What are your goals with this hobby?

[cleeds]

Originally Posted by PHC1

Cleeds, If you have something interesting to contribute, a scientific link to challenge something I have said, (I usually try to present the sources of my point of view if applicable/possible) you are welcome to do so.

Thank you so much. I am pleased that you welcome my participation. I have already provided some background and personal experiences with scientifically controlled, double-blind testing posted here. In that post, I clearly explained why the exercise cited (not by you) was uncontrolled and, therefore, unscientific. And I shared some personal results with genuine scientific testing.

I have a sincere interest in such scientific testing - even as I believe they are not infallible - and I think it's fair to distinguish between a blind test that controls for all possible variables and the sort of blind testing you recalled, which failed to control for multiple biases.

Originally Posted by PHC1

Otherwise please stop trolling for the sake of arguing.

That someone might disagree with you or point out a logical error does not make them a troll.

Originally Posted by PHC1

If you do not believe in blind, double blind, other statistical studies of which I have provided many as it applies to audio/listening/discerning sounds/file resolution sensitivity, etc.., that's completely your choice. Do as you like and believe what you like.

Again, thank you so much. Blind tests are an interesting aspect of audioland and as long as they remain a topic of conversation here, it's possible I'll respond again.

[bart]

Originally Posted by George Prentice

Thank you for sharing. Sounds like you are the social version of myself and my partner. She and I are very private and are quite happy... well enjoying being at home for the pandemic.

This is a little of a rehash. But it is helping me articulate what I learned and the process of how I got to where I am. I am constantly delighted with how well my current system sounds with all music types. It has definitely not always been that way. That was a problem I struggled with for a long time.

Talking about this has been illuminating. I realized that a problem I had in my early search for bettering my system was I had no empirical ruler with which to compare components and systems. I had ribbon speakers which made some of my electronic and recordings with only an instrument or two with a well defined sound space really magical. So, I carried with me a few test disks of that type. I was trying to optimize the magic of a very specific set of parameters. After a while I realized doing this was detrimental to other forms of music. One day I woke up to this. So I changed the mix I was using to a variety of music. This was difficult, one album would sound better to the detriment of the others. But I did my best.

I traveled a lot for business and would end up in concerts and we used to go to jazz concerts and occasionally classical. I tried to learn from these and take home memories of the sound and it was helpful. But how to optimize my system to sound the best for all music wasn't a problem I really understood how to solve.

We started going to classical concerts for enjoyment. Not for comparison with my home system. But it had a that effect on my system choices because I heard it all the time. Week after week, month after month... concert home, concert then home. The influence has been staggeringly good for me and my system. Over the last few years I realized why. If you optimize your system to reproduce only unamplified music this can help you zero in on the solution that screws up as few types of music possible because you are zeroing in on accurate sound reproduction. It is too hard to figure out how to individually sample and optimize electronic, jazz, rock, world, hip hop, and classical. So many music types are dependent on things you cannot know (like electronic... you'd have to have the original artist and the equipment upon which they created it). But classical... has every aspect... softest to loudest, individual to massed instruments, triangles to heavy drums, stringed instruments. So, if you optimize for classical it is the easiest way to have your system really good way to reproduce everything without the analysis mess of individual optimization. For a few weeks I worked on determining how to have the right volume level... one of the many parameters. One concert had a couple pieces of music that started from the very softest start... an oboe or something from the absolute limit of hearing to crescendos that literally overload your ears. So, I realized that for many pieces there is a "correct volume". Anyway, there is so much to learn from live classical... others also. But classical has it all.

Looking back, I think I remember someone from The Absolute Sound a long time ago saying something about classical being the best measure... so what I am saying not new, but my own rediscovery of the value of this approach. While I have been writing this I have been listening to electronic music and just blown away by the richness and depth of the recording. It has been a really long journey to get here. I am really enjoying it.

George, I agree. Classical (and some acoustic jazz) is the best way to evaluate a system, especially when you are familiar with the concert hall where the music was recorded.

We also enjoy the calm moments now - our life was too hectic anyway - but we do miss the live concerts.

[jimtranr]

Originally Posted by bart

George, I agree. Classical (and some acoustic jazz) is the best way to evaluate a system, especially when you are familiar with the concert hall where the music was recorded.

Agreed. In addition, one set of tools I've found useful in evaluating a system is this pair of classical demonstration CDs Delos released in the late 1980s/early 1990s. Their contents consist of whole movements of orchestral compositions recorded by the Delos team.



What makes them particularly useful is the detailed information written about each track by Delos recording director John Eargle in the program booklet included with each CD. Eargle describes the recording environment, the challenges a given composition (e.g., its dynamic range) and/or the venue presents (does plastic sheeting have to be placed over the first rows of audience seats to render a more "live" presentation?), and related considerations. In some cases, he includes a diagram of the performing ensemble's placement and a discussion of mike placement, so the listener has some reference points against which to check what he/she is hearing from the audio system.

[George Prentice]

Originally Posted by jimtranr

Agreed. In addition, one set of tools I've found useful in evaluating a system is this pair of classical demonstration CDs Delos released in the late 1980s/early 1990s. Their contents consist of whole movements of orchestral compositions recorded by the Delos team. .

Cool, thanks. They look useful! Just ordered them.

[Parabellum]

I have no goals. I just like to discover new things about how to improve the musical experience at home. I like the amazement it provides to rediscover my music after a component change and/or tweak. Ever since I was 8 or 9 years old, I was always attracted to sound systems and knew I would like to have one, one day.

[Charles]

I have to say that Serge is an excellent thread starter. Why hasn't someone asked this question? It has made me think.

I think subconsciously it was to attempt to have a reference system built around a fine speaker. I began with Bozak's, DQ10's, Magtneplanars, Thiel CS5i, Genesis II's, Mac XRT30's, Maxx3's, Alexxes, finally an XVX.

I have a system I am satisfied with. My goal was to attain to a reference system whose sound I really liked. I enjoy music a lot, all types. A really nice system you can enjoy day or night and requires little maintenance. If I have a spare hour upstairs I go. It's there waiting for me

I agree with many of Serge's assertions. Then why do I have expensive cables, cords, IC's, power conditioners, etc.?? I never said I was rational about this hobby. I simply enjoy having the neat gear, reading reviews, exchanging ideas, looking stuff up on the internet, reading about new upcoming exciting gear, looking at folks' systems on AA and thinking I'd really like to hear it and how beautiful it is, looking for ways to improve my sound. I'm still a little bit of a kid when it comes to this hobby. Hope I stay that way.

I wish many could read this thread. Excellent thoughts including Cleeds'.

Best

Charles

p.s. my little boy ears heard something special with my dad's Concert Grands that I was never quite able to match until the XVX. It took about 50 years.

[Formerly YB-2]

Originally Posted by George Prentice

.......... and are quite happy... well enjoying being at home for the pandemic.

Very much so. We've even discovered that we not only enjoy each other's company but that we actually like each other.
That said, we sorely miss travel and are ready to "get going" again. Reservations made for May and 'fingers crossed' for good luck (to us all).
In the meantime, enjoy the music.

[PHC1]

Originally Posted by Parabellum

I have no goals. I just like to discover new things about how to improve the musical experience at home. I like the amazement it provides to rediscover my music after a component change and/or tweak. Ever since I was 8 or 9 years old, I was always attracted to sound systems and knew I would like to have one, one day.

Serge, I was spinning vinyl unsupervised on my father's record player and listening to all my parent's favorite music as well as a few kids records/stories at the age of 6. My father taught me how to use the record player and to be careful with the stylus.

I still love all the singers my parents were into when they were in their late 20's and early 30's I heard when I was just a boy.

My father also used to have a "shortwave" German Grundig Radio that was his pride and joy. He would listen to stations from half around the world as if it was the window into the free world... I often sat and admired the radio proudly displayed on the table as my father would be "tuning" into various stations with the knobs.

So yes, no doubt audio has touched many audiophiles in one way or another and stuck from the early age, even if subconsciously.

[PHC1]

Originally Posted by Charles

I have to say that Serge is an excellent thread starter. Why hasn't someone asked this question? It has made me think.

I think subconsciously it was to attempt to have a reference system built around a fine speaker. I began with Bozak's, DQ10's, Magtneplanars, Thiel CS5i, Genesis II's, Mac XRT30's, Maxx3's, Alexxes, finally an XVX.

I have a system I am satisfied with. My goal was to attain to a reference system whose sound I really liked. I enjoy music a lot, all types. A really nice system you can enjoy day or night and requires little maintenance. If I have a spare hour upstairs I go. It's there waiting for me

I agree with many of Serge's assertions. Then why do I have expensive cables, cords, IC's, power conditioners, etc.?? I never said I was rational about this hobby. I simply enjoy having the neat gear, reading reviews, exchanging ideas, looking stuff up on the internet, reading about new upcoming exciting gear, looking at folks' systems on AA and thinking I'd really like to hear it and how beautiful it is, looking for ways to improve my sound. I'm still a little bit of a kid when it comes to this hobby. Hope I stay that way.

I wish many could read this thread. Excellent thoughts including Cleeds'.

Best

Charles

p.s. my little boy ears heard something special with my dad's Concert Grands that I was never quite able to match until the XVX. It took about 50 years.

Charles, thanks, I do like to share my thoughts on this common hobby of ours and perhaps sometimes even overanalyze and overthink things. Hobbies are primarily for the soul and the inner boy indeed. Logic very often contradicts and interjects causing conflicts...

I will be sharing less of my "let's analyze the logical part of this hobby" from now on. There is very little to gain from it and it obviously only causes negative emotions.

There is no convincing an audiophile of anything anymore as there is a hope to convince anyone involved with any other hobby, whatever it may be. Ask a stamp collector why he has so many little paper stamps that he spent a fortune on over the decades.... It is for the soul.

So having a plan or not having a plan and just enjoying the hobby and music day by day is probably the best escape from the everyday life we have and our little slice of heaven on Earth.

You have assembled quite an impressive system Charles and I am glad to hear you are very happy with it and that it brings you so much pleasure!

Enjoy.

[Charles]

Serge, again I think you hit the nail on its head. I remember all those many years when I was about 11 or 12 hearing my dad's first system decked out on our, of all places, dinning room table: Allied Knight 20 watt integrated; Callero changer; Pickering cartridge; Wharfedale sand filled bookshelf sealed speakers. The record was South Pacific. I was hooked. There is some logic to the high end but not much. Music is emotional. From then on I was fascinated with audio gear, especially Mac. Maybe its genetic. Who knows.

Best

Charles