Is Mcintosh the most popular Hifi brand?

[Charles]

You folks should read MF review of the Dartzeel NHB-468. It weighs in at 154 lbs, is solid state, and does a whopping 101 watts before clipping at 2 ohms. You mentioned design features. How about watts, price, and sound? In terms of watts, price, and sound, I'd rather have my 1.25KW's. Although my Alexx mostly don't need it, there are times the meters hit 120 watts and occasionally approach 240 watts. Solid state amps need plenty of reserve watts, unlike tube amps. In addition, the meters on Mac amps actually work and are very helpful in relating the volume level to the watts produced. Most meters on most amps other than Macs are useless. Dags are an example. European amps in general and Accuphase in particular are enormously expensive, often in the hundreds of thousands of dollars. In general, a speaker that is rated 4 ohms should be run off the 4 ohm tap, if possible; which is where I run my Alexx. If you measure watts of a 1.25KW off the 4 ohm tap, it would probably clip at about 1,500 watts because Macs are very conservatively rated. Often times extremely expensive amps won't even meet their published specs much less exceed them. Mike Fremer drives his Alexx with the 458, which is the older version of the new 468. The Alexx are a difficult load because the minimum impedance is 1.5 ohms and in the bass it generally runs about 2 ohms so his amp is quite stressed most of the time whereas my 1.25KW is loafing; because it will have at least 1,000 watts continuous and probably 1,500 watts dynamic at those loads. Before you can get into a meaningful discussion of sound quality, i.e. the quality of your watts, the amp must be able to supply them (the watts) in a non stressed manner; otherwise it's a non starter for me.

[jimimac]

Yes I think it is.Sales have tripled since I started.Our autoformers just keep getting better.I pot them in cans.Should be no Transformer Hum for the life of the unit. Technically I'm not sure why they keep improving on the sound ???

[Bob Bubeck]

Originally Posted by Charles

You folks should read MF review of the Dartzeel NHB-468. It weighs in at 154 lbs, is solid state, and does a whopping 101 watts before clipping at 2 ohms. You mentioned design features. How about watts, price, and sound? In terms of watts, price, and sound, I'd rather have my 1.25KW's. Although my Alexx mostly don't need it, there are times the meters hit 120 watts and occasionally approach 240 watts. Solid state amps need plenty of reserve watts, unlike tube amps. In addition, the meters on Mac amps actually work and are very helpful in relating the volume level to the watts produced. Most meters on most amps other than Macs are useless. Dags are an example. European amps in general and Accuphase in particular are enormously expensive, often in the hundreds of thousands of dollars. In general, a speaker that is rated 4 ohms should be run off the 4 ohm tap, if possible; which is where I run my Alexx. If you measure watts of a 1.25KW off the 4 ohm tap, it would probably clip at about 1,500 watts because Macs are very conservatively rated. Often times extremely expensive amps won't even meet their published specs much less exceed them. Mike Fremer drives his Alexx with the 458, which is the older version of the new 468. The Alexx are a difficult load because the minimum impedance is 1.5 ohms and in the bass it generally runs about 2 ohms so his amp is quite stressed most of the time whereas my 1.25KW is loafing; because it will have at least 1,000 watts continuous and probably 1,500 watts dynamic at those loads. Before you can get into a meaningful discussion of sound quality, i.e. the quality of your watts, the amp must be able to supply them (the watts) in a non stressed manner; otherwise it's a non starter for me.

To amplify, so to speak, the point one need go no further than the recent review of the MC462 in Stereophile (April, 2019).

https://www.stereophile.com/content/...r-measurements

I know, I know ...this is comparing mono blocks with a stereo unit and measurements do not guarantee sonic superiority, but both amplifiers were measured by the same individual via the same protocol. The MC462 blows away the NHB-468 in every category at about 1/19 the cost and is rated as a Class A component by the magazine. It would be interesting to obtain some impressions about the sonic differences between the two.

Bob

[Mamrak1]

I would imagine that the Dartzeel amp at $170,000 is out of price range for most audio consumers. The whorehouse gold color doesn’t help matters.

[Still-One]

Originally Posted by Charles

Before you can get into a meaningful discussion of sound quality, i.e. the quality of your watts, the amp must be able to supply them (the watts) in a non stressed manner; otherwise it's a non starter for me.

Charles, the number of watts are a poor predictor of what it will take to get the best out of a pair of speakers.

[2fastdriving]

Originally Posted by Still-One

Charles, the number of watts are a poor predictor of what it will take to get the best out of a pair of speakers.

I agree, and I was biting my tongue about this.

I also think that comparing Dartzeel with Mcintosh isn't exactly something you can do by looking at numbers.

Let me just say, I have heard the Dartzeel and it's freaking awesome, specs fade away quickly when you are listening to those babies.

[For The Love of Music]

Originally Posted by Puma Cat

Tbey're good, I'll grant.

But the German, Danish, Swiss, British and Japanese companies have amazing audio product design core competencies, as well.

Personally, I'm more of the view that great products are generally the result of great designers; individuals who are inspired thinkers and who can move up the "ladder of abstraction" in their thinking process out of the constraining box of academic EE academic education which is typically very solution-based and up to the level of a deep understanding of functionality at the level of transformations and transfer functions.

The audio product designers that spring to mind are (not in any order) Nelson Pass, Tim de Paravincini, Herve Delatraz, Caelin Gabriel, Wilfried Ehrenholz, Dave Wilson, Ivor Tiefenbrun, Roy Gandy, Andrew Jones, David Hafler, Yoshiaki Sugano, Peter J Walker, Hiroyasu Kondo, Dieter Burmester, and teams like Bill Conrad & Lew Johnson, Florian Cossy & Thierry Heeb.

I'm sure there are others I'd add to this list if I did some research.

Dan D’Agostino

[For The Love of Music]

Originally Posted by 2fastdriving

I agree, and I was biting my tongue about this.



I also think that comparing Dartzeel with Mcintosh isn't exactly something you can do by looking at numbers.



Let me just say, I have heard the Dartzeel and it's freaking awesome, specs fade away quickly when you are listening to those babies.

Yes, I would give my left nut for a pair of DartZeels!

Puma summed it up nicely to the affect, it’s not so much the brand but the designers that contribute in making the brand.

And I say, amps are only one part of a multi-part process

I was very happy to own Adcom, Carver, McIntosh and D’Agostino.

It’s the music that Rules, well the equipment too! [emoji851]

[Puma Cat]

Originally Posted by Still-One

Charles, the number of watts are a poor predictor of what it will take to get the best out of a pair of speakers.

Bingo.

[Puma Cat]

Originally Posted by Mamrak1

I would imagine that the Dartzeel amp at $170,000 is out of price range for most audio consumers. The whorehouse gold color doesn’t help matters.

I like it. It looks like Iron Man!