Learning as I go - little things matter in big ways!

[Olskool]

Having completed some upgrades and tweaks recently to my system I was a little bummed out when reality took over that it just did not sound right! This after blowing me away with outstanding sonic performance just after completing the upgrades. No matter how much I listened there was no groove or musicality to it; kinda limp and dishrag like! It was very disappointing. I don't yet know enough to describe it exactly but in a nut shell the system was providing detail but it seemed to me it was doing so behind a glass partition, or that it was choked, not present with no punch to mention at all. Is this "bloom" or lack there of?

Deciding to retrace my steps in setting up I finally realized that while trying to cleanup and reposition wires and cables I also changed plug priorities in my QB4 distribution bar, placing the turntable (Project 6 Perspex) and it's power plug (a wall wart) as the first item in the grouping and the NAD M5 cd player in the rear and final slot. In between, as recommended, was the LS27 in the grounded slot then the VS115 in the next slot designated for the AMP. For S & G's (s _ _ ts & giggles) I took the turntable wall wart out of the distribution bar (placed it on it's own power distribution - still utilizing a dedicated 20 amp plug with dedicated ground) and placed the NAD M5 in first priority position on the Qb4 bar. When it powered up and began to play tunes the difference was immediate and seemingly performing like before; very musical, defined, showing plenty of good punch with extended base and fairly well resolved. My speaker cables could be reversed (right with left) because the soundstage seems off center and a little closed in (probably need to spend some time re-setting speaker positions too). I'm traveling now for a few days but will tackle that upon returning home. Long story short, I'm learning as I go that small, seemingly innocuous things can make a huge difference in sound and performance. Any similar experiences, occurrences or setup insights that you care to share will be appreciated. There are a couple works for sale about setting up a system properly and covering a variety of areas in the discussions, any recommendations?

Larry

[metaphacts]

Originally Posted by Olskool

Having completed some upgrades and tweaks recently to my system I was a little bummed out when reality took over that it just did not sound right! This after blowing me away with outstanding sonic performance just after completing the upgrades. No matter how much I listened there was no groove or musicality to it; kinda limp and dishrag like! It was very disappointing. I don't yet know enough to describe it exactly but in a nut shell the system was providing detail but it seemed to me it was doing so behind a glass partition, or that it was choked, not present with no punch to mention at all. Is this "bloom" or lack there of?

Deciding to retrace my steps in setting up I finally realized that while trying to cleanup and reposition wires and cables I also changed plug priorities in my QB4 distribution bar, placing the turntable (Project 6 Perspex) and it's power plug (a wall wart) as the first item in the grouping and the NAD M5 cd player in the rear and final slot. In between, as recommended, was the LS27 in the grounded slot then the VS115 in the next slot designated for the AMP. For S & G's (s _ _ ts & giggles) I took the turntable wall wart out of the distribution bar (placed it on it's own power distribution - still utilizing a dedicated 20 amp plug with dedicated ground) and placed the NAD M5 in first priority position on the Qb4 bar. When it powered up and began to play tunes the difference was immediate and seemingly performing like before; very musical, defined, showing plenty of good punch with extended base and fairly well resolved. My speaker cables could be reversed (right with left) because the soundstage seems off center and a little closed in (probably need to spend some time re-setting speaker positions too). I'm traveling now for a few days but will tackle that upon returning home. Long story short, I'm learning as I go that small, seemingly innocuous things can make a huge difference in sound and performance. Any similar experiences, occurrences or setup insights that you care to share will be appreciated. There are a couple works for sale about setting up a system properly and covering a variety of areas in the discussions, any recommendations?

Larry

Small hint Larry. You should add the SpeedBoxII at a minimum. Huge improvement.

[karsajid]

I seem to have a big setup problem in my system. I have very INCONSISTENT sound reproduction. For example, I may have a magical listening session one evening - great soundstaging, ambience and tonal balance and bloom, beautiful control of the speaker drivers, great punch and dynamics etc. But the next day, its all gone! Collapsed soundstage with NO Height, weak dead flat sound. As if the life has be sucked out of the system. High frequencies become harsh and sound becomes thin and totally loses the warmth and ambience.

I have to say that most of the time the sound is bad, but when it is good, its amazing, and befitting of the quality of the electronics. The few times that I have got great sound is what has kept my hopes alive as to what can be a really enjoyable system.

Any help from the members that may guide me to help sort out my mess will be Greatly Appreciated.....

Thanks in advance.

[dude]

Sounds like you may be experiencing AC quality fluctuations. To say another way, listening at a time when most folks are drawing AC (6 to 10PM) versus later or at another time of day.

This is not uncommon in large urban areas.

Do you have a Power Line Conditioner in your system and / or dedicated outlets for your gear?

[TMcD]

I agree, I used to face the same issue, my system sounding flat in the evening. I ended up getting a balanced power unit by Equi=Tech, it took care of the issue the sound is really consistent. I got the the idea of using balanced power from a friend of mine that owns a recording studio in Brooklyn he swears by them.

[karsajid]

dude, TmcD - thanks for your replies. I am using the PurePower 2000 AC Regenerator and I have all components (digital and analog) connected directly into it.

My system consists of the Aurender S10 music server, Ayon Skylla DAC, ARC REF 5SE and REF 210, and Legacy Whisper XD speakers with their own built in 500 W Class D amps for the bass drivers. The speakers come with a Xilica DSP processors that goes between the pre and the power amps.

The PurePower 2000 display shows it gives steady voltage, but it is not plugged into a dedicated audio circuit. The incoming voltage does fluctuate by a few volts during the day.

[TMcD]

I did get a dedicated 20amp circuit installed for my amp (Ref 110) and it is plugged straight into the wall. It made a huge difference in the sound. Might be worth a try.

Also check the bias your tubes are at. I was told to run them at 55 and it sounded really flat, I put them back to 65 and the amp sounded great again. I was really surprised it made so much difference.

Good luck, Tim

[karsajid]

I do have a dedicated 20 Amp line with its own ground in my room and I have used the amps/equipment through that as well. It does not make much difference to the sound.

If its not a power supply issue, what else can I look for?

[Olskool]

Originally Posted by metaphacts

Small hint Larry. You should add the SpeedBoxII at a minimum. Huge improvement.

Hi metaphacts very early on I purchased the Speed Box II, and the Tube Box II SE phono stage. I've attached a list of the stuff in my system.

Karsajid my system seemed to float between great and uncomfortably average too. I have since had a dedicated 20 Amp power plug and earth ground installed ($325.00 + $75.00 for Shunyata audiophile plugs). Other than the issues reported at the thread start after changing things around it seemed much more consistent with dedicated power. I will need some time with the system now to confirm the changes made to re-prioritize power and interconnect cables have in fact fixed the problem (I think it did but need time to call it fixed). Your sound description was eerily similar to what I was hearing; very disappointing indeed. I have heard it is important to check tube bias and have put more than 50 hrs on since re-tubing my Amp, so I'll do that again soon too. Good luck, let us know what you come up with.


Equipment list:

ARC LS27 Pre Amp, ARC VS115 HD, NAD M5 CD/SACD, Definitive 400 Towers, Project 6 PerspeX, Project Evolution tone arm, Sumiko Blackbird MC cartridge, Project Tube Box SE II, Project Speed Box II, Cambridge Audio iD100 iPOD Doc, M2TECH EVO DAC, Grado powered Headphone Amp, Grado RS1 headphones, Nordost Vishnu / Blue Heaven Power Cables, Nordost Heimdahl / White Lightning Interconnects, Cardas 5C interconnects, Black Diamond Racing pucks, Vibrapod cones & pucks, Exclusivit chopping block, dedicated 20 Amp Shunyatta power plugs / earth ground