Why Shindo gets almost no review ?

[Jerome W]

Originally Posted by PHC1

Jerome, better make that "first class ticket" for the very special occasion.

Hum....
Serge, a first class ticket from Paris to LA could cost the price of the Shindo Latour speakers ! I think that I will stay in business !

[sibelius]

I'm late to the party on this topic but thought I'd share my $.02.

While I love my Shindo gear and have nothing but good things to say about my dealer (Matt at Pitch Perfect) I do wish they were more open and transparent regarding criteria around reviews. Why is it that Art Dudley and Jack Roberts seem to be the only ones reviewing the equipment? Are there any stipulations regarding the reviews themselves? What kind of discounts do Dudley and Roberts receive on the gear if they decide to buy it? I know I'm living in a dream land but I think both Manufacturers and Reviewers should be completely forthcoming on these issues.

[Alberto]

Originally Posted by sibelius

I'm late to the party on this topic but thought I'd share my $.02.

While I love my Shindo gear and have nothing but good things to say about my dealer (Matt at Pitch Perfect) I do wish they were more open and transparent regarding criteria around reviews. Why is it that Art Dudley and Jack Roberts seem to be the only ones reviewing the equipment? Are there any stipulations regarding the reviews themselves? What kind of discounts do Dudley and Roberts receive on the gear if they decide to buy it? I know I'm living in a dream land but I think both Manufacturers and Reviewers should be completely forthcoming on these issues.

I think that "industry accommodation" prices (which I suspect are at 50-60% of retail) is common for all reviewers and applies to most brands they review.

Considering their size when compared to the giants of the audio industry, I think that Shindo gets more than adequate coverage.

Alberto

PS Sibelius, great list of gear you have there! Welcome to AA.

[sibelius]

Originally Posted by Alberto

I think that "industry accommodation" prices (which I suspect are at 50-60% of retail) is common for all reviewers and applies to most brands they review.

Considering their size when compared to the giants of the audio industry, I think that Shindo gets more than adequate coverage.

Alberto

PS Sibelius, great list of gear you have there! Welcome to AA.

Agree with you that given the limited production quantities of Shindo gear, they don't need reviews to help them with their business. Still wish at least some review mags/cites would be more up front. Not sure what the current environment is, but in the old days I heard it was not uncommon for manufacturers to have right of refusal for review copy.

Thanks for the welcome. Always enjoy communicating with fellow Shindo owners.

[adhesiv]

You can add Jeff Day and Jules Coleman as somewhat regular reviewers as well.

As far as refreshing and transparent, Jeff Day's had a pretty negative footnote about Ken Shindo's lack of response over several months which caused a delay in his publishing of the article even though his review of the gear itself was favorable.

[sibelius]

Originally Posted by adhesiv

You can add Jeff Day and Jules Coleman as somewhat regular reviewers as well.

As far as refreshing and transparent, Jeff Day's had a pretty negative footnote about Ken Shindo's lack of response over several months which caused a delay in his publishing of the article even though his review of the gear itself was favorable.

Thanks adhesiv. I do remember reading these guys when doing research. If I remember correctly these reviews are all at least a few years old now. It could be I'm wrong but I believe the only recent (last 12 months) reviews have been Art and Jack. I do remember the lack of response comments. If I remember correctly, Jonathan Halpren chimed in and blamed it on Shindo's lack of English and asked that all future inquiries get funneled through him. It also appears that at least in the US Shindo has stopped going to trade shows. I was kind of disappointed that Pitch Perfect was not at the last two California Audio Shows given that the shows were essentially in Matt's back yard. I understand that hotel suites are not the best environment to show off gear but still would have been nice to see and talk to Matt and other Shindo owners and hear about potential new products coming down the pike.

Again, thanks for the reminder on Jeff and Jules. My memory is not as good as it once was.

[adhesiv]

I've got mixed emotions on the show appearances, it's always nice to see and talk with other fellow gear owners/distributors about current and future setups.

That said, I've heard Matt is super accommodating though and I'm certain the experience is much better at his place than any trade show.

As Alberto mentioned as well there is something to the limited availability status of these pieces and it's been said many times that Ken thinks of his pieces more as art rather than a consumer product which lends better to a gallery (ex. dealer) type setting (right lighting, music, environment etc.) than a noisy and rambunctious trade show where "critics" walk around with a notepad scoring HiFi criteria.

I haven't even received my pieces yet so I'm still holding judgement but you can be certain I will share with all and compare the best I can with my other experiences. Just note that I'm relatively an infant in this hobby at only 30! I did get started early though at 18 with a Counterpoint/placette/Maggie system

Jayson

[sibelius]

Originally Posted by adhesiv

I've got mixed emotions on the show appearances, it's always nice to see and talk with other fellow gear owners/distributors about current and future setups.

That said, I've heard Matt is super accommodating though and I'm certain the experience is much better at his place than any trade show.

As Alberto mentioned as well there is something to the limited availability status of these pieces and it's been said many times that Ken thinks of his pieces more as art rather than a consumer product which lends better to a gallery (ex. dealer) type setting (right lighting, music, environment etc.) than a noisy and rambunctious trade show where "critics" walk around with a notepad scoring HiFi criteria.

I haven't even received my pieces yet so I'm still holding judgement but you can be certain I will share with all and compare the best I can with my other experiences. Just note that I'm relatively an infant in this hobby at only 30! I did get started early though at 18 with a Counterpoint/placette/Maggie system

Jayson

Very true regarding Matt and presentation. Without a doubt he has the best commercial listening room I've ever been in. Not only is the sound great but the ambience is wonderful as well with the lighting and furniture. Add in the fact that he only takes appointments and can give you his undivided attention and you have a great combination that obviously sells very well. Only downside is that "doing it right" costs money and thus the Shindo prices. I'm glad I'm one of the lucky ones that has been able to afford these "art" pieces. On the other hand I wish more people got exposed to hearing Shindo gear so they could get off the audio merry go round and hear what vintage inspired pieces can really sound like.

[f1 fan]

Originally Posted by sibelius

Very true regarding Matt and presentation. Without a doubt he has the best commercial listening room I've ever been in. Not only is the sound great but the ambience is wonderful as well with the lighting and furniture. Add in the fact that he only takes appointments and can give you his undivided attention and you have a great combination that obviously sells very well. Only downside is that "doing it right" costs money and thus the Shindo prices. I'm glad I'm one of the lucky ones that has been able to afford these "art" pieces. On the other hand I wish more people got exposed to hearing Shindo gear so they could get off the audio merry go round and hear what vintage inspired pieces can really sound like.

+1...

Dave

Sent from my iPhone using A.Aficionado

[Tonepub]

I've given up on the Shindo thing. They really don't want anyone other than Art Dudley to review their gear and their importer has made it clear that even if I were to buy Shindo gear AT RETAIL, I'm to "respect their wishes" and not write about it.

Really? Last I heard this country still had freedom of speech.

I've heard enough Shindo over the years to be intrigued and I certainly think the warm/romantic/delicious/whatever sound is a good idea, especially considering how mediocre most records are recorded.

But I still see this as a major cult of personality. It's well built gear, but not all that much different than very old McIntosh, Marantz etc etc in terms of sound. If you think I'm kidding, listen to a pair of MC30's, or a Marantz 8B. Very close in sound.

There is really only so much that can be done with a classic tube circuit. It can be voiced anywhere from warm to neutral to cold and everyone has their take on what it should sound like.

I guess I don't understand what they are so afraid of.

On one level, it's just like Ferrari in the sense that they keep the production low and the mystique high to keep the demand and the price high as well. Nothing wrong with that. And they are truly pieces of art, which is also cool.

So, it's just not in the cards for me to buy a full Shindo system at retail just so I can write a review about it. As it is not supposed to be used with other gear, so that the magic is not lost, it's pretty much useless as reference equipment. Maybe when I retire!

For what it's worth though, my ARC and Burmester gear works fine with every other mfr's gear that I've mixed it up with... Same with the CJ stuff. The ACT 2 and Premier 350 definitely have a synergy, but they both work great with other gear as well.

Food for thought.