10 missing, 5 injured after USS John S. McCain collides with tanker in Pacific

[PHC1]

This could be true or it could be propaganda, hard to tell these days but an interesting read none the less.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.rt....navy-cyber-344

[jdandy]

It is now being reported that some of the missing crew member's remains have been discovered by divers in sealed compartments below the waterline. The Navy isn't saying yet how many bodies have been recovered or their identities.

[Masterlu]

This whole event sickens me; senseless and avoidable.

[PHC1]

Originally Posted by jimtranr

While hacking--say, of GPS-based navigation systems ala the James Bond "Tomorrow Never Dies" scenario--is a possibility, Itay Glick is a cyber specialist, and he'd naturally be disposed to focus on that as an explanation for what happened to Fitzgerald and McCain (and perhaps to sister 7th Fleeters Antietam, which ran aground, and Lake Champlain, which smacked a Korean fishing boat earlier this year).

Since Glick worked in the cyber-warfare unit of the Israeli intelligence agency and those guys know a thing or two about these topics and he pointed to the possibility of involvement from Russia and China, I would certainly not discount that possibility.

Evidently, if one is to believe this article, it has been an ongoing concern. https://www.rt.com/usa/uss-freedom-navy-cyber-344/

[jdandy]

My gut is telling me there is much more to these last two tragic events than operator error. GPS spoofing, radar cloaking, and who knows what else may be happening. If we have learned anything from the computer age, it is that no cyber security system is absolutely impenetrable or 100% safe. What works today is practically obsolete next year. With respect to computer technology and our military, it is a thin sheet of ice we are navigating.

[PHC1]

Jeff Stutzman, an ex-information warfare specialist in the Navy who works at a cyber threat intelligence company, told McClatchy that “there’s something more than just human error going on."


"When you are going through the Strait of Malacca, you can't tell me that a Navy destroyer doesn't have a full navigation team going with full lookouts on every wing and extra people on radar," he said.



I would believe an external source or influence much faster than I would believe incompetence of the full navigation team and all the lookouts. It's just not logical. That however implies that for an incident like this to happen, that external source would have to keep track and cause jams or malfunctions at precisely the "right" (or "sadly wrong") time for the navy in this case.

[jimtranr]

Originally Posted by PHC1

Since Glick worked in the cyber-warfare unit of the Israeli intelligence agency and those guys know a thing or two about these topics and he pointed to the possibility of involvement from Russia and China, I would certainly not discount that possibility.

I'm not discounting it, either, given what amounts to a stand-down order pending a system-wide review and the vulnerabilities alluded to in the 2013 Freedom article. Just cautioning against a rush to judgment, given all the variables present in the seaborne operating environment.

One of the questions raised by this year's incidents, it seems to me, is whether there's an overreliance on automated systems that--apart from the potential susceptibility to hacks--desensitizes watchstanding crew and their Mark I Eyeball.

[vintage_tube]

Originally Posted by jdandy

My gut is telling me there is much more to these last two tragic events than operator error. GPS spoofing, radar cloaking, and who knows what else may be happening. If we have learned anything from the computer age, it is that no cyber security system is absolutely impenetrable or 100% safe. What works today is practically obsolete next year. With respect to computer technology and our military, it is a thin sheet of ice we are navigating.

As the days pass from one incident to another, I tend to agree and why I posted that possibility. Non encrypted electronic devices are susceptible. Depending how this shakes out, for nat sec sakes, we may never know the truth -- but someone with the TS/SBI/Compartmentalized clearance will.

Then there is so much stealing (and selling) of our military & national security secrets. I say find 'em, shoot 'em & then apologize.

Best Sirs,

Bob

[PHC1]

If I may be so bold as to say that I would also suspect China of foul play here much faster than I would think Russia was involved.

We are well aware of The South China Sea dispute. Let's consider the facts. Could it be China is sending a message here???

From an economic and strategic perspective, the Strait of Malacca is one of the most important shipping lanes in the world.

From wikipedia:

The strait is the main shipping channel between the Indian Ocean and the Pacific Ocean, linking major Asian economies such as India, China, Japan, Taiwan, and South Korea. Over 94,000 vessels[3] pass through the strait each year (2008) making it the busiest strait in world,[4] carrying about 25% of the world's traded goods, including oil, Chinese manufactured products, and Indonesian coffee.[5] About a quarter of all oil carried by sea passes through the Strait, mainly from Persian Gulf suppliers to Asian markets. In 2007, an estimated 13.7 million barrels per day were transported through the strait, increasing to an estimated 15.2 million barrels per day in 2011.[6] In addition, it is also one of the world's most congested shipping choke points because it narrows to only 2.8 km (1.5 nautical miles) wide at the Phillips Channel (close to the south of Singapore).[7]


And more importantly:


The South China Sea disputes involve both island and maritime claims among several sovereign states within the region, namely Brunei, the People's Republic of China (PRC), the Republic of China (ROC), Malaysia, Indonesia, the Philippines, and Vietnam. An estimated US$5 trillion worth of global trade passes through the South China Sea[1] and many non-claimant states want the South China Sea to remain international waters. To promote this, several states, including the United States of America, conduct "freedom of navigation" operations.[2]

The disputes include the islands, reefs, banks, and other features of the South China Sea, including the Spratly Islands, Paracel Islands, and various boundaries in the Gulf of Tonkin. There are further disputes, including the waters near the Indonesian Natuna Islands, which many do not regard as part of the South China Sea.[3] Claimant states are interested in retaining or acquiring the rights to fishing areas, the exploration and potential exploitation of crude oil and natural gas in the seabed of various parts of the South China Sea, and the strategic control of important shipping lanes.

In July 2016, an arbitration tribunal constituted under Annex VII of the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS) ruled against the PRC's maritime claims in Philippines v. China,[4] although it is not enforceable. The PRC neither acknowledges the tribunal nor abides by its ruling, insisting that any resolution of the matter should be made through bilateral negotiations with other claimants.[5]

[jdandy]

Navy and Marine Corps divers recovered the bodies of all ten sailors killed in the USS John S McCain's collision with an oil tanker. Nine of the ten bodies were discovered inside flooded compartments of the destroyer.

May these ten sailors Rest In Peace:

Abraham Lopez, 39; Nathan Findley, 31; Corey George Ingram, 28; Dustin Louis Doyon, 26; Kevin Sayer Bushell, 26; Logan Stephen Palmer, 23; Timothy Thomas Eckels Jr., 23; Kenneth Aaron Smith, 22; Jacob Daniel Drake, 21; and John Henry Hoagland III, 20