Solid State Preamps Vs. Tube Preamps

[Chubba]

Thank you E-Stat for that info.I love the sound of the SFL-1. It has had a Gold lion 12at7 in it for approx. four months now with the two Mullards I have "resting".For the most part it has been driving my Mc-252 and then the latest version of the 275 for three weeks and now a MC-302 while my 252 went back to Mcintosh for a visit.I did have a C-2300 in my system for a week and wanted a simple line stage. Cheers

[Steady339]

Grasshopper, Congrats on decision to go tubes! The better tube preamps will give you the detailed sound, 3-D soundstage, dynamics and bass slam you are after. In my experience the combination of a tube preamp and especially a good tube power amp is the best way to achieve truly satisfying sound with digital sources.

[prepress]

Grasshopper,

By now your 2300 has settled in. Even as a solid-state person, I must admit the 2300 is doing pretty well in my system. The thing I have done was put the Amperex tubes I was using back into the unit after using JJ ECC803s. The Amperexes are more open, really nice, but I gave up a bit of bass; it is a tad less full so far. The dynamics seem present, but more understated.

This is the next adventure, trying out different tubes. I don't want to make tube rolling a habit, but curiosity will probably get me as I have Mullards and Gold Lions as well (my modest library) and will wonder how they'd perform.

How is your system doing these days?

[telematic]

I like opera and oratoria with my tube Luxman SQ-N10
But it useless for Black and Melodeath.

[PlanarSpeakerFan]

In my opinion, the difference between solid state and tube is more the means to an end than anything else. I have heard solid state systems that sounded more tube-like in their presentation than tube systems. I have also heard tube systems that sounded entirely solid state in their presentation. My previous preamp was a Cary SLP-05 and it was one of the best sounding preamps I've ever had the pleasure to listen. I ended up switching to the Pass XP-30 because I had purchased XA-100.5 monoblocks and I preferred the synergy of going entirely Pass.

Ken

[Esl Mike]

In my opinion, the difference between solid state and tube is more the means to an end than anything else. I have heard solid state systems that sounded more tube-like in their presentation than tube systems. I have also heard tube systems that sounded entirely solid state in their presentation. My previous preamp was a Cary SLP-05 and it was one of the best sounding preamps I've ever had the pleasure to listen. I ended up switching to the Pass XP-30 because I had purchased XA-100.5 monoblocks and I preferred the synergy of going entirely Pass.

"PlanarSpeakerFan's" above comments have it right IMHO.

A sonic road map or theorems about audio reproduction that point one in the appropriate direction would be great to have. However, the answer is never an easy one, or black or white (e.g. tubes or solid state; a combo of both etc.).

This endeavor (our hobby) is all about the often mentioned synergy of components, but more importantly, it's about the individual components and how well their designers have implemented their chosen designs -- albeit tubes/solid state; analog/digital; USB/SPDIF; RCA/Balanced; etc....

Perhaps this is why I have gravitated to botique-type equipment. Electronics and speakers from manufactures who do little, to zero mainstream advertising.

It is my belief that superbly implemented designs will sound great with other superbly implemented designs. Obviously some will sound better with others, this is where the all-important synergy comes in and nothing beats listening to those individual designs and components together. I believe that you would probably find that some of the generalizations mentioned in this thread, aren’t worth the paper that their printed on. In some cases and perhaps when some components from specific manufacturers are combined, generalizations may be true, but not always, so what's the point of generalizing?

One can say tubes do this and solid state do that, but those lines are easily crossed and totally blurred by the outputs heard from the individual components implementing those technologies.

Use tubes for this type of music and solid state for that -- not so much. A well balanced system using equipment designed for superb output when connected to the right upstream and downstream equipment, will reproduce all types of music very well. One can't say the same about poorly or mediocrely implemented tube designs or solid state designs etc...

It's my belief that it would be difficult to essentially impossible for most of us to choose whether we were listening to tubes or solid state, in double-blind listening tests. We might believe that we know the differences because we've heard a few components using those different topographies. But my strong opinion is that our level of confidence would be very low in being able to choose whether what we're blindly hearing is a box speaker or a hybrid one, let alone being able to distinguish a product with a tube or a transistor. So, if we can’t do that, how can one generalize and be correct, in a thread such as this?

We may be able to learn what product "a" when connected to "b" sounds like and what "c" connected to "d" sounds like, and hence, we may even be able to ascertain when "d" is connected to "b" but extending that experiment to 100's or 1,000's of components that use a myriad of different technologies, come on, who can generalize that electronic type “a” and “b” sound like this or that, or speaker type “a” or “b” sound like that etc..? I know that I can't!

Hence, which should I choose tubes or solid state? Heck, I don't know. I like the way my full function Aria WV5-XL tube pre-amp interfaces with my CAT JL3 tube amplifier, but I may like a solid state preamp equally as well or better. I didn’t choose tubes because I wanted some sort of “tube” sound. I choose tubes because together, my pre-amp and amp coupled to my Soundlab M1PX speakers meet my sonic preferences.

[medward0]

Originally Posted by Chubba

I am surprised there are no comments on hybrid preamps.

Late to the thread...

I've got a hybrid pre and a hybrid amp from CJ. So, both have both (tube input stages, SS output stages).

I haven't done any a/b testing per se, but I did get the preamp first and used it with my then SS amp (B&K something or another w/200 WPC).

Slam, slam, slam and decent vocals. But kind of a harsh treble and a narrow, flat soundstage (likely the cables at the time also). Complete awesomeness in movie sound tracks (2.1 system) and lots more woofer travel than I see these days.

Since getting the CJ amp, I still got some slam (400WPC into the 4 ohm Sophias helps), but the bass is not as clearly articulated as the mids and highs are; it is simply harder to hear detail in the bass. But, the bass is serviceable to my ears (decent with rap!) and I can always turn up the REL.

The CJ amp has other virtues to my ears: no listening fatigue, outstanding detail & sound staging, organic midrange, high boogie factor, and gobs of decay and harmonics.

Movies are surprisingly visceral and spatial with the CJ driving the front Sophias.

To my ears, my system is as designed and sounds great no matter what music I put into it. But I know that my preference may not work for others.

In this crazy pastime, it really comes down to what you want to listen to and how it sound to your ears and whether you like it that way.

[Mikeoz]

Hi all I want to upgrade my ARC LS26 which I use with a Krell 302e through Wilson Sophia 2. I'm thinking either a Ref5SE or a Pass XP20. I've never really heard a top quality SS preamp and wonder whether the bass suffers in my current set up.

I mainly listen to Rock and some Classical. The Ref5 is the obvious choice and very popular on here but should I consider the SS alternative? Btw it's impossible for me to compare the two as I would buy the ARC second hand.

[analog brother]

have you ever considered changing your amp instead?
maybe a vtl mb 450 or older classe ca-400?

[Mikeoz]

Originally Posted by analog brother

have you ever considered changing your amp instead?
maybe a vtl mb 450 or older classe ca-400?

Nope I'm looking to change the preamp next. No issue with the Krell.