SET Magic, I'm still not tired of it and I doubt I ever will - how about you?

[Alberto]

While many praise the liquidity and magic midrange of SET amps, few people manage to stick with an SET amp as their main amp. We've had several cases in this forum (Jerome's experience comes to mind) where initial intoxication is followed by a sense of "something's missing" and a return to more powerful push-pull design.

I must admit that I had some concerns about that when I purchased the Shindo Cortese. But now that I've had it for about 4 months, I am not only tired of it, I can't imagine being satisfied with a non-SET amp in the future.

I've talked about this (i.e. sticking with an SET as a main amp long term) in the past, but I wanted to write this update and solicit other experiences and opinions.

Have you tried SET and find it hard to go back to push-pull?

Have you tried SET and went back to push-pull?

Tell us your experience.

Alberto

[Jerome W]

Originally Posted by Alberto

While many praise the liquidity and magic midrange of SET amps, few people manage to stick with an SET amp as their main amp. We've had several cases in this forum (Jerome's experience comes to mind) where initial intoxication is followed by a sense of "something's missing" and a return to more powerful push-pull design.

I must admit that I had some concerns about that when I purchased the Shindo Cortese. But now that I've had it for about 4 months, I am not only tired of it, I can't imagine being satisfied with a non-SET amp in the future.

I've talked about this (i.e. sticking with an SET as a main amp long term) in the past, but I wanted to write this update and solicit other experiences and opinions.

Have you tried SET and find it hard to go back to push-pull?

Have you tried SET and went back to push-pull?

Tell us your experience.

Alberto

Good post Alberto.

Yes, with more tube friendly speakers, and the Tannoy Prestige line comes to my mind, I think that I would have bought the VERDIER 845 SET monoblocks. Not only that I think, but I'm actually sure of that.
I did not feel like selling my beloved speakers to buy the Verdier and find other speakers : not a very logical way to do. But this day will come because once you taste this magic, you just can't forget it.

[PHC1]

Hmm, something missing... I guess that can easily happen if a SET is to drive speakers not appropriate for SET. In combination with efficient enough speakers, (not too many choices out there), it is magic!

Why did I recently add 250w tube amps to my audio gear collection with my 96dB efficient Tannoy's and if the Shindo Cortese 10w was already magic? For a different flavor and as a long term experiment to see which system will survive the test of time. Chances are I will never get bored of either so both have a much greater chance of staying in my system looong time.

Since I wanted to expand my system and have a few turntables/tonearm/cartridges, I thought it would be great to have the best of both worlds, SET for those intimate listening sessions to acoustic recordings like violins, piano, flamenco guitar and the smaller jazz ensembles with their rhythm and horn sections. The higher powered tube amps would get me into the swing of things with all the more complex, higher energy music genres and recordings.

I also kept hearing that Tannoy are at their best with a good quality push-pull amps and not necessarily SET. I didn't exactly agree with that assesment with my my 96dB Canterbury but I was curious to see what a great push-pull amp/amps would bring to the table long term.

As it turns out after listening to my new ARC Reference system which is now approaching 100 hrs + of break in, the lines are blurred. There is no clear cut winner in my system. The ARC easily matches most of the qualities of SET and the 10w of Shindo SET just as easily keeps up with the best attributes of the ARC system with 25x the power.

One would think that good bass and classic rock recordings with some heavy drum work would be the ARCs forte and that the SET would take a back seat. Nope... The Cortese has produced some of the most profound quality bass in my system with the 15" drivers of the Canterburys.

The ARC system is slowly breaking in and coming up to speed but right now it has some work to do to prove to me that it can keep up with the Cortese all across the board. I suspect it will improve over the next 400-500 hrs of break in with those huge teflon caps in all the components as it is already starting to open up and focus, slam, resolution and bass is starting to join the party.

There may be a time when the ARC will pull ahead after the lengthy break in process and the Cortese may indeed take a back seat in some respects of dynamic contrast and super focused imaging in absolute terms. The palpability, three dimensionality and the fleshed out, round images that have body and soul that are all too real in the room when the Cortese speaks, well, ARC may be able to come very close as it is starting to do just that.

Of course not all SET are quite the same either. I've already auditioned long term the outstanding Ayon Crossfire 62B tube SET integrated. Yes, it also had that midrange magic in spades, it was fast sounding and holographic but for some odd reason I was always made aware of the midrange more than anything else. It tried hard to impress...

And this brings me back to the Cortese and the Masseto. The Shindo components always make me forget I am listening to a "system". I hardly ever think about any of the system at all. I simply get lost in the music that opens up in front of me. The musical message is so much easier to digest. It simply breathes and there is a natural and organic flow to the music.

The ARC system does have that ability from time to time to allow me to forget and just listen but so far and it is still very early in the break in process, it tends to remind me that it can do certain things extremely well but it doesn't quite have that "organic wholesomeness" just yet. Everything has to come together like it does with the Shindo. Then again, what fun would that be? On some recordings as I listen to the ARC stack, it has the ability to show me even more dynamic contrast, resolve some details and information that tends to go unnoticed with Shindo from time to time. I acquired the ARC to be the more modern, flexible, fast and an even more dynamic sounding system for that different "flavor".

In conclusion, I am very happy with the Shindo SET, it is truly musical and magic. I am also quite happy with the way the ARC is breaking in and the strengths that are starting to emerge. I doubt I would ever be bored with either system and my Tannoy speakers. It would be hard for me to give up the Shindo SET.

[Jerome W]

Originally Posted by PHC1

Hmm, something missing... I guess that can easily happen if a SET is to drive speakers not appropriate for SET. In combination with efficient enough speakers, (not too many choices out there), it is magic!

Why did I recently add 250w tube amps to my audio gear collection with my 96dB efficient Tannoy's and if the Shindo Cortese 10w was already magic? For a different flavor and as a long term experiment to see which system will survive the test of time. Chances are I will never get bored of either so both have a much greater chance of staying in my system looong time.

Since I wanted to expand my system and have a few turntables/tonearm/cartridges, I thought it would be great to have the best of both worlds, SET for those intimate listening sessions to acoustic recordings like violins, piano, flamenco guitar and the smaller jazz ensembles with their rhythm and horn sections. The higher powered tube amps would get me into the swing of things with all the more complex, higher energy music genres and recordings.

I also kept hearing that Tannoy are at their best with a good quality push-pull amps and not necessarily SET. I didn't exactly agree with that assesment with my my 96dB Canterbury but I was curious to see what a great push-pull amp/amps would bring to the table long term.

As it turns out after listening to my new ARC Reference system which is now approaching 100 hrs + of break in, the lines are blurred. There is no clear cut winner in my system. The ARC easily matches most of the qualities of SET and the 10w of Shindo SET just as easily keeps up with the best attributes of the ARC system with 25x the power.

One would think that good bass and classic rock recordings with some heavy drum work would be the ARCs forte and that the SET would take a back seat. Nope... The Cortese has produced some of the most profound quality bass in my system with the 15" drivers of the Canterburys.

The ARC system is slowly breaking in and coming up to speed but right now it has some work to do to prove to me that it can keep up with the Cortese all across the board. I suspect it will improve over the next 400-500 hrs of break in with those huge teflon caps in all the components as it is already starting to open up and focus, slam, resolution and bass is starting to join the party.

There may be a time when the ARC will pull ahead after the lengthy break in process and the Cortese may indeed take a back seat in some respects of dynamic contrast and super focused imaging in absolute terms. The palpability, three dimensionality and the fleshed out, round images that have body and soul that are all too real in the room when the Cortese speaks, well, ARC may be able to come very close as it is starting to do just that.

Of course not all SET are quite the same either. I've already auditioned long term the outstanding Ayon Crossfire 62B tube SET integrated. Yes, it also had that midrange magic in spades, it was fast sounding and holographic but for some odd reason I was always made aware of the midrange more than anything else. It tried hard to impress...

And this brings me back to the Cortese and the Masseto. The Shindo components always make me forget I am listening to a "system". I hardly ever thing about any of the system at all. I simply get lost in the music that opens up in front of me. The musical message is so much easier to digest. It simply breathes and there is a natural and organic flow to the music.

The ARC system does have that ability from time to time to allow me to forget and just listen but so far and it is still very early in the break in process, it tends to remind me that it can do certain things extremely well but it doesn't quite have that "organic wholesomeness" just yet. Everything has to come together like it does with the Shindo. Then again, what fun would that be? On some recordings as I listen to the ARC stack, it has the ability to show me even more dynamic contrast, resolve some details and information that tends to go unnoticed with Shindo from time to time. I acquired the ARC to be the more modern, flexible, fast and an even more dynamic sounding system for that different "flavor".

In conclusion, I am very happy with the Shindo SET, it is truly musical and magic. I am also quite happy with the way the ARC is breaking in and the strengths that are starting to emerge. I doubt I would ever be bored with either system and my Tannoy speakers. It would be hard for me to give up the Shindo SET.

What a nice write up Serge !
Very good products are difficult to rank.
We are music lovers and our hearts are big enough for various flavours.
Time will tell my friend.

[sibelius]

While the majority of my amps are SET, there are times when I want the crystal clarity and detail of an OTL amp. Other times when I want to listen to a Bruckner or Mahler symphony I just need more horsepower to capture the full dynamic range properly. I find the SET's I have are a bit constrained for large symphonic music - even with my 97db speakers.

Then there is the question when listening to SET of which SET? A 45 is a completely different animal than a 300B which is completely different than a GM70. I have definite preferences based on musical genre.

I can't picture myself ever being without a SET amp. However, there are times when I prefer listening to an amp with another topology. There are great SET, OTL and PP amps. Why limit yourself to one.

[Puma Cat]

I just sit back and listen to my C-J gear and not worry about these questions. With tube C-J gear, I think I've truly got the best of both worlds...