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  #3391  
Old 03-20-2017, 04:42 PM
Comzee Comzee is offline
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Thanks for the input guys.

@bombadil that is a good solution, generally tower speakers have those extra drivers for bass frequencies which really helps. I could trade up my full range Omega pair for towers, but I think it would be easier to get a subwoofer, at least cheaper.

@x3workshop @Musica Amantem
Ya I'm probably just going to get the deepOMEGA 8, sounds like that's what people do, just augment with active subwoofer.
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  #3392  
Old 03-20-2017, 05:03 PM
Bombadil Bombadil is online now
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My little Inspire, a SE EL84, does much better with an active sub. It falls apart trying to drive deep bass. I've found that crossing over to an active sub, way up at 100Hz, and filtering those low frequencies from the amp, not only results in much better bass, but better sound at all frequencies. Better midrange, cleaner upper bass, better imagining. It might do better if it had better output transformers. I think the ones on it are off the shelf $35 transformers.
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  #3393  
Old 03-20-2017, 05:13 PM
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x3workshop x3workshop is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bombadil View Post
My little Inspire, a SE EL84, does much better with an active sub. It falls apart trying to drive deep bass. I've found that crossing over to an active sub, way up at 100Hz, and filtering those low frequencies from the amp, not only results in much better bass, but better sound at all frequencies. Better midrange, cleaner upper bass, better imagining. It might do better if it had better output transformers. I think the ones on it are off the shelf $35 transformers.
You really don't like those OPT's, do you?
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  #3394  
Old 03-20-2017, 05:27 PM
Bombadil Bombadil is online now
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I have inside info that they are the same as what one can order off of eBay for $35. Which begin rolling off the bass at 82Hz. Must say that was disappointing news when I learned it. When used with an active sub crossing over at 100Hz, I can get some reasonably loud volume even with speakers which measured at 87dB efficiency. If I run the amp wide open into those same speakers, it clips at moderate levels, like in the mid 80 decibels. It really has no deep base output.

I do have a small pair of hand made monitors which use Fostex FE126N full range drivers and the little SE EL84 can blast away into them. But the sound is so thin and midrange forward that it is difficult to listen to. Presently have no way to employ a sub in that setup, and it REALLY needs one.
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  #3395  
Old 03-20-2017, 06:52 PM
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opnly bafld opnly bafld is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bombadil View Post
I do have a small pair of hand made monitors which use Fostex FE126N full range drivers and the little SE EL84 can blast away into them. But the sound is so thin and midrange forward that it is difficult to listen to. Presently have no way to employ a sub in that setup, and it REALLY needs one.
Can you lay them on the floor firing up?
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  #3396  
Old 03-20-2017, 08:57 PM
Bombadil Bombadil is online now
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I guess I could, as the ports are on the front baffle. But then they would be just 2' from my bed and well below my mattress level. That doesn't seem like a good place to put them.
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  #3397  
Old 03-20-2017, 09:25 PM
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opnly bafld opnly bafld is offline
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Reflective wall nearby?
If it is easy to try............., you may be surprised.
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  #3398  
Old 03-20-2017, 09:35 PM
Rosco65 Rosco65 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bombadil View Post
I have inside info that they are the same as what one can order off of eBay for $35. Which begin rolling off the bass at 82Hz. Must say that was disappointing news when I learned it. When used with an active sub crossing over at 100Hz, I can get some reasonably loud volume even with speakers which measured at 87dB efficiency. If I run the amp wide open into those same speakers, it clips at moderate levels, like in the mid 80 decibels. It really has no deep base output.

I do have a small pair of hand made monitors which use Fostex FE126N full range drivers and the little SE EL84 can blast away into them. But the sound is so thin and midrange forward that it is difficult to listen to. Presently have no way to employ a sub in that setup, and it REALLY needs one.
The Fostex FE126EN has a low Qts and is recommended for horn loading. The Fe127e was better suited for bass reflex and is the driver originally used in the Omega Super 3 (I still own a pair).
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  #3399  
Old 03-20-2017, 09:47 PM
Rosco65 Rosco65 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Comzee View Post
Thanks for the input guys.

@bombadil that is a good solution, generally tower speakers have those extra drivers for bass frequencies which really helps. I could trade up my full range Omega pair for towers, but I think it would be easier to get a subwoofer, at least cheaper.

@x3workshop @Musica Amantem
Ya I'm probably just going to get the deepOMEGA 8, sounds like that's what people do, just augment with active subwoofer.
I have a couple pair of Omega speakers and have just added a pair of active subwoofers. I lucked into a pair of Rhythmik F8 low inertia subs that can be crossed over as high as 200hz. They are very heavy and high quality but must be connected at line level unless you use an adapter. They are famously fast server subs. Peter uses a similar arrangement for his midbass modules (his use a single driver per side while mine use two). Another option is the Rhythmik F12G 12" subwoofer that uses the lightweight GR Research driver. Either of these will run $900-1,000.

From what I can tell the Omega sub uses an OEM labeled version of the Dayton SPA250 amplifier. It is a respected amp, though it does have a history of failure from time to time. I own a couple of them that I was going to use for a project but never got around to it. Omega's cabinets are certainly prettier though. That can be addressed in the same manner Peter did: he bought the custom install version of the subs and had Louis make the cabinets for them.

If I were choosing a single subwoofer and my speakers had good mid to upper bass I would probably go with the Rhythmik F12G.
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  #3400  
Old 03-20-2017, 10:36 PM
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pstrisik pstrisik is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosco65 View Post
I have a couple pair of Omega speakers and have just added a pair of active subwoofers. I lucked into a pair of Rhythmik F8 low inertia subs that can be crossed over as high as 200hz. They are very heavy and high quality but must be connected at line level unless you use an adapter. They are famously fast server subs. Peter uses a similar arrangement for his midbass modules (his use a single driver per side while mine use two). Another option is the Rhythmik F12G 12" subwoofer that uses the lightweight GR Research driver. Either of these will run $900-1,000.

From what I can tell the Omega sub uses an OEM labeled version of the Dayton SPA250 amplifier. It is a respected amp, though it does have a history of failure from time to time. I own a couple of them that I was going to use for a project but never got around to it. Omega's cabinets are certainly prettier though. That can be addressed in the same manner Peter did: he bought the custom install version of the subs and had Louis make the cabinets for them.

If I were choosing a single subwoofer and my speakers had good mid to upper bass I would probably go with the Rhythmik F12G.
Thanks for the mentions Rosco.

For anyone interested, I have a thread over here ==> audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=134489.0. Skip ahead in the thread as the first page plus is more in the planning stage. Actual details and photos of the results later on.

IMO, Rythmik is the best value in subs around. Their 8" midbass modules, that I have in Louis' matching cabinets, are outstanding for taking the low end duty off of the main amp and speakers. Their 12" and larger subs are incredibly musical and articulate with settings galour (I have a pair of F12's). Among other features, they have a three position damping control - high, mid, low. High produces incredibly tight bass, and down to 14Hz in the F12's. If you like a bit of bloom in the bass, you can switch to mid or low.

If you are running a tube preamp, take the signal to the subs from that. You would then get a bit of the tube flavor in the mix.

I wouldn't worry about the sub amp / main amp compatibility. At the low frequencies, it's a different animal. I have a quad-amped system blended incredibly well. The subs need the control of higher wattage SS amps to do what they do.
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