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Old 03-28-2019, 03:55 AM
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Default Anyone Running Fiber to their Streamer or Network Bridge?

ADVISORY: Long article follows...

I've been seeing a number of references to using fiber to stream digital music files from a music server, Roon Core, etc. to a DAC via a "streamer" or network bridge lately. One source is that Sonore, makers of the giant-killer microRendu streamer, is in the process of developing an Optical Rendu, which, rather than accepting an Ethernet input, will accept an "Optical Ethernet' input, which I presume to be a fiber data cable.

Another is an article I came across by Michael Lavorgna at AudioStream talking about the advantages of converting an ethernet cable-mediated audio file stream to fiber and back to Ethernet for connection to a network bridge: https://www.audiostream.com/content/...etworked-audio

Before I go further, let me provide some background as to why I'm looking into this: My Sonore microRendu, like many network bridges, mandatorily requires an Ethernet connection from a network-connected router to work. Technically the Sonore's router can receive the music files via Wifi or Ethernet. Back when I first got my Sonore microRendu, I was using the Mac Mini in my bedroom running Roon Core to transmit digital files via Wifi to (1) originally an Apple Airport Express, then 2) then a TP-Link Wifi Extender. The network extender was in the audio rack plugged into the Shunyata Triton, and connected to the Rendu via the extender's RJ45 jack & an Ethernet cable. This worked okay, except that the local, very aggressive Verizon Wifi in my neighborhood would frequently "take over" my own home Wifi network and knock the Mini, or the Sonore, off its own network. I solved this by connecting my Mac Mini directly to the ATT Wifi router in my bedroom with an ethernet cable and turning off the Mini's Wifi. This protocol worked pretty well until I added a Ring video doorbell to the TP-Link Wifi Extender's network. Even with the Ring doorbell on the TP-Link's network with a unique SSID, I was then constantly experiencing streaming dropouts with Roon, which got so bad it became completely exasperating trying to stream music. I recently determined that the dropouts correlated with motion alerts from the Ring doorbell (whether that was the CAUSE remains to be determined; remember that CORRELATION is not necessarily CAUSATION).

Moreover, I remember reading a tech support post by Sonore stating that the best streaming performance was obtained by directly connecting the Roon Core's router to the Sonore via Ethernet, and not using Wifi.

This was going to be a problem, as the Mac Mini Roon Core was in another part of the house, and no way was I going to run a very long Ethernet cable through the house, or pay big bucks to have an electrician pull Ethernet through the walls to be able directly connect the Roon Core to the Sonore via Ethernet.

What to do?

I also recently heard about Ethernet over Power adapters, which let you run Ethernet over the AC wiring in your house. I did some research and ordered up a pair of TP-Link Powerline Adapter AV2000 Ethernet over Power adapters for $88/pair. I connected an ethernet cable from the main router in the bedroom to to one of the EoP adapters and plugged it into an AC receptacble behind the desk. In the main room, I found a wall receptacle that was not on the same AC circuit as the Shunyata Triton powering all the audio gear so as to keep things as quiet as possible. I installed a cheap $7 8-meter Cat 7 Ethernet cable from EoP adapter in the main room to the Sonore, and et voilà! I have not experienced a single dropout at all in weeks, and the Sonore sounded better than ever. That is, until I installed the Shunyata Alpha USB cable last night, which took the digital audio playback to another, MUCH higher, plane altogether (see my post about it in the Shunyata forum).

So, coming back to the whole fiber thang....the article by Michael Lavorgna referenced above said that installing even a short section of fiber between the Ethernet run notably reduces noise in the bitstream, as the fiber, being optical, only carries the digital audio data stream with NO noise. All you need to do is install two TP-Link MC200CM Gigabit Ethernet 1000Mbps RJ45 to 1000M Multi-Mode SC Fiber Media Converters connected via a fiber data cable.

Plug in your Ethernet cable at each end (the source at one end and the network bridge at the other end), and you're good to go!

So, I found two used TP-Link MC200CMs on that auction site for $25/ea and had them shipped out. Ordered a Tripp-Lite fiber cable and everything should be here by Saturday.

Here's a diagram of my planned fiber set-up...


One of the nice things about this setup is it will let me try out different Ethernet cables connected to the last fiber media converter, and see if they make any difference in audio quality...some folks say "No way" as Ethernet only carries binary TCP/IP packet data, not Isochronous USB audio data (where timing, noise, jitter, galvanic isolation, etc. are very important). Other folks (e.g., Michael Lavorgna at AudioStream) state that different Ethernet cables make a considerable difference in audio quality.

So, we shall see!

Stay tuned....
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Lumin P1 streamer/DAC/preamp, Constellation Inspiration integrated TT: Michell Gyro SE MkII, SME V, Koetsu Urushi Vermilion, EAR324. Harbeth 30.2s, REL R-305, Shunyata Alpha V2 ICs, Alpha V2 SPs, Sigma XC, Sigma NRv2, Omega QR-s & Alpha NRv2 PCs, segmented Altaira SG stack w/ Alpha & Omega CGCs, Everest 8000 PD. Remote Server Room: Uptone EtherREGEN, AfterDark Master Clock & LPS, Alita, Battle Angel, (Akasa NUC Roon Core), iFi DC Purifiers (for SMPS used for Alita & router), Shunyata Gemini combo power distributor & Altaira-type CG GP-NR hub, Venom & Alpha CGCs, Shunyata NRv14 power cords for digital components.

Last edited by Puma Cat; 03-28-2019 at 11:06 AM.
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Old 03-28-2019, 06:44 AM
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I have been down this rabbit hole before. I am interested in finding out if you will arrive at the same conclusion i did......
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Old 03-28-2019, 07:38 AM
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Lots of additional amps, etc., for the light conversion, both coming and going. I'm from the 'simpler is better' camp for my audio.
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Old 03-28-2019, 07:56 AM
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I have not followed this but don’t see why it would not make a difference, albeit a lot of pieces.

There is a simpler way using an optical filter from DJM Labs but more costly.
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Old 03-28-2019, 08:41 AM
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Since the GigaFoil/Keces did not work in my network I am going to try something to what the OP describes. I am currently waiting for Small Green Computer to get their Opticalmodule in stock some time in April. I have already received the optical switch and cable. Let's see if that works.
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Old 03-28-2019, 08:55 AM
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@Puma Cat you need a LPS for the FMC just before your streamer. According to some reports at another forum, they find this to be better than the one you stated in the figure:
https://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/st...gDrillDownView

As for the question in your subject, obviously we do with our Lumin X1 product.

Last edited by wklie; 03-28-2019 at 08:58 AM.
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Old 03-28-2019, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wklie View Post
@Puma Cat you need a LPS for the FMC just before your streamer. According to some reports at another forum, they find this to be better than the one you stated in the figure:
https://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/st...gDrillDownView

As for the question in your subject, obviously we do with our Lumin X1 product.
Hi wklie,
Yes, both FMCs are coming with an LPS. I'm going to try my quieter iFi iPower one at the last FMC as I already have it. Cheers.
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Lumin P1 streamer/DAC/preamp, Constellation Inspiration integrated TT: Michell Gyro SE MkII, SME V, Koetsu Urushi Vermilion, EAR324. Harbeth 30.2s, REL R-305, Shunyata Alpha V2 ICs, Alpha V2 SPs, Sigma XC, Sigma NRv2, Omega QR-s & Alpha NRv2 PCs, segmented Altaira SG stack w/ Alpha & Omega CGCs, Everest 8000 PD. Remote Server Room: Uptone EtherREGEN, AfterDark Master Clock & LPS, Alita, Battle Angel, (Akasa NUC Roon Core), iFi DC Purifiers (for SMPS used for Alita & router), Shunyata Gemini combo power distributor & Altaira-type CG GP-NR hub, Venom & Alpha CGCs, Shunyata NRv14 power cords for digital components.
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Old 03-28-2019, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sircharles View Post
I have been down this rabbit hole before. I am interested in finding out if you will arrive at the same conclusion i did......
We shall see..it's an experiment; that's what scientists do.
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Lumin P1 streamer/DAC/preamp, Constellation Inspiration integrated TT: Michell Gyro SE MkII, SME V, Koetsu Urushi Vermilion, EAR324. Harbeth 30.2s, REL R-305, Shunyata Alpha V2 ICs, Alpha V2 SPs, Sigma XC, Sigma NRv2, Omega QR-s & Alpha NRv2 PCs, segmented Altaira SG stack w/ Alpha & Omega CGCs, Everest 8000 PD. Remote Server Room: Uptone EtherREGEN, AfterDark Master Clock & LPS, Alita, Battle Angel, (Akasa NUC Roon Core), iFi DC Purifiers (for SMPS used for Alita & router), Shunyata Gemini combo power distributor & Altaira-type CG GP-NR hub, Venom & Alpha CGCs, Shunyata NRv14 power cords for digital components.
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Old 03-28-2019, 10:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Formerly YB-2 View Post
Lots of additional amps, etc., for the light conversion, both coming and going. I'm from the 'simpler is better' camp for my audio.
I fully am in the "simpler is better" camp.

However, it's only two devices, FMCs with a fiber cable in between what is already in place with the 8 meter run of Ethernet I'm using now.

If it will lower the noise floor, then it will be worthwhile.

We'll see...it will be a fun experiment.
__________________
Lumin P1 streamer/DAC/preamp, Constellation Inspiration integrated TT: Michell Gyro SE MkII, SME V, Koetsu Urushi Vermilion, EAR324. Harbeth 30.2s, REL R-305, Shunyata Alpha V2 ICs, Alpha V2 SPs, Sigma XC, Sigma NRv2, Omega QR-s & Alpha NRv2 PCs, segmented Altaira SG stack w/ Alpha & Omega CGCs, Everest 8000 PD. Remote Server Room: Uptone EtherREGEN, AfterDark Master Clock & LPS, Alita, Battle Angel, (Akasa NUC Roon Core), iFi DC Purifiers (for SMPS used for Alita & router), Shunyata Gemini combo power distributor & Altaira-type CG GP-NR hub, Venom & Alpha CGCs, Shunyata NRv14 power cords for digital components.
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  #10  
Old 03-28-2019, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by For The Love of Music View Post
I have not followed this but don’t see why it would not make a difference, albeit a lot of pieces.

There is a simpler way using an optical filter from DJM Labs but more costly.
Interesting. Can you tell me about, or point me to a link, about using an optical filter from DJM Labs?
__________________
Lumin P1 streamer/DAC/preamp, Constellation Inspiration integrated TT: Michell Gyro SE MkII, SME V, Koetsu Urushi Vermilion, EAR324. Harbeth 30.2s, REL R-305, Shunyata Alpha V2 ICs, Alpha V2 SPs, Sigma XC, Sigma NRv2, Omega QR-s & Alpha NRv2 PCs, segmented Altaira SG stack w/ Alpha & Omega CGCs, Everest 8000 PD. Remote Server Room: Uptone EtherREGEN, AfterDark Master Clock & LPS, Alita, Battle Angel, (Akasa NUC Roon Core), iFi DC Purifiers (for SMPS used for Alita & router), Shunyata Gemini combo power distributor & Altaira-type CG GP-NR hub, Venom & Alpha CGCs, Shunyata NRv14 power cords for digital components.
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