Are all watts equal?

[JSCC]

Originally Posted by PHC1

Fantastic Jerry! So the output 833 tube is driven by a KT88 through a transformer. I wonder if those 833 tubes are hard to get?

Per my dealer, he says at this point in time, Wavac is the only user of this tube. They do have stocks BUT did tell me it sort of lasts like a lifetime. Very lasting unlike KT88's etc, ... where average of 5k hours or so!

He also mention something like the 833 is an offspring of RCA design. Thats about all I know. Tube replacement is not expensive, its the build quality and components as a whole that makes Wavac at this kind of stratosphere pricing.

[Still-One]

Originally Posted by JSCC

Per my dealer, he says at this point in time, Wavac is the only user of this tube. They do have stocks BUT did tell me it sort of lasts like a lifetime. Very lasting unlike KT88's etc, ... where average of 5k hours or so!

He also mention something like the 833 is an offspring of RCA design. Thats about all I know. Tube replacement is not expensive, its the build quality and components as a whole that makes Wavac at this kind of stratosphere pricing.

Jerry
My friend, I would take a deep breath before getting all worked up and plunging into something like the Wavac's. Although I would agree that tubes and Horns seem to be a great match, you do have other choices. McIntosh amps for lack of a better term are not known as the "fastest" amps out there. Shop around a bit more.
Jim

[JSCC]

Originally Posted by Stillone

Jerry
My friend, I would take a deep breath before getting all worked up and plunging into something like the Wavac's. Although I would agree that tubes and Horns seem to be a great match, you do have other choices. McIntosh amps for lack of a better term are not known as the "fastest" amps out there. Shop around a bit more.
Jim

Jim, just ended another 4 hours session and I think by end next week, I whould return the Wavacs. They DO sound good, no DAMN good! However, these are "on loan" and by today standards, I could never cough out $100k just for amps, not after having bought a new car, exchange/traded in for the current system, plus moving to a new place.

Its unlike a year and a half ago where I could jump right in on almost anything I wish to cause I was just "starting out" spending big time.

I am NOT going to shop around BUT do the "cooling off" by NOT listening to my system, after the return of these amps, to wipe off any memory of them. And what better way than to spend 2 weeks in Shanghai/Wuxi/Suzhou doing my ODM project.

Serge and you are right. Just listen, be happy and enjoy. These things are not going to jump off - as $100k does have a lot of options for just a preamp/poweramp combo! In fact, it could just be a system altogether.

So, enjoy I shall. Other than that, I shall not be tempted to be greedy. Just listen and be happy!

Meanwhile, I wait for your PM or SMS to let me know when we can meet again. This time, we shall move around town in my new baby - nothing compared to yours of course - but still a small luxury I can afford as a ride.

Cheers!

[Tonepub]

Hey there:

Here's another amp you might try if you are really digging the high power SET thing and it's affordable (relatively)

The DeHavilland Aries GM70 is a 50 watt SET monoblock. I think they are about 9,000 a pair. Not quite a Wavac (and I've owned a couple, so I know the magic, they are spectacular), and not quite as pretty as the Wavac, but awfully good.

A lot of the magic you are hearing is coming from the single ended thing. And the DeHavillands have a lot of bass grip and control.

Just a thought if you are thinking about a different sound. Kara Chaffee is a nice lady and I'm sure she could put you in touch with a dealer in your area.....

[jdandy]

Jerry.......I saw the photos before I read your words. My first thought was, "I thouhgt he said he was broke." My second thought was, "Man, Jerry has gone off the deep end now." Lol. So glad to read, and discover they are loaners.

You have a revolving front door for audio gear. You know it, and we all know it. Even if you purchased the Wavacs, it would not be six months, and you would be looking at MBL, or Lamm with lust in your eyes. The trouble with that would be the Wavac would then be used, and resale would be half. You think you've taken a financial trade-in hit or two before, wait until you trade or sell these beauties, and $50k goes down the drain. Take them back.

[JSCC]

Originally Posted by jdandy

Jerry.......I saw the photos before I read your words. My first thought was, "I thouhgt he said he was broke." My second thought was, "Man, Jerry has gone off the deep end now." Lol. So glad to read, and discover they are loaners.

You have a revolving front door for audio gear. You know it, and we all know it. Even if you purchased the Wavacs, it would not be six months, and you would be looking at MBL, or Lamm with lust in your eyes. The trouble with that would be the Wavac would then be used, and resale would be half. You think you've taken a financial trade-in hit or two before, wait until you trade or sell these beauties, and $50k goes down the drain. Take them back.

Dan,

The Wavacs were gone since yesterday noon time. After more than a week with them, I am happy to have savor what exotic SET amplifiers are all about. No doubt the build quality, the immensely beautiful carved golden hue aluminum chassis and most of all the magical musical qualities all adds up to a once-in-a-lifetime experience for me. But to cough up a cool $!08k for them is definitely a very "class acting" I must be able to pull thru with my dear wife which I know I am not able to! Not for the past 2 years of history, like you said, revolving gears!

Back to reality. Although there are areas the Wavacs weaved its magic, with 6 hours of "cold turkey" treatment done on myself, am glad to say the MC501's is now back in place with my Acapellas. Performance I can still accept as top notch! A proof being able to watch with full musical involvement Chris Botti's In Boston BD. Well, everything is there as before, well almost ... if compared to the Wavacs.

For sure, I need time to recuperate financially after all the purchases (and loss) done these 2 years but the lessons and experience I had accumulated will stand me in good stead for years to come. Plus having made such wonderful friends with people like your good self, Jim, Serge, Howie, Ivan, to name but a few, will be like an advise council I can draw upon when I needed advise before I will make that decision to sign off my hard earned cash unlike before.

I have "met and pass" Lamm, MBL Reference Line by. So far, McIntosh still have that magic to hold me to them and I am happy for that. Though not inexpensive, it is far more affordable in my own standards where I wont be like going for broke unless its the Ref 2K series should I choose to own a new McGear.

Cheers.

[JSCC]

Originally Posted by tonepub

Hey there:

Here's another amp you might try if you are really digging the high power SET thing and it's affordable (relatively)

The DeHavilland Aries GM70 is a 50 watt SET monoblock. I think they are about 9,000 a pair. Not quite a Wavac (and I've owned a couple, so I know the magic, they are spectacular), and not quite as pretty as the Wavac, but awfully good.

A lot of the magic you are hearing is coming from the single ended thing. And the DeHavillands have a lot of bass grip and control.

Just a thought if you are thinking about a different sound. Kara Chaffee is a nice lady and I'm sure she could put you in touch with a dealer in your area.....

Thanks for the recommendation. Firstly, the Wavacs (or any other amplifiers purchase) will have to be off for now. Dan amply puts it - I am broke!

Moreover, I am STILL very much in love with my CURRENT setup where the McGears and the Acapellas made music together. My past 6 hours of listening confirm that!

Nonetheless, I enjoy reading your reviews very much!

Cheers!

[harry33]

Originally Posted by Jem666

Found a good article on the Web

Power Amplifier Fundamental

"If we had a perfect amplifier (and it was plugged into an outlet that had unlimited current capability), its output power rating would double each time the load impedance was halved. For example, let's say the amplifier puts out 200 watts per channel at 8 ohms. At 4 ohms, it would put out 400 watts per channel, at 2 ohms it would put out 800 watts per channel, and at 1 ohm it would put out 1600 watts per channel. For the perfect amplifier, one could keep going with this until the load impedance approached zero, at which time the amplifier output would approach infinity! On the other side, if the load impedance was 16 ohms, the amplifier would put out only 100 watts per channel. In this direction, one could keep raising the load impedance, and the power output would grow smaller and smaller.

The power supply of the perfect amplifier generates a DC voltage that does not change no matter how much current is demanded from it. This means that the perfect amplifier can drive an unlimited number of speakers. In the real world, amplifiers have real power supplies which do have limits as to how much current they deliver (and real world amps use output devices that are only rated for so much current before they self destruct). For such typical amplifiers, the 4 ohm power rating is usually about 50% more than the 8 ohm rating (and if a 2 ohm rating is given, this is maybe double that of the 8 ohm rating). Amplifiers with exceptional power supply designs will do better than this, but eventually a limit will be reached (if by nothing else the AC outlet can only deliver so much current!). Lesser designs will "run out of juice” when driving the heavier loads. Most decent amplifier spec sheets will specify how much power the amp can deliver into various load impedances. If an amp’s spec sheet gives a 8 and 4 ohm rating, be careful before using the amp with 2 ohm loads. It might work, but more likely it will be stressed out and may overheat or fail prematurely"

...seems like the MC2KW comes pretty close to being the perfect amp...delivering, for all intents and purposes, near infinite current and that with a rock solid DC voltage on the rails. Maybe it is brute force over finesse...but you can't argue with the laws of physics

Had the good fortune to hear them several times, it is the best amp I have heard to date...it makes reproduced sound "real"

THX

Jacques

Very instructive article.Thank you

Harry

[John James]

I looked at the pictures,,,I drooled on my keyboard.




That is all.