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  #11  
Old 08-12-2017, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjarmstrong View Post
What you are saying is absolutely true when strictly talking about data transfers whereas the data has to get from A to B without errors and timing is not critical.
With audio transmission such as SPDIF where the DAC has to recover the clock from the incoming data stream, the timing/jitter can have a significant impact on the digital to analog reproduction of the signal. This is also why the N10 ocxo clock is so critical to sound quality.
Anyway, don't want to drift this thread into another cable debate...just curious if you tried any others. Enjoy...
Appreciate it. I'll also agree the Aurender N10 is superior in generating a master clock. However, that timing information is transmitted digitally in the form of bits across AES/EBU, which doesn't have anything to do with SPDIF. No analog magic happening here.
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Last edited by Blueoak; 08-12-2017 at 03:18 PM. Reason: Updated AES/EBU
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  #12  
Old 08-12-2017, 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Blueoak View Post
Appreciate it. I'll also agree the Aurender N10 is superior in generating a master clock. However, that timing information is transmitted digitally in the form of bits across AES/EBU, which doesn't have anything to do with SPDIF. No analog magic happening here.
If that were true digital clock cables would not make any difference. I have extensive experience with both ocxo and rubidium clocks, boy do cables matter and so does the impedance of same.
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FLORIDA
MX136, MC1.2KW(10) MC2KW(2), MCD1100, MS750(2) MVP881, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT-2 SUBS(2) HT3F(2) WS350(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) XCS350(2) PS AUDIO PPP(8) RGPC 1200(20) RGPC POLE PIG(4) JL GOTHAM SUBS(2) SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U PROJECTOR, SVS SCISSOR LIFT, STEWART STUDIOTEK 120" MOTORIZED SCREEN, ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, CINEMA-TECH SEATING, WIREWORLD PLATINUM STARLIGHT HDMI, GOLD ECLIPSE CABLES & SILVER ELECTRA PC'S
Reference System: ACCUPHASE A200 MONOBLOCK AMPS, C3850 PRE-AMP, DP900 CD/SACD PRECISION TRANSPORT, DC901 PRECISION DIGITAL PROCESSOR, DG-58 DIGITAL VOICING EQUALIZER, T-1100 FM STEREO TUNER, PS520 POWER SUPPLY, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, HRS-SXR CUSTOM 4V-4V RACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
CAPE COD

MX150, MC501(2) MC1.2KW(10) MC2301(2) MR88, MS750(3) MVP881, MCD1100, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, ESOTERIC K01-X SE CD/SACD PLAYER, HT3F(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) OPPO-BDP95, PS AUDIO PPP(8) PUREPOWER 1050(4) RGPC 1200(15) JL GOTHAM SUBS(2) JL FATHOM F113 SUBS(4) SOUND ANCHOR SUB STANDS(2) LUMAGEN RADIANCE PRO SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U PROJECTOR, STEWART STUDIOTEK 120" SCREEN, SONUS FABER STRADIVARI, SILENZIO, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, BRYSTON BHA-1, ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, FORTRESS SEATING, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S.
Analog Rig: CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD w/ OUTER RING & CLAMP, UNIVERSAL ARM w/ Da VINCI' CART, 2nd UNIVERSAL ARM w/ GOLDFINGER STATEMENT CART, KLAUDIO RCM, HRS-MXR REFERENCE 4V RACK-GLOSS BLACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, AESTHETIX RHEA SIG PHONO-PRE, PS AUDIO PPP, RGPC 1200, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
Reference System: BURMESTER 911MK3 AMP(3), 088 PRE-AMP, 089 CD PLAYER, 100 PHONO PRE-AMP LOADED, 948 POWER CONDITIONER, AVID ACUTUS REFERENCE SP TT, GRAHAM PHANTOM II SUPREME ARM, BENZ MICRO LP-S CART, ESOTERIC GRANDIOSO P1/D1 STACK, G01 RUBIDIUM MASTER CLOCK, N05 NETWORK PLAYER, SILENZIO, HRS-SXR CUSTOM 2V-3V-2V RACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, STILLPOINTS, SONUS FABER AIDA SPEAKERS IN RED VIOLIN FINISH, JL FATHOM F113(2) SOUND ANCHOR SUB STANDS(2) ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, GIK PICTURE PANELS, PS AUDIO P10, WIREWORLD PLATINUM CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S

Library System: ESOTERIC GRANDIOSO SYSTEM M1 MONOBLOCK AMPS(2), C1 LINESTAGE PRE-AMP, K1 CD/SACD PLAYER, G1 MASTER RUBIDIUM CLOCK, E03 PHONO-PRE, SILENZIO, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, AERIAL ACOUSTICS 20T V2 SANTOS ROSEWOOD, AERIAL SW12 SUBS SANTOS ROSEWOOD w/ BASES(2), CANTON REFERENCE K3, DALI EPICON 8 RUBY MACASSAR, VPI HRX TT w/ SDS POWER SUPPLY, ORTOFON CADENZA BLACK CART, FURUTECH SILVER ARROWS PHONO CABLE, KLAUDIO RCM, SHUNYATA PS8, RGPC 1200(2) STEVE BLINN COMPLETE CUSTOM RACK, ASC STUDIO TRAPS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE IC'S & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
Bryston/Esoteric System: ESOTERIC C02-X PRE-AMP, D02-X DAC, G02-X CLOCK, BRYSTON 28B CUBED MONOBLOCK AMPS, BIT-15(2) AMR-DP777-SE DAC, SILENZIO, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE IC'S & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
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  #13  
Old 08-12-2017, 03:56 PM
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  #14  
Old 08-12-2017, 04:08 PM
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I wish it wasn't so, but I'll back out since it is OT anyway.
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FLORIDA
MX136, MC1.2KW(10) MC2KW(2), MCD1100, MS750(2) MVP881, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT-2 SUBS(2) HT3F(2) WS350(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) XCS350(2) PS AUDIO PPP(8) RGPC 1200(20) RGPC POLE PIG(4) JL GOTHAM SUBS(2) SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U PROJECTOR, SVS SCISSOR LIFT, STEWART STUDIOTEK 120" MOTORIZED SCREEN, ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, CINEMA-TECH SEATING, WIREWORLD PLATINUM STARLIGHT HDMI, GOLD ECLIPSE CABLES & SILVER ELECTRA PC'S
Reference System: ACCUPHASE A200 MONOBLOCK AMPS, C3850 PRE-AMP, DP900 CD/SACD PRECISION TRANSPORT, DC901 PRECISION DIGITAL PROCESSOR, DG-58 DIGITAL VOICING EQUALIZER, T-1100 FM STEREO TUNER, PS520 POWER SUPPLY, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, HRS-SXR CUSTOM 4V-4V RACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
CAPE COD

MX150, MC501(2) MC1.2KW(10) MC2301(2) MR88, MS750(3) MVP881, MCD1100, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, ESOTERIC K01-X SE CD/SACD PLAYER, HT3F(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) OPPO-BDP95, PS AUDIO PPP(8) PUREPOWER 1050(4) RGPC 1200(15) JL GOTHAM SUBS(2) JL FATHOM F113 SUBS(4) SOUND ANCHOR SUB STANDS(2) LUMAGEN RADIANCE PRO SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U PROJECTOR, STEWART STUDIOTEK 120" SCREEN, SONUS FABER STRADIVARI, SILENZIO, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, BRYSTON BHA-1, ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, FORTRESS SEATING, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S.
Analog Rig: CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD w/ OUTER RING & CLAMP, UNIVERSAL ARM w/ Da VINCI' CART, 2nd UNIVERSAL ARM w/ GOLDFINGER STATEMENT CART, KLAUDIO RCM, HRS-MXR REFERENCE 4V RACK-GLOSS BLACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, AESTHETIX RHEA SIG PHONO-PRE, PS AUDIO PPP, RGPC 1200, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
Reference System: BURMESTER 911MK3 AMP(3), 088 PRE-AMP, 089 CD PLAYER, 100 PHONO PRE-AMP LOADED, 948 POWER CONDITIONER, AVID ACUTUS REFERENCE SP TT, GRAHAM PHANTOM II SUPREME ARM, BENZ MICRO LP-S CART, ESOTERIC GRANDIOSO P1/D1 STACK, G01 RUBIDIUM MASTER CLOCK, N05 NETWORK PLAYER, SILENZIO, HRS-SXR CUSTOM 2V-3V-2V RACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, STILLPOINTS, SONUS FABER AIDA SPEAKERS IN RED VIOLIN FINISH, JL FATHOM F113(2) SOUND ANCHOR SUB STANDS(2) ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, GIK PICTURE PANELS, PS AUDIO P10, WIREWORLD PLATINUM CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S

Library System: ESOTERIC GRANDIOSO SYSTEM M1 MONOBLOCK AMPS(2), C1 LINESTAGE PRE-AMP, K1 CD/SACD PLAYER, G1 MASTER RUBIDIUM CLOCK, E03 PHONO-PRE, SILENZIO, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, AERIAL ACOUSTICS 20T V2 SANTOS ROSEWOOD, AERIAL SW12 SUBS SANTOS ROSEWOOD w/ BASES(2), CANTON REFERENCE K3, DALI EPICON 8 RUBY MACASSAR, VPI HRX TT w/ SDS POWER SUPPLY, ORTOFON CADENZA BLACK CART, FURUTECH SILVER ARROWS PHONO CABLE, KLAUDIO RCM, SHUNYATA PS8, RGPC 1200(2) STEVE BLINN COMPLETE CUSTOM RACK, ASC STUDIO TRAPS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE IC'S & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
Bryston/Esoteric System: ESOTERIC C02-X PRE-AMP, D02-X DAC, G02-X CLOCK, BRYSTON 28B CUBED MONOBLOCK AMPS, BIT-15(2) AMR-DP777-SE DAC, SILENZIO, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE IC'S & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
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Old 08-12-2017, 04:10 PM
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Default My thoughts on the Aurender N10

Quote:
Originally Posted by Masterlu View Post
If that were true digital clock cables would not make any difference. I have extensive experience with both ocxo and rubidium clocks, boy do cables matter and so does the impedance of same.


Agree 100%. Impedance is a major reason to use a dedicated digital cable, AES/EBU or coax/BNC, and not a basic analog XLR cable. The impedance tolerances on AES and coax are precise! I too have found significant sonic differences with digital cables. The BJC seem to be so cheap, I will likely order one to compare BJC vs WW for myself. Hope I don't feel foolish afterwards but I highly doubt it!
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Preamp: McIntosh C1100T/C1100C
Amp: McIntosh MC601 (2)
Digital: McIntosh D1100, McIntosh MCT450, Meridian 808v6, Aurender N10 8TB
Analog: Rega RP10 w/ Apheta 2
Signal cables: Wireworld Gold Eclipse 7 speaker cables; Transparent Ref XL (MM2) interconnects
Digital cables: Wireworld Platinum 7 Coax, AES/EBU, and USB
Power: Shunyata Denali, Alpha HC, Furutech outlets, (3) 20 amp dedicated lines
Speakers: Dynaudio Contour 30
Rack: Quadraspire SVT2 with Nordost Sort Fut (6)
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  #16  
Old 08-12-2017, 04:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j3brow View Post
Agree 100%. Impedance is a major reason to use a dedicated digital cable, AES/EBU or coax/BNC, and not a basic analog XLR cable. The impedance tolerances on AES and coax are precise! I too have found significant sonic differences with digital cables. The BJC seem to be so cheap, I will likely order one to compare BJC vs WW for myself. Hope I don't feel foolish afterwards but I highly doubt it!
After comparing no less than half a dozen; I settled on Platinum Starlight w/ 50 ohm BNC/BNC custom connectors.

I needed (4) of these cables for my Grandioso stack. Even the engineers at Esoteric in Japan concur on the need for premium 50 ohm cables.
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FLORIDA
MX136, MC1.2KW(10) MC2KW(2), MCD1100, MS750(2) MVP881, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT-2 SUBS(2) HT3F(2) WS350(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) XCS350(2) PS AUDIO PPP(8) RGPC 1200(20) RGPC POLE PIG(4) JL GOTHAM SUBS(2) SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U PROJECTOR, SVS SCISSOR LIFT, STEWART STUDIOTEK 120" MOTORIZED SCREEN, ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, CINEMA-TECH SEATING, WIREWORLD PLATINUM STARLIGHT HDMI, GOLD ECLIPSE CABLES & SILVER ELECTRA PC'S
Reference System: ACCUPHASE A200 MONOBLOCK AMPS, C3850 PRE-AMP, DP900 CD/SACD PRECISION TRANSPORT, DC901 PRECISION DIGITAL PROCESSOR, DG-58 DIGITAL VOICING EQUALIZER, T-1100 FM STEREO TUNER, PS520 POWER SUPPLY, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, HRS-SXR CUSTOM 4V-4V RACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
CAPE COD

MX150, MC501(2) MC1.2KW(10) MC2301(2) MR88, MS750(3) MVP881, MCD1100, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, ESOTERIC K01-X SE CD/SACD PLAYER, HT3F(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) OPPO-BDP95, PS AUDIO PPP(8) PUREPOWER 1050(4) RGPC 1200(15) JL GOTHAM SUBS(2) JL FATHOM F113 SUBS(4) SOUND ANCHOR SUB STANDS(2) LUMAGEN RADIANCE PRO SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U PROJECTOR, STEWART STUDIOTEK 120" SCREEN, SONUS FABER STRADIVARI, SILENZIO, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, BRYSTON BHA-1, ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, FORTRESS SEATING, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S.
Analog Rig: CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD w/ OUTER RING & CLAMP, UNIVERSAL ARM w/ Da VINCI' CART, 2nd UNIVERSAL ARM w/ GOLDFINGER STATEMENT CART, KLAUDIO RCM, HRS-MXR REFERENCE 4V RACK-GLOSS BLACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, AESTHETIX RHEA SIG PHONO-PRE, PS AUDIO PPP, RGPC 1200, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
Reference System: BURMESTER 911MK3 AMP(3), 088 PRE-AMP, 089 CD PLAYER, 100 PHONO PRE-AMP LOADED, 948 POWER CONDITIONER, AVID ACUTUS REFERENCE SP TT, GRAHAM PHANTOM II SUPREME ARM, BENZ MICRO LP-S CART, ESOTERIC GRANDIOSO P1/D1 STACK, G01 RUBIDIUM MASTER CLOCK, N05 NETWORK PLAYER, SILENZIO, HRS-SXR CUSTOM 2V-3V-2V RACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, STILLPOINTS, SONUS FABER AIDA SPEAKERS IN RED VIOLIN FINISH, JL FATHOM F113(2) SOUND ANCHOR SUB STANDS(2) ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, GIK PICTURE PANELS, PS AUDIO P10, WIREWORLD PLATINUM CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S

Library System: ESOTERIC GRANDIOSO SYSTEM M1 MONOBLOCK AMPS(2), C1 LINESTAGE PRE-AMP, K1 CD/SACD PLAYER, G1 MASTER RUBIDIUM CLOCK, E03 PHONO-PRE, SILENZIO, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, AERIAL ACOUSTICS 20T V2 SANTOS ROSEWOOD, AERIAL SW12 SUBS SANTOS ROSEWOOD w/ BASES(2), CANTON REFERENCE K3, DALI EPICON 8 RUBY MACASSAR, VPI HRX TT w/ SDS POWER SUPPLY, ORTOFON CADENZA BLACK CART, FURUTECH SILVER ARROWS PHONO CABLE, KLAUDIO RCM, SHUNYATA PS8, RGPC 1200(2) STEVE BLINN COMPLETE CUSTOM RACK, ASC STUDIO TRAPS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE IC'S & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
Bryston/Esoteric System: ESOTERIC C02-X PRE-AMP, D02-X DAC, G02-X CLOCK, BRYSTON 28B CUBED MONOBLOCK AMPS, BIT-15(2) AMR-DP777-SE DAC, SILENZIO, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE IC'S & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S

Last edited by Masterlu; 08-12-2017 at 04:24 PM.
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  #17  
Old 08-12-2017, 08:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blueoak View Post
Appreciate it. I'll also agree the Aurender N10 is superior in generating a master clock. However, that timing information is transmitted digitally in the form of bits across AES/EBU, which doesn't have anything to do with SPDIF. No analog magic happening here.
With all due respect I must correct you on this point, AES/EBU digital connections are actually a form of SPDIF but in balanced configuration. It is indeed transmitting digital bits represented by an analog waveform which is subject to timing errors, particularly regarding the recovery of the clock signal based on timing of the level transitions. So it is not as simple as saying they're just ones and zeros and any reasonable quality cable will transmit them perfectly, timing and jitter effects come into play with both coaxial and AES/EBU digital cable transmission. That's an engineering fact.
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Old 08-12-2017, 10:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audio bill View Post
With all due respect I must correct you on this point, AES/EBU digital connections are actually a form of SPDIF but in balanced configuration. It is indeed transmitting digital bits represented by an analog waveform which is subject to timing errors, particularly regarding the recovery of the clock signal based on timing of the level transitions. So it is not as simple as saying they're just ones and zeros and any reasonable quality cable will transmit them perfectly, timing and jitter effects come into play with both coaxial and AES/EBU digital cable transmission. That's an engineering fact.
Bill.......And optical Toslink. .
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Old 08-12-2017, 11:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Masterlu View Post
After comparing no less than half a dozen; I settled on Platinum Starlight w/ 50 ohm BNC/BNC custom connectors.

I needed (4) of these cables for my Grandioso stack. Even the engineers at Esoteric in Japan concur on the need for premium 50 ohm cables.
Seems really bizarre/proprietary that Esoteric calls for 50 ohms when the AES/EBU standard is 110 ohms. FWIW the BJC XLR is 110 ohms.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/AES3
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Old 08-12-2017, 11:22 PM
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Doug.......If I am not mistaken here, I believe the 50 ohm coaxial cables terminated in BNC that Ivan mentioned above are the cables used for the external clock signals, not the SPDIF coaxial cables used to a DAC for file transfer. Please correct me if I am wrong.
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