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  #101  
Old 01-14-2018, 09:41 PM
SCAudiophile SCAudiophile is offline
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Originally Posted by brodricj View Post
The thing is, I am in Australia. So we must work through the local distribution channel otherwise people at this end get upset and I get accused of buying grey import.
Understood...thank you for the clarification! Then again,...if the dealer does not respond, what right does he have to be upset or
opportunity for that matter if he's a no-show

Last edited by SCAudiophile; 01-14-2018 at 09:43 PM.
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  #102  
Old 01-14-2018, 09:54 PM
brodricj brodricj is offline
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Well, I've just called them at the store. They were not aware they were a Shunyata dealer. According to the national distributor they are a dealer. So when you have a Shunyata dealer who doesn't know they are a Shunyata dealer doesn't instil in me a lot of confidence in the local channel.
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  #103  
Old 01-14-2018, 10:57 PM
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  #104  
Old 01-15-2018, 12:10 AM
brodricj brodricj is offline
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I just called the SR distributor directly and they are able to assist. Actually, I had a good chat to them about all things Esoteric. And it turns out my local SR dealer has never bought anything SR from the SR distributor, hence my previous observations with that experience. Unfortunately no SR cables available to demo, the closest stock is 2000 miles away on the other side of the country.
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  #105  
Old 01-16-2018, 09:14 AM
justubes justubes is offline
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It would be interesting as 50ohm cables are sine waves.

Is the nature of 50 ohm much more sensitive than 75 ohm using square waves or the typical spdif coax interface from transport to dac.

As such the conclusion seems for 50 ohm use, it is more sensitive.

I have a coax which cost at least the same as Sigma level cables, BUT ... looking at the construction definitely not a coaxial cable is the least bit, but sounds better than the even my Acrolink DA6100 (true 75ohm), which incidentally also cost more when used for the 75 ohm taps.

Many audiophile cables meant for digital are NOT coaxial cables under the hood.... handmade etc.... Yes, a belden 75ohm cable doesnt compare even to these offerings.

As 50ohm / 75 ohm can only be achieved by very precise spacing between the conductor and shield, there is absolutely no other way or amount or twisting / braiding that will allow this correct characteristics.

But again, there are arguments that unless running hundreds or thousands of meters any deviation affects transmission losses and in some case total loss of signal over the distance.

What are the characteristic sonic outcome when using precise cables for digital transmission? Are there any prominent characteristics not obtainable of any non compliant audiograde digital transmissions cables no meeting this strict standard?


What do we listen for, this will be highly enlightening for the audiophile community.
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  #106  
Old 01-16-2018, 09:37 AM
justubes justubes is offline
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I have been playing with my digital clock cables a Acrolink 6100 , 5100, cybershaft clock cable and what my "best" sounding (non-75 ohm cable) to transmit 75 ohm PLL frequencies to the Esoteric K-01x and a mutec MC3.1+usb reclocking my streamer (also fed) via masterclock frequencies (accepted from 44.1khz in correct multiples to 10M)


It was interesting as i removed my best cable (non 75ohm) nor 50 ohm.

I was at a loss, substituting the Cybershaft generic clock cable. A loss of focus, less bass impact, definition and localization most appeaeant.

However, using different masterclock frequencies to the K-01x and muctec mc3.1+ usb.

I gained much back and the ipact of different frequencies fed as master has a profound effect on the sonics.

It seems now i am getting back much of the sound before eliminating 1 audiograde clock cable just applying different frequencies, i was much more profound than i recalled and answered my own question that clocking will have a much bigger impact than just the SPDIF/AESEBU interface from transport to dac (Using good correctly spec'ed cables)!

Any this is before changing any filter settings on the esoteric, footers, positioning or room acoustics tweaking!
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  #107  
Old 01-18-2018, 10:02 AM
Bigdenis Bigdenis is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCAudiophile View Post
The Esoteric-Mexcel 8N-A2000 50-ohm cable (assuming you find one globally that is authentic) is a great 50-ohm clocking cable. In my system, 2 of them performed extremely well and I was very happy for them. With my current equipment and with material I enjoy listening to, I am finding the Shunyata SIGMA Clock50s to be superior in certain areas that appeal to me; I've noted them already on the thread.
Thanks,
I have an Esoteric 8N-A2000 that I think original because bought, in second hand, to an official Esoteric dealer who had sold it new.
I use it between my G-01X (10Mhz/50 ohms) and my K-01X (75 ohms) with good results, but I will try the Sigma 50 if I have the opportunity to find one at good price.

Sorry for my English, I am French...
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  #108  
Old 05-24-2018, 05:49 AM
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Originally Posted by SCAudiophile View Post
AFAIK and was told, the test cables were neither Alpha nor Sigma and were not pre production prototypes of any kind. Caelin will have to clarify what they were beyond that. None were kept and all were returned to Shunyata.

The Sigma Clock50s I have today are final production versions purchased thru normal channels after the test. In a word, for 50ohm clock applications, the results with them are amazing and far beyond anything heard in my system over many years and many cables...
I am using Esoteric Grandioso K1 with my old G-0s rubidium clock leftover from when I used P-03U/D-03.

Now considering changing clocks to 10MHz / 50 Ohm Cybershaft Premium with 50 Ohm clocking cable.

Given your comprehensive experience would you consider this would yield a better performance using a good 50 Ohm BNC clocking cable with my K1 than the G-0s Rubidium Clock?

Cheers

Chris
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  #109  
Old 05-24-2018, 12:33 PM
clpetersen clpetersen is offline
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Originally Posted by brodricj View Post
No. The testing showed 50 ohm cable on a 50 ohm interface performed better than 75 ohm cable on a 50 ohm interface. All Esoteric need to do is build all their digital I/O to 75 ohm spec and you can forget about 50 ohm cables. Can use Mexcel 7N-DA6100 or Shunyata Clock 75.
Impedance matching (50/50, 75/75, etc.) is important, but for this application (relatively low RF frequencies, short cable distances, low powers) not a major concern. Mismatched impedances cause reflections - similar to light reflecting from water. A 50 ohm to 75 ohm impedance mismatch will reflect (return) about 20% of the outgoing signal back to the source.

Best bet is a good cable at the correct impedance.

Pasternack (US based) is an RF specialty company with a large catalog of cables at various impedances.
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Last edited by clpetersen; 05-26-2018 at 08:24 AM.
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  #110  
Old 05-24-2018, 01:26 PM
SCAudiophile SCAudiophile is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marpa View Post
I am using Esoteric Grandioso K1 with my old G-0s rubidium clock leftover from when I used P-03U/D-03.

Now considering changing clocks to 10MHz / 50 Ohm Cybershaft Premium with 50 Ohm clocking cable.

Given your comprehensive experience would you consider this would yield a better performance using a good 50 Ohm BNC clocking cable with my K1 than the G-0s Rubidium Clock?

Cheers

Chris
Marpa,

There is more than 1 question here inherent in what you are asking as far as I can see. As an aside, I've also owned the P-03U/D-03/G-0s combination and later P-03U/D-03/G-03x, both with very good results.

The 1st question is whether a later clock than the G-0s would serve you well; the answer to this is very much yes, regardless of manufacturer. The G-0s was Esoteric's first commercial product introduction around a Rubidium oscillator-based word clock. It features 75-outputs and frequency word-clocking at a more precise rate that onboard PLL-based designs of the time able to pump out 44.1 and 48.0 frequency baseline and multiples for audio as well as video. It could also put out a 100Mhz 'master' clock pulse as well. It has an additional feature where you could drive it with a 10Mhz 'master clock signal to provide atomic clock sync if you happened to have a more expensive cesium-oscillator atomic clock just laying around (in those years) . It was a very good unit and all its connects are 75-ohm as you many already know. The G-0s had higher phase noise than today's Rb and OCX word and master clock units and therefore more jitter. In short, yes, by moving away from that clock you could achieve a more musical result assuming you picked a modern clock (Esoteric, DCS or Cybershaft or others) with typically lower phase noise and better Allen Variance stats that the G-0s had way back when. It's oscillator has also aged quite a few years and unless it's been back to Esoteric, it's precision is also not quite what it should be due to the time that has passed.

The K1 you have is spec'ed ideally for 50-ohm input while the G-0s outputs 75-ohm. According to the Esoteric's specs, the K1 can take in 75-ohm but I think it is more ideally suited for a 50-ohm pure connect so getting a clock that outputs 50-ohms (your 2nd inherent question) is a move you'd like to make and then making sure you have a proper 50-ohm cable. This does make a difference according to the testing mentioned here by several audiophiles and 2 manufacturers (Shunyata and Cybershaft).

Which clock....the 3rd question underlying your post is 'which clock'; I happen to love the OCX-based ultra low phase noise effects of Cybershaft 10Mhz master clocking with a proper 50-ohm cable. The Esoteric G1 and G-01 are also in this league but Rubidium based, the G1 having pure 50-ohm outputs so that (G1) is another viable option for you to explore.

Overall my response is, 'yes' make the switch for the above reasons. My preferred configurations for you to think about are;

1. Cybershaft OP13 or better Ultra Premium (may have to wait for it) 10Mhz Master Clock with Shunyata Alpha or Sigma "CLOCK50" cable
2. Esoteric Grandioso G1 10Mhz master clock, with Shunyata Alpha or Sigma level "CLOCK50" cable

Don't mix 75-ohm cables where 50 are called for no matter what your read; it does make a difference!

Need to keep this somewhat brief as I'm working this response in while on the job....feel free to IM me with a phone# and I'd be happy to give you a call and talk live.

Hope this helps....

Last edited by SCAudiophile; 05-24-2018 at 01:30 PM.
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