Do I need a preamp?

[Still-One]

Originally Posted by Gaucho1

I'm considering making some changes to my system. I no longer use a turntable. I just don't have the patience for it. The Mac Mini is the primary source of audio and video, wether I am watching iTunes, Hulu, or Netflix or streaming Pure Music or MOG. I feel in the future I will primarily purchase some cd's or SACDs and stream more. Do I need a preamp?

I really like the set up I have now, but as usual, it's time for a change. I'm considering trading the C500t and the MC501s for a MCD1100 and a pair of 601s. I'd sell the qb9 as well. I realize Mc has to release the update for the 24/192 USB input.

I've read the reviews, and I've seen the commentary about preferring the preamp in chain instead of coming directly out of the preamp. It seems to me the improvement in amplification and the simplicity of having 2 fewer components will even out the differences.

Will I regret it?

I will get superior SACD, additional digital inputs, and a single box.
I will lose the tube preamp sound and the ability to add additional components.

What do you think?

This is an interesting question that has been asked several times. The general consensus on this Forum is that a good pre-amp can have a positive impact on your system. There has been a lot of talk lately that some of the newer CD players handle the pre-amp function very nicely without many of the deleterious effects of digital volume controls. I have not actually tried the MCD-1100 direct into my Momentum's so I can't say how well the MCD-1100 handles the job. When I tired going direct in other iterations of my set-up I found that any minimal loss in speed and dynamics running the system with a pre was offset by additional micro dynamics, better control of volume adjustments and the ability to connect analog devices if needed.

I will say that unless you were to retain the capability to A/B your system with and without a pre-amp, you would not be able to tell you were not missing something.

If I was you and no longer had any desire for analog, I would go with the 601's and MCD-1100. I think you would be very happy.

Jim

[trponhunter]

mcd1100 direct to the 601's is a great idea based on what you said. The pre amp would have to be really, really good to sound better than going direct from the mcd1100's variable outputs.

[Supercronopio]

Thanks everyone for the aditional comments. My AD will be able to let me demo aMCD1100/601/Cremona combo I think, so I will try it out and see what I think. In the meantime, here's a little more background on my system:

The C500T I have replaced a C220, and at the time I thought that the C500T was certainly a justifiction for a top of the line Preamp in any system. It brought the performance level of all my sources up dramatically. So I am a believer in preamps and the importance of having one in the system. However, as digital sources become more prevelant and the computer as a source for audio and video becomes my standard, I feel that a system with only digital inputs is eventually where I will end up.

I guess it comes down to wether the upgrade to a top of the line SACD player/DAC and McIntosh's latest and greatest mono block amp will make me as happy as I am with my current system. The C500T is amazing. The question is do I need it or could I use its current value to add a superior source to the system.

Mike

[Whart]

I found it necessary to add a line stage (Lamm Reference, which is sort of a 'reverse' hybrid, SS signal path, tube power supply) to the Manley Steelhead when I first set up the current system about 6 years ago. Somehow,even though everything was 'there' sonically, running direct from the Steelhead, it seemed a little threadbare (even with quality NOS tubes).
Over this past weekend, I started to experience dreaded 60hz hum in the system, something I had successfully eliminated a long time ago (horn speakers really make this challenging). Anyway, I finally isolated the problem to the Lamm linestage, which now will go back to Vlad for a few shots of vodka and his ministrations.
This put me back to where i was several years ago. Running the Steelhead straight in was great 'hi fi,' but it lacked a certain heft and palpability tonally that the Lamm linestage seemed to add to the proceedings. Now, this may be a euphonic distortion, I don't know- you'd think less in the chain would be better; but, i do spend an awful lot of time hearing live music and with the linestage i believe i am closer than without it.
(I also experiemented once again, with the MM vs step-up transformers on the Steelhead, and once again, liked the MM better for my Airtight PC 1. The step-ups, with 100 ohm loading, sounded great in the midrange, but there was no deep bass and loading down the cartridge more seemed to darken it. By contrast, the MM with the NOS tubes, sounded more glorious, with the above caveat that it still sounded a little 'hi-fi-ish' to my ears without the Lamm in the chain).

[bzr]

Originally Posted by Gaucho1

Thanks everyone for the aditional comments. My AD will be able to let me demo aMCD1100/601/Cremona combo I think, so I will try it out and see what I think. In the meantime, here's a little more background on my system:

The C500T I have replaced a C220, and at the time I thought that the C500T was certainly a justifiction for a top of the line Preamp in any system. It brought the performance level of all my sources up dramatically. So I am a believer in preamps and the importance of having one in the system. However, as digital sources become more prevelant and the computer as a source for audio and video becomes my standard, I feel that a system with only digital inputs is eventually where I will end up.

I guess it comes down to wether the upgrade to a top of the line SACD player/DAC and McIntosh's latest and greatest mono block amp will make me as happy as I am with my current system. The C500T is amazing. The question is do I need it or could I use its current value to add a superior source to the system.

Mike

Hey Mike, your question is exactly why I've ended up with the digital front end that I now have. The preamp I have now is the last thing in my system that I would even consider taking out as I consider it to be the best component in the chain, a very truthful to the source one at that. Then I auditioned the MSB, being digital I was wary but have found it has ample reserves for preamp duty. I really like the P7 in my system, in sound & looks as well, unfortunately for it but not me, it has been bested.

[o0OBillO0o]

So this has gone from:

1. no pre-amp!

2. Pre amps make everything better

3. Here lets talk about bad @ss pre-amps!



I really like the idea of using the Mac as the 'pre-amp' there is a huge market in the pro audio industry that provides AD/DA conversion.

LPs could still be incorporated.

Pure Music even has it's own built-in filters. In practice one could use a 4-6 channel output device (AD/DA) and filter each input. Just like a crossover. To include time delay (really time align) Then connect directly to a combo of 2, 4, 6 channel amps. Then either bypass the internal crossovers or just split highs/lows.

Would be a real treat. With lots of flexibility.

[alvarop]

very interesting read,,,thank u