Speaker break-in and cable break-in

[Mikado463]

Originally Posted by Amfibius

I think anybody who uses the "audiofools" tag doesn't respect others.

since your refering to me let me state that I did not single you or for that matter anyone else out in the earlier post, rather the group of 'drama queens' that I refer to as 'audiofools'.

As others have said, it's not just the drivers that need to burn in. There are also the electrical parts in the passive crossover and the voice coil.

is not the voice coil part of 'a driver' ?

And yes, some types of speakers, like electrostatics, seem to have an incredibly long burn-in time.

other than hybrid stats which require some time for bass / panel intigration your above quoted statement is false. If you think not please elaborate as why a electrostatic panel requires such a long run-in period.

Having said that, I found that most of the effects of burn-in on new speakers seem to happen in the first 24 hours. If they are unlistenable straight away, after 24 hours they should be 90-95% closer to their actual performance. Upshot - after a good few days of burning in, and if the sound is still unlistenable - these are not the speakers for you. Exceptions apply for "exotic" driver types of course.

ok...........we finally agree on something !

[Freestone]

Originally Posted by Barry1

Agree metaphacts. I have some passive crossover parts in an external box on my Maggies with over 600 hours on them and they're still not totally opened up spacially. I'd call that absurd - at least it's driving me crazy. Of course they're not your garden variety speaker parts (Duelund Cast) and are pretty big values. Currently taking delivery on a cable cooker so I can fully burn them in.

I am fascinated by this...how do you know they "haven't opened up spatially?". And that you could isolate it to a specific component?

Do you compare them to something else, speakers you knew were broken in?

I am also impressed that you can hear it as well.

And I mean the above statements in all sincerity. I don't doubt you at all, just trying to learn

I feel very insecure in my hearing and ability to discern what many others can do. I must react more emotionally perhaps - but I doubt I can everreach that level of discernment. I suppose it's both a great gift and a great curse. Analogy, as I got more educated on wine I couldn't drink the most cheap ones, though I never had the sense of smell that allowed me to appreciate the very finest wine.

[chessman]

Freestone, I do not have "golden ears" either, but I have found that the more you listen the more you hear. Practice really does help, as does exposure to better sound. I have several times hit what I was sure was "as good as it gets" until I heard another system. Hang in there, it will come.

[metaphacts]

Originally Posted by Freestone

I am fascinated by this...how do you know they "haven't opened up spatially?". And that you could isolate it to a specific component?

Do you compare them to something else, speakers you knew were broken in?

I am also impressed that you can hear it as well.

And I mean the above statements in all sincerity. I don't doubt you at all, just trying to learn

Break in, at least for speakers, is not one component and that's the point. The idea that every part in a speaker breaks in at the same rate is absurd. In fact due to that, many speakers get worse in the short-term before they get better. This also depends on what the manufacturer has done to the speaker/components before shipping them.

I am amused at how upset people get over the idea that break in matters. What does it cost? Seriously. I have never, other than during speaker development, broken in parts before listening. Just play em. They change. But it's nothing to worry about. Certainly speaker set up choices are much easier with a fully broken in pair.

[tunes]

I am amused at how upset people get over the idea that break in matters. What does it cost? Seriously. I have never, other than during speaker development, broken in parts before listening. Just play em. They change. But it's nothing to worry about.

+1

Certainly speaker set up choices are much easier with a fully broken in pair.[/QUOTE]

Was wondering about this. Have you found that setup positioning changes much from out of the box to fully broken in?

[Olskool]

Well guys, since I stated this passionate discussion it is fair for me to share with you my progress through break-in. First, before getting in to this, a few months back CMALAK provided me some very good guidance when I asked about references to better understand Audiophile terminology. Most of you old timers to the hobby probably have much of the knowledge imparted by the reference he suggested, "The Complete Guide to High-End Audio (Acoustic Sound Engineering) by Robert Harley (Amazon). There may be others like me who are new to the Audiophile Hobby and would benefit from having a resource to use. If so this resource seems to be thorough and fairly easy to understand for even a novice. It is helping me to standardize into my thinking some of the important aspects of what is heard and expected from the speakers will make it easier to relate to and follow some of the changes they and the system will go through during Break-In. Just as importantly it seems it will help understand what I hear you guys say (which admittedly still makes my eyes cross trying to keep up with).

Due to travel over the holidays and inability to play the system or to set up a loop to have them play continually while gone, the only play has been about 8 hours started right after they were set-up in my space. I just returned home tonight and am listening to them now (Dianna Krall "Girl In The Other Room" on SACD). Even the 8 hours play has made a difference in what is coming from them since their first power up. There is some graininess heard in the cymbals and decay is not nearly as pronounced as in the demo speakers. Dianna Krall seems to be fairly well laid back in her vocals. Mid Range shows good lush features with a hint of more to come. Bass is not as well articulated or nuanced at the moment (one of the things I really liked about the Vienna's was how well they presented and bass subtleties clearly). There is good tonal balance but with a few rough edges still showing overall. Beyond a shadow of doubt they are not horrible at all to listen to, even if just not as lively and detailed as the demo units; YET! It is evident to me that even the journey of listening to not as pretty sounding speakers and watching them blossom is a part of becoming an experienced and knowledgeable audiophile. Thanks for caring from everyone who has commented.

[Ritmo]

Oskool,

Enjoy the journey.

Mike

[Olskool]

Break-in update. About 60 hours on both cables and speakers. The speakers are definitely beginning to open up. They feel more consistent in terms of a balanced tonal performance. The high end is cleaning up and is not nearly as bright as in the beginning. Both the high and mid is showing less graininess. Sibilance is improving with better attack, clarity and improved decay. In the very beginning of break-in the high end was more forward and now seems more laid back. Bass is still somewhat bloated but getting better. I am running most sources using high gain which is different than i needed to do with the demo speakers and cables. The soundstage seems to be developing well too. Using Chesky Records Stereo set-up CD the soundstage was nicely displayed and layering was well defined with a little air showing itself. I think the sound difference between now and having the demo speakers and cables puts them right around 25 to 30 % of the performance heard in demo. I'm a very happy camper..

[Ritmo]

Fantastic! That's what is all about...

Mike

[Mikado463]

Originally Posted by Olskool

I'm a very happy camper..

Life is good, happy ears make a happy man !