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  #21  
Old 10-30-2018, 08:09 AM
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W9TR W9TR is offline
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A lot has happened in the last 5 years in the DAC world so this should be a fun ride.

There are a lot of folks really liking some of the older ladder-DAC designs based on specific long-out-of-print BurrBrown and Analog Devices parts.

So many options now at every price point, these are the good old days.

Has your DAC arrived?

Tom
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  #22  
Old 10-30-2018, 02:52 PM
decooney decooney is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W9TR View Post
A lot has happened in the last 5 years in the DAC world so this should be a fun ride.

There are a lot of folks really liking some of the older ladder-DAC designs based on specific long-out-of-print BurrBrown and Analog Devices parts.

So many options now at every price point, these are the good old days.

Has your DAC arrived?

Tom
Hey Tom,
Yep, just arrived. opening up tonight gonna let it run in for a little bit.

Last edited by decooney; 10-30-2018 at 09:44 PM.
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  #23  
Old 10-30-2018, 10:22 PM
decooney decooney is offline
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New Benchmark DAC3 B is out of the box, up and running tonight for a 1st listen.

I'M REALLY NOT SURE HOW TO WRAP MY MIND AROUND THIS THING STARTING OUT. I'm coming from an Arcam irDAC with Burr Brown chips set. Former DAC was kinda smooth w/some detail. Now on to this Benchmark. Its really different. Wow, maybe overwhelming.


First impressions hours 1-3: Not sure if I like it or not yet. Brain needs to adjust to this.

Early Pros:
-Larger and wider sound stage right off the bat. The first 10-15 minutes was a bit cold, edgy.
-A bit more forward than I'm use to with my lush tube preamp / tube amp vintage tubes.
-More sound and information coming out all over across the music spectrum.
-Hearing background details and echo sounds more than before forward, mid, back.
-It's almost like there is 15-20% more apparent sound now in comparison. Kinda odd 4 me.
-Break-in? Benchmark said "no break in" yet I hear a different at hour 3-4, a tad smoother.
-I can tend to play it at a lower volume and still hear a lot of detail if low-level listening is important.
-GOOD recordings can really sound great with this DAC. It brings out the good stuff. Can do the same with bad though.

Early Cons:
Can be a little overwhelming at first if you are use to a more laid back smooth sound like I am.
A little too forward at times for me, but this also brings other details I could not hear as much with my prior laid bak DAC.
Fatigue. I had it up a the same volume as I normally play. Wife complained it was "too loud". Maybe too forward, more detail, edgy at times.
My Dog barks more. It's as if he hears new stuff and background noises going on now, and runs outside looking for something. Kinda funny.
-BAD recordings still sound bad, harsh. No masking going on here like a smooth tube amp can do. This DAC brings out the bad stuff too.

Mid to Highs:
Definitely more open and transparent top-end 25% of range. Makes it more forward though.

Bass:
Seems tighter and faster. Lows go low, but I don't notice it going as low as before now that upper mid bass is more present, tighter, faster than before...for whatever reason.

Guitars:
I tend to focus on the sound of guitars and different tracks. I play some older 80s/90s music that was not recorded as well (on purpose). Also, tried a few newer songs where i'm use to the sound of a particular guitar and player and can say one thing for sure, this DAC gets guitars RIGHT. Was not expecting that.

Pianos:
Sounds pretty natural. Better than my last two DACs. Definitely hearing better tone with guitars and pianos, or maybe I just key in on these things.

Voices:
More tone and gravel to voices comes through for sure. Perhaps this is because the overall sound is more transparent, i don't know.


Initial impressions 1st night:
For the first 15-30 minutes I felt as if I would be sending it back quickly. While my tube preamp and tube amplifier was already warmed up I gave this DAC a chance to run now for 4 hours solid. Now going into the 5th hour all the sudden it's as if its starting to smooth out a little (opposite of what the Benchmark Tec said), he told me there was "no break-in required". Not sure why, its not my ears, it's starting to grow on me a little now after more time on it the first night.
The part that is playing tricks on my brain is how more overall sound seems to be present, it makes it seem as if the sound is a little more forward, yet if I listen closely, I can still hear stuff going on in the background too.

There is no discernible signature to the sound. its as if I can hear everything now. Different.

It's almost as if it's TOO PERFECT if there is such a thing.

Closing Thoughts 1st night:
I am using my softer sounding interconnects and speaker cables too. No way i'd want to use my more transparent cables, it would be too much, too detailed. I'm more use to a smoother "polite sound" with my tube amps. With this new Benchmark DAC3 B, it's a tad closer to my former solid state sound or maybe about half way between my former SS amps and my tube gear I'm running now. Very interesting. Had no idea a DAC change could change the sound that much. Better, not sure, different, yes, engaging, yes. Smooth, sort of, getting better with more burn in time on the DAC, not sure why.

QUESTION:
I'm wondering IF this new Benchmark Dac will smooth out even more with more break-in time (opposite of what the Benchmark Tec told me) This week I found two guys had this Bemchmark, kept their other dacs and this one too, maybe i see why. I'm running through all of my music hearing new subtle details with every song.

Last edited by decooney; 10-30-2018 at 11:45 PM.
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  #24  
Old 10-31-2018, 09:21 AM
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Excellent first impressions and review. I’d give it a few days of break-in for the edginess to recede, irrespective of what Benchmark says.
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Main System:
Amati Futura Mains
Amati Homage VOX Center,
Proac Response 1sc Rears,
Three MC2301's for L,C,R
MC 602 for the rears
C 1100, MX 151, MCD 1100, MR 80
Nottingham Dais with Wave Mechanic
Sumiko Palo Santos Presentation

SurfacePro 3, RPi 4, ROON, WW Starlight Platinum USB, Schiit Yggdrasil, Benchmark DAC3 HGC

MX 151, OppO BDP-95, JVC RS-500 DILA projector, 106" diagonal Stewart Luxus Screenwall Deluxe with Studiotek 130 G3 material.

Lake House:
Ohm F, MC 275V, C2300, MR 77, Rega P3

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  #25  
Old 10-31-2018, 10:06 AM
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Most interested in your results. The DAC3 B is high on my list for a "DAC-only" DAC.
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  #26  
Old 10-31-2018, 11:59 AM
decooney decooney is offline
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UPDATE#2, Day2 with Benchmark DAC3 B -


The DAC3 B is extremely open and transparent. Amazingly so. All else is good, but now I’m focusing on what is/not there with midrange and a bit of a lack of midrange warmth I’m normally use to hearing with all of my other sources. Trying to figure out why, is it just me.

-Bass: Suepr fast, tight, clean. Amazingly accurate. No bass bloom as a result. No bass signature otherwise.
-Highs: Amazingly smooth, clean, open. Very-Very-Very transparent. Never heard more open or smoother highs before. No discernible signature otherwise.
-Midrange: nice, clean, super flat. Lacking some midrange warmth IMO. The midrange is there, but lacking vibrance so far with this brand new DAC.

Note: I’m using Cardas Golden Cross RCA interconnects. One of the smoothest and warmest RCA interconnect cables Cardas ever produced. What’s strange is I do not notice the cables as much now. I'm super familiar with swapping these cables in over the years to tone down certain details on some bright components. What keeps me interested right now in this new DAC3 B is the rest of the spectrum (excluding a lack of midrange warmth) is the fact that everything else comes through, amazingly so. It’s really interesting. It's as if i'm having to adjust my own thoughts of what it should sound like.

CONFIRMED:
If you like super open, super transparent, added depth, but don’t mind a little forward sound now too, this DAC3 B unit covers all of that and then some.

Hmmm, however I'm scratching my brain with a new question going on inside my head now as I let this thing burn in some more. Maybe a tad smoother Day2.

Do I need to re-learn how to listen to my music all over again because now I’m hearing it the way it’s suppose to be? (flat, clean, open, transparent, detailed, now lacking some lush warmth?)

Oh, one last thing... on some recordings voices come through like never before. It's all there, some times it feels like it's "too much" voice if that does not sound crazy. I'd like to see voices set back just a tad more. Right now it's a little more "in your face" on some voice tracks where the voice is really well recorded.

Again, is this how it's supposed to be?

Last edited by decooney; 10-31-2018 at 12:25 PM.
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  #27  
Old 10-31-2018, 12:26 PM
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The DAC3 B is extremely open and transparent. Amazingly so. All else is good, but now I’m focusing on what is/not there with midrange and a bit of a lack of midrange warmth I’m normally use to hearing with all of my other sources. Trying to figure out why, is it just me.

Perhaps try a warmer input tube?
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  #28  
Old 10-31-2018, 12:32 PM
decooney decooney is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FloridaBoy View Post
The DAC3 B is extremely open and transparent. Amazingly so. All else is good, but now I’m focusing on what is/not there with midrange and a bit of a lack of midrange warmth I’m normally use to hearing with all of my other sources. Trying to figure out why, is it just me.

Perhaps try a warmer input tube?
Hey Florida Boy,

It's only sources via this new DAC that sound a tad too forward for me. All else is great. However, I like your idea. Right now my SLP98 pre is running my prized 1960s Sylvania 6SN7 Black plates, matched quad set. My V12R amp is running 1960s Sylvania EL84s and Sylvana 12BZ7 inputs in front. I do have one set of RCA EL84s I could try.

Any recommendations on a more laid back set up front for pre or amp?
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  #29  
Old 10-31-2018, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by decooney View Post
Hey Florida Boy,

It's only sources via this new DAC that sound a tad too forward for me. All else is great. However, I like your idea. Right now my SLP98 pre is running my prized 1960s Sylvania 6SN7 Black plates, matched quad set. My V12R amp is running 1960s Sylvania EL84s and Sylvana 12BZ7 inputs in front. I do have one set of RCA EL84s I could try.

Any recommendations on a more laid back set up front for pre or amp?
RCAs are pretty laid back, and I've found National Unions to be pretty good at the mids. Of course vintage Tung Sols are amazing and IME the best of the SN7 type tubes, but everyone knows that and thus they are very expensive.
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  #30  
Old 10-31-2018, 03:10 PM
decooney decooney is offline
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Quote:
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RCAs are pretty laid back, and I've found National Unions to be pretty good at the mids. Of course vintage Tung Sols are amazing and IME the best of the SN7 type tubes, but everyone knows that and thus they are very expensive.
I’ve tried all of these including TS SN7s. A buddy has a huge collection and demos. My NoS Sylvanias are truly one of the more open and transparent in my preamp.

Maybe that was good with my old DAC but maybe not such a great synergy with this new Benchmark DAC. Not sure I want to change out my Sylvanias. They do command good money on FleaBay though. Hmmm.

Will have to consider A) other front end tubes or B) other DAC. Thx.
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