Dennis Had Inspire Amps

[o]

Originally Posted by Rosco65

I can attest to two things: Omega speakers are very SET-friendly,.............

If I were in Musica Amamtem's shoes, I would perhaps follow this approach:

1. Keep the triode-wired Inspire amp and Inspire preamp. It is easy to obsess over the SET 45 amp, but I don't think that is where most performance gains are to be had right now.

2. Pick up a pair of Omega Super 3i monitors. They really get you to about 85% of what Omega can get you. The Super Alnico's are nice (I own both) but the Super 3's are quicker and a bit better on the top end. They are also far less expensive and work very well in a small room, particularly in the near field. No one will ever believe that this medium sized bookshelf speaker with a single small driver is making all that sound.

3. Pick up one (or two) Rhythmik servo subwoofers. You could choose the dual 8" which are quicker and allow crossing over as high as 200hz, or the F12G (GR Research paper driver), which is still a lightweight cone. The latter has the advantage of being able to be connected at line level and speaker level. Some people feel that subwoofers integrate better when driven off the speaker output of the main amp, especially tube amps, as is takes on a bit of the character of the main amp.

The Rhythmik subs are also available without enclosures if shipping costs are a concern. The recommended designs are straightforward sealed enclosures that could be easily built locally.

A pair of Omega Super 3i's and a single Rhythmik subwoofer will cost less than the Inspire (DHT) SET amp and will likely bring much more musical enjoyment. I have no doubt the 45 amp is a step up in the right circumstances, but my feeling is right now you would not receive benefit with your existing speakers.

[Musica Amantem]

Originally Posted by pstrisik

Crossovers are not a factor. Most of his speakers are single driver. He has started with a 1.5 way with two drivers. One driver is full range and has no crossover. The other only has a 500hz low pass filter. His single driver Alnicos are 8 ohm 95db, but these 1.5 ways are 4 ohm 99db. I would be going this route if I didn't already have my active two way, two cabinet system from him (with Rythmik woofer and plate amp).

Nice!

Trouble is, they are getting expensive.

You can say that again! 1.5 ways are prohibitively expensive for an Omega speaker. BTW, 99 dB's at 4 ohms is more or less equivalent to 95 dB's at 8 Ohms, so no sensitivity advantage there.


I can relate living in Alaska! What makes your logistics expensive?

Same issue: Distance! No surface shipping overseas anymore in this globalized world! Heavy and bulky items' airfare is prohibitive these days. I live in Panama City, Panama.

This is also a PITA because I cannot sell my legacy systems overseas for the same reason.

[Musica Amantem]

Originally Posted by Rosco65

I can attest to two things: Omega speakers are very SET-friendly, and they sound wonderful with my 421a amp and both my Inspire amps. In contrast to most of the current Tekton speakers, Omega's use purpose-built drivers intended from the outset to be driven by low power amplifiers, most frequently paired with Decware Zen Triode amps (2 wpc) by dealers and long term owners. The current Tektons use prosound drivers that, while sensitive, seem to need a little more juice to get up and go. That is not uncommon: some JBL's and most Tannoy's share this characteristic as well.

If I were in Musica Amamtem's shoes, I would perhaps follow this approach:

1. Keep the triode-wired Inspire amp and Inspire preamp. It is easy to obsess over the SET 45 amp, but I don't think that is where most performance gains are to be had right now.

2. Pick up a pair of Omega Super 3i monitors. They really get you to about 85% of what Omega can get you. The Super Alnico's are nice (I own both) but the Super 3's are quicker and a bit better on the top end. They are also far less expensive and work very well in a small room, particularly in the near field. No one will ever believe that this medium sized bookshelf speaker with a single small driver is making all that sound.

3. Pick up one (or two) Rhythmik servo subwoofers. You could choose the dual 8" which are quicker and allow crossing over as high as 200hz, or the F12G (GR Research paper driver), which is still a lightweight cone. The latter has the advantage of being able to be connected at line level and speaker level. Some people feel that subwoofers integrate better when driven off the speaker output of the main amp, especially tube amps, as is takes on a bit of the character of the main amp.

The Rhythmik subs are also available without enclosures if shipping costs are a concern. The recommended designs are straightforward sealed enclosures that could be easily built locally.

A pair of Omega Super 3i's and a single Rhythmik subwoofer will cost less than the Inspire SET amp and will likely bring much more musical enjoyment. I have no doubt the 45 amp is a step up in the right circumstances, but my feeling is right now you would not receive benefit with your existing speakers.

All valid points and again, I'm not trying to replace my beloved Triode-strapped Inspire KT88 amp or wonderful LP-27a preamp.

Until now I naively thought the sensitivity figures correlated with low power amp capabilities ... Tuns out a 95 dB at 8 Ohms (Omega) is SET friendly and Tekton at 98 dB's is not. Go figure!

I turned down the Omegas Super 3i's or actually the floorstanding Super XRLS 3i and went for the Tekton's because of an expected lack of body to the sound with such a small diameter driver. Fast but lean, was my reasoning. Of couse at the time I did not know the Lore 2.0 would turn out power hungry in spite of their nominal sensitiviity rating. This is no problem at all with my current gear, plenty of power except maybe with 6V6's, but uncapable to adapt to a true SET.

BTW, Tekton's use the Eminence drivers. Any thoughts on the Zu Souls?

Thanks for the pointers!

[FloridaBoy]

Originally Posted by Musica Amantem

Thanks for the information!

All those horn-based alternatives are out of production (vintage). What about new ones like Klipsch Heressy III or even Cornwall III? The idea of having a competent 102+ dB sensitive pair of speakers is appealing if one is interested in exploring the realm of true DHT SET's. Zu Audio's Soul at 99 dB's looks interesting and affordable (somewhat) but what if at the end of the day these turn out not SET friendly either? I know Omegas are not SET friendly as these never go above 95 dB's (even if their crossovers are lenient).

The rest of the ones I've seen in the marketplace are really expensive. The Klipschhorns seem too massive and expensive for my intended application also (new ones are unaffordable whereas vintage require lots of ugrading investments which a neofyte like me would not even know where to start)

Yep, it seems this DHT SET business is taking me nowhere and I'm too old already to start learning a DIY trade. Maybe I should stick to the Beam-Tetrode strapped as a Triode and call it a day. Dennis's stuff sounds wonderful anyway, so I guess I'm just wasting my and your time with these crazy thoughts. Sorry!

BTW, I understand the physics involved in those OB concept statements, but that is not what I had in mind. I need testimonials from real-people having hands-on experience using OB's and recommending (if at all feasible for my application) a current market offer deemed suitable. My Tekton Lore 2.0, (not the other models) are particularly good in my setup, just not SET friendly as much as I thought and I was thinking maybe an OB would improve on these, but seeing their rated sensitivity (in general) there may not be many high sensitivity alternatives around either.

Finally, I may need to concentrate in a wonderful set of subwoofers to replace my aging single Velodyne to assist my gear in yielding better bass and dynamics. Of course, replacing speakers for me is very expensive given logistics costs (about a 50% mark-up over a nominal $1,000 set of speakers, more or less).

I apologize for my ramblings, you have been quite helpful and patient. Thanks!

DHT done right is excellent. But the output tubes are much more $ than pentodes. I'm no longer interested. YMMV

I really don't think you realize how good the Inspire gear you have it yet. No condescension intended.

BTW, Tekton's use the Eminence drivers. Any thoughts on the Zu Souls?

Sometime published specs are a numbers game. My Klipsch H 3's are 99 db on paper. 58hz is the bottom and I don't feel like I need to bother integrating a subwoofer. I have not seen measurements from and independent source. One review says they really lit up with 30 watts. For the past few days I have been using Pope 6V6GT's, CV181 copper base and an 80 rectifier with excellent results. Not at all anemic. Volume never above 10 o'clock. Same amp and pre as yours. I know there are better speakers but I can happily live with what I have.

I've not heard souls so no comment. You may just need to experiment more with tubes and caps. I'd work with what you have a little longer.

I find the Omega's interesting but have not heard them.

[BearCityUSA]

Originally Posted by Musica Amantem

Any thoughts on the Zu Souls? Thanks for the pointers!

I am interested in Zu as well. I have Omega Super 7 mkII monitors, which i really like, in my office. I am dreaming toward another system at the house with some floor standers. I was more thinking toward the Omens. I am a sucker for a good deal and like the comment above about the Omega 3i giving 85% of the Omega experience I have a sense the Omens may give something similar toward the Zu. I would love to hear any thoughts on the Zus in general.

[FloridaBoy]

Originally Posted by Comzee

I'm using the grey bottle, I believe this is their newest production version.



I want to note there is only one official North American dealer Grant Fidelity (to my knowledge and Google searching).
The plus there is they retest the tubes coming in from China. I've read from a good source that the Chinese makers ship all grades of tube to distrubuters, and you don't know if you're actually getting "Grade A" unless the distributor tests it, like Grant.
$50 more expensive than from China direct, so there's that if you're trying to save a buck.

I bought a pair of those on the auction site for $150 from a private seller. They are excellent. The seller bought 4 pairs from Grant for a Cary SLP05. I'm sure he tired of them B4 they settled in. They still needed more hours when I got them.

There are other sellers of the grade A tubes. Ice Lake Audio and h salience are two that I've bought from.

[o]

Originally Posted by FloridaBoy

Sometime published specs are a numbers game.
My Klipsch H 3's are 99 db on paper. 58hz is the bottom and I don't feel like I need to bother integrating a subwoofer.

I found a good deal on a pair of 1981 Heresy's a couple of years back. Didn't expect to like them because (in my limited experience) I hadn't heard a pair of Klipsch that I had liked before. I was pleasantly surprised using my 2 watt set EL84 and while obviously they don't go real deep, I didn't use a sub with them in a 14' x 11' room.

Way too often the published specs are a numbers game.

[Musica Amantem]

Originally Posted by BearCityUSA

I am interested in Zu as well. I have Omega Super 7 mkII monitors, which i really like, in my office. I am dreaming toward another system at the house with some floor standers. I was more thinking toward the Omens. I am a sucker for a good deal and like the comment above about the Omega 3i giving 85% of the Omega experience I have a sense the Omens may give something similar toward the Zu. I would love to hear any thoughts on the Zus in general.

The Super 7 MK II monitors have the larger, 7" drivers. These should have more body to the sound than the 4.5" drivers of the Super 3i's, and yet the "Ferrite" nature of the driver is more mundane, so I did not consider them at all at the time. I was again probably wrong.

My Tekton Lore 2.0's sound wonderful with the right setup. I know these would benefit from more power but in a small listening room and near-field settings, that is not possible. I have all the volume (SPL) I need with the 6L6 and KT88 output tubes.

[Musica Amantem]

Originally Posted by FloridaBoy

DHT done right is excellent. But the output tubes are much more $ than pentodes. I'm no longer interested. YMMV

I really don't think you realize how good the Inspire gear you have it yet. No condescension intended.

BTW, Tekton's use the Eminence drivers. Any thoughts on the Zu Souls?

Sometime published specs are a numbers game. My Klipsch H 3's are 99 db on paper. 58hz is the bottom and I don't feel like I need to bother integrating a subwoofer. I have not seen measurements from and independent source. One review says they really lit up with 30 watts. For the past few days I have been using Pope 6V6GT's, CV181 copper base and an 80 rectifier with excellent results. Not at all anemic. Volume never above 10 o'clock. Same amp and pre as yours. I know there are better speakers but I can happily live with what I have.

I've not heard souls so no comment. You may just need to experiment more with tubes and caps. I'd work with what you have a little longer.

I find the Omega's interesting but have not heard them.

Good points too! Agreed. I understand the alleged CV181 from Psvane are really 6SN7's in disguise, which makes them all the more safe for the Inspire

[Simonatsea]

Originally Posted by Musica Amantem

Thanks for the information! All those horn-based alternatives are out of production (vintage). What about new ones like Klipsch Heressy III or even Cornwall III? The idea of having a competent 102+ dB sensitive pair of speakers is appealing if one is interested in exploring the realm of true DHT SET's. Zu Audio's Soul at 99 dB's looks interesting and affordable (somewhat) but what if at the end of the day these turn out not SET friendly either? I know Omegas are not SET friendly as these never go above 95 dB's (even if their crossovers are lenient). The rest of the ones I've seen in the marketplace are really expensive. The Klipschhorns seem too massive and expensive for my intended application also (new ones are unaffordable whereas vintage require lots of ugrading investments which a neofyte like me would not even know where to start) Yep, it seems this DHT SET business is taking me nowhere and I'm too old already to start learning a DIY trade. Maybe I should stick to the Beam-Tetrode strapped as a Triode and call it a day. Dennis's stuff sounds wonderful anyway, so I guess I'm just wasting my and your time with these crazy thoughts. Sorry! BTW, I understand the physics involved in those OB concept statements, but that is not what I had in mind. I need testimonials from real-people having hands-on experience using OB's and recommending (if at all feasible for my application) a current market offer deemed suitable. My Tekton Lore 2.0, (not the other models) are particularly good in my setup, just not SET friendly as much as I thought and I was thinking maybe an OB would improve on these, but seeing their rated sensitivity (in general) there may not be many high sensitivity alternatives around either. Finally, I may need to concentrate in a wonderful set of subwoofers to replace my aging single Velodyne to assist my gear in yielding better bass and dynamics. Of course, replacing speakers for me is very expensive given logistics costs (about a 50% mark-up over a nominal $1,000 set of speakers, more or less). I apologize for my ramblings, you have been quite helpful and patient. Thanks!

Have you considered the Tekton designs OB? He is offering them at a pretty great deal at the moment $1700 delivered.... Unfortunately my room constraints aren't conducive to these at the moment....