Shunyata Darkfield Cable Elevator V2

[MyPal]

Ok, I just received 2 boxes of these (total of 24 elevators). RRP AU$400 box of 12.

They are nothing like the original Darkfield elevators which were apparently constructed from multiple layers of electrically conductive foam. They did look the part & the material science looked sound. According to Shunyata's recent website update on this product, the new model are apparently (an injected molded) static resistant and electrically conductive carbon impregnated polymer compound. The new design & materials used apparently are a significant improvement from the discontinued model.

Now there are countless plastic composites out there going all the way back to the Belgian/USA invented polyoxybenzylmethylenglycolanhydride (Bakelite). Bakelite was beautiful. The precursor to fantastic plastic form & function. Now we have beautifully injected or extruded composites of differing material characteristics to dazzle the eye... Will the Darkfield Cable Elevators V2 be a carbon fibre composite polished like the inside of a Ferrari? Perhaps they will compliment the dazzling jewel like finish of the Furutech Flux carbon rhodium plugs... May be not. Shunyata's marketing emphasis is weighted moreso towards function rather than form.

As I opened a box in anticipation of their material composition & construction, the pyramids were neatly stacked, each individually wrapped in little freezer type plastic bags. Surprisingly, there was no documentation, warranty card, pamphlet or marketing paraphernalia. Upon unwrapping an individual piece, it was to my sheer disappointment to discover they resemble nothing more than hollow black PLASTIC pyramids much like lightweight plastic toy stacking blocks! Have I been ripped or what?

The finish is unpolished with scratch/sanding marks. They mark easily. The plastic looks cheap & there seemed little effort in the manufacture. There are imperfections in the finish with marks and dents as if they had been scooped up from an IKEA playroom with a backhoe. The plastic looks like a similar composite used for UV resistant gutter traps.

I gave them a descent rub with various cloths including nylon. I was unable to build up any static discharge. A good thing. I also tried it with a Dremel polisher. The Dremel did manage to buff out a few of the surface marks. Again no static.

They are a stable design. They probably will do the job of lifting cables. The plastic properties are probably sound to do that. But they look like they came from a $2 shop in downtown Chinatown. UNFINISHED. CHEAP MANUFACTURE. They differ in uniformity. You certainly cannot use these to remove the static built up on a CD as Caelin demonstrated at CES 2010 with the original foam model...

I will show The Lady tonight as it will be good to get her regal reaction on this one. Unfortunately, I think they will be going back...

[Crion]

Hi Steve, I have the original DFE and minis could you please take a picture?

[MyPal]

[Ritmo]

I'm a big fan of Shunyata products. I do have to agree - these look like prototypes and not a finished product.

Mike

[Myles B. Astor]

Interesting, the early gen that I had fell apart when used with heavy cables (and what isn't?). It doesn't seem that these will be prone to the same problem.

[MyPal]

Originally Posted by Ritmo

I'm a big fan of Shunyata products. I do have to agree - these look like prototypes and not a finished product.

Mike

Mike... I am too a Shunyata fan, but my perception of this company is changing for the worse, rapidly.... I have talked up their products here on AA. I own 2 x Hydra Talos. I have 2 x Hydra Cyclops on order, with further consideration for another 2. I was contemplating investing heavily into Zitron. Now I'm not so sure anymore given that many early adopters are quoting long break-in times & that it is so difficult to get demo/shop product...

I'm actually insulted by receiving this product hence this warning. I'm annoyed with the dealer & the certain retailer for blatently palming them off to me by mail order for good coin without contemplating if they are in fact merchantable. I have been waiting 6 months for Darkfield Elevators. I was told that there were issues with the foam composites in the former version & that it had been resolved in production now. Then I am told that I will be fortunate to receive the new improved version. It doesn't help that the Shunyata website is incomplete & scant product information was only posted up recently.

The retailer has suggested that I should speak with the dealer regarding my concerns. Rest assured, I will be doing just that.

The Lady is disgusted & thinks this product is a con.

[jdandy]

Steve.......I agree with you. The Shunyata cable elevators look a bit rough around he edges.

Take a look at these cable elevators from Brass & Granite Audio in Salem, Oregon (Oregondv.com). At $27.00 each, these look very nice. They are made of porcelain with a non-conductive glaze.

[MyPal]

Originally Posted by jdandy

Steve.......I agree with you. The Shunyata cable elevators look a bit rough around the edges.

Take a look at these cable elevators from Brass & Granite Audio in Salem, Oregon. At $27.00 each, these look very nice. They are made of porcelain with a non-conductive glaze.

Thanks Dan. They look clean & pretty cool too. I shall take a closer look.

I do hope for the benefit of others here, GrantS can offer a decent explanation. I don't like slagging, especially a sponsor, but I felt it was warranted on this occasion after spending some many $K with them already.

[GrantS]

Hi Steve,

I apologize for your experience with the DFE v2. Upon reading your first reply, I saw some valid concerns. In your second, I see they have gained momentum.

When problems and sentiments like this arise, I think it's always best to contact the manufacturer and get the direct support or answers you deserve. If you contact us, I can assure you we will take care of answering your questions or help to process your return through your dealer.

The issue you raise with the documentation or marketing not being in the box is valid. There were a great many dealers and customers waiting so rather than wait for photography, we sent a first batch out without the product description etc in the box. Given the new materials being used and the form, this was a mistake in my view. We've made them before...mistakes, that is.

As to your other concerns...

There was a long gap between the first and second generation of the DFE because the products were re-made in an entirely different manner. Given the new material and processes involved, that took time. In this case, 4-5 months. A mold had to be created, materials sourced and the design finalized.

The slight surface scuffing or roughness of the exterior in spots relates to the carbon fiber. Were it a simple polymer, the surface would be perfectly smooth. The heavy carbon fiber content makes that impossible to achieve, unfortunately. I notice the roughness in the material upon close inspection and under light. When on the floor under a cable it hasn't been an issue, though I certainly understand you commenting on that since it is not expected. No matter how careful the finishing, carbon fiber in the polymer precludes a smooth surface.

This relates to the weight as well. They are hollow because adding weight of filling the core does not add anything to performance. It would certainly add to the cost and shipping, however, and we viewed that as a negative. The base was made wider for better stability and the contact points for the cable were made smaller. The small square points at the corners are there so the units can be worked into the carpet or rest on the floor. If the units were filled, they would be less stable on carpet. I realize weight adds to the perception of value.

We were similarly criticized on AudioGon and other forums for the DFE v1's when they first arrived. Foam!? Many didn't even try them but returned them with similar comments (at least they had the document).

Myles is correct, the material we originally used to adhere the foam layers (first production run) did not hold in humid conditions and we ended up replacing multiple sets in the field, free of charge of course. We did get this corrected in later runs and those units were extremely popular--not because of how they looked or how heavy they were or how they inspired confidence in their aesthetic, but because they performed well across many systems--far better than the heavy insulator-style elevators they were most often compared to

One area I am sensitive about is anything we produce being called a scam or money grab. The carbon fiber in the DFE v2 is not cheap. Nor was creating a mold for the compound and neither was "trying" to get a smooth exterior with all that, um, fiber in there. The DFE v2 retail price reflects what we have to charge at retail to produce them. Their retail reflects the exact same margin we have in the Hydras, cables and everything else we produce, roughly a x5 parts and material equation, which is low by almost every standard.

The DFEv2 are better than the DFE v1 and the price is the same. We know this because many of our industry friends and dealers have tested them and compared.

I completely understand your concerns that they are not what you were expecting. I will do whatever I can to help you with your return, should that be your wish.

I appreciate you taking the time to comment. Given how they are made and what goes into them, there should absolutely be something in the box that explains that and it wasn't there. I do apologize for that. Photo's were delayed and we fell victim to pressure to deliver a first batch rather than wait.

Regarding the zi-tron products, I replied in another thread here. Burn in is relatively normal at 4-6 days. Yes, they change after that for the better but they would not be doing as well as they are if they took 3 months to break in. We are getting demo's to dealers as fast as we can. Anyone that has contacted us about an evaluation has been able to get the cables in a reasonable amount of time.

If you have _any_ other questions or anything I can help with, or you just want to vent, feel free to call and I'll do what I can to help.

Best regards,

Grant
Shunyata Research

[GrantS]

Just an addendum, the DFE v2 are $295 US for 12, not $400. Yes, those Porcelain products look very nice.

There is nothing Fischer-Price or cheap about the published patent on the DFE v2; how that concept came to be, the person behind the design or how they are made. Try molding heavy carbon content material and see what you can deliver and at what price--and how polished. Then call and we can commiserate about the high-cost of material, molding and the difficulty in getting a product like that to market... ).