs. Wish I could give you a more definitive answer!

Last edited by audio bill; 05-06-2018 at 08:59 AM.
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  #18  
Old 05-06-2018, 08:33 AM
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Default Please Recommend Me a Cartridge

The McIntosh MP1100 is a VERY flexible phono stage. If the budget allows, consider a MP1100. It can accommodate the unusual loading requirement of the Grado Statement v2 and would be a significant performance improvement over the C2500 phono stage and will look perfect in your system.
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Preamp: McIntosh C1100T/C1100C, McIntosh MX180
Amp: McIntosh MC611 (2), MC601 (3), MI254
Digital: McIntosh D1100, McIntosh MCT450, Meridian 808v6, Aurender N20, Aurender ACS10, Oppo 203
Analog: McIntosh MT10, Hana Umami Red
Phono preamp: Simaudio Moon 610LP, 820S
Signal cables: WW Gold Eclipse 7 speaker cables; Shunyata Sigma v2 XLR (2); Sigma v1 XLR (2), Transparent Ref XL (MM2) XLR; WW Silver Eclipse 7 (4)
Digital cables: Shunyata Omega USB, Omega Ethernet, Sigma Ethernet; WW Platinum 7 Coax, AES/EBU
Switch: Innuos PhoenixNet
Power: Audioquest Niagara 7000, Audioquest 5000, Audioquest Dragon, Hurricane PC, Shunyata Alpha HC, AQ NRG Edison outlets, (8) 20 amp dedicated lines, 125 amp subpanel
Speakers: Wilson Sasha DAW, Dynaudio Contour 30, Dynaudio Contour 25C
Subs: REL s/812 (6), REL s/510 (3)
Accessories: HRS M3X2 shelf (MT10), Stillpoints Ultra II v2 w/ bases (21), Ultra SS (12), Mini (12), LPi v1
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  #19  
Old 05-06-2018, 09:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audio bill View Post
Paul - While the 47kohm loading would be correct on the MM input I don't think its 40dB of gain would be sufficient. From what I've read on the Grado Statement v2 the suggested gain is in the 54 to 60dB range and therefore generally recommended to use an MC input. It's possible that using the MM input may work in your system even with its 40dB of gain, but it's difficult to predict whether you'd be able to reach desired volume levels without restricted dynamic performance.

If you have the opportunity to try one in your system before purchasing it could be worth a shot but based on the specs I think you'd likely end up having insufficient gain. The Grado's requirement for high gain at a 47kohm load is rather uncommon and has been mentioned in reviews as a potential compatibility issue with many phono stage designs. Wish I could give you a more definitive answer!
Thanks again Bill. You have been most helpful.
__________________
Paul

Speakers: Von Schweikert VR-5 Anniversary MK II Front L/R, LCR-35 Center, VR-1 Rear L/R Sub: JL Audio F113
Amps: PS Audio BHK Signature 300 Mono, McIntosh MC207 Pre-Amp PS Audio BHK Signature and Gold Note PH-10 Phono Stage/PSU-10 Power Supply
Turntable: VPI HR-X 12.7 TONEARM (2) and SDS, Stillpoints LPI
Tape Deck Otari 5050B II2
Music Server: Aurender N100H
Cartridges: Ortofon Cadenza Black, Lyra Helikon Mono Digital Source: Oppo UDP-205 DAC: Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE
SSP: Marantz AV8801 Cables: Wireworld Electra 7 (P) Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7, Shunyata Delta NR (I) Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7 (S)
Wireworld Platinum Starlight 7 (USB)
AC Power Regeneration: PS Audio DirectStream P15 Power Plant and Shunyata Denali 6000s V2.
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  #20  
Old 05-06-2018, 09:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j3brow View Post
The McIntosh MP1100 is a VERY flexible phono stage. If the budget allows, consider a MP1100. It can accommodate the unusual loading requirement of the Grado Statement v2 and would be a significant performance improvement over the C2500 phono stage and will look perfect in your system.
Sadly the MP1100 is not within my budget at the moment. It is however on my radar.
__________________
Paul

Speakers: Von Schweikert VR-5 Anniversary MK II Front L/R, LCR-35 Center, VR-1 Rear L/R Sub: JL Audio F113
Amps: PS Audio BHK Signature 300 Mono, McIntosh MC207 Pre-Amp PS Audio BHK Signature and Gold Note PH-10 Phono Stage/PSU-10 Power Supply
Turntable: VPI HR-X 12.7 TONEARM (2) and SDS, Stillpoints LPI
Tape Deck Otari 5050B II2
Music Server: Aurender N100H
Cartridges: Ortofon Cadenza Black, Lyra Helikon Mono Digital Source: Oppo UDP-205 DAC: Holo Audio Spring 3 KTE
SSP: Marantz AV8801 Cables: Wireworld Electra 7 (P) Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7, Shunyata Delta NR (I) Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7 (S)
Wireworld Platinum Starlight 7 (USB)
AC Power Regeneration: PS Audio DirectStream P15 Power Plant and Shunyata Denali 6000s V2.
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