AudioAficionado.org  

Go Back   AudioAficionado.org > Manufacturers Forums > Schiit

Schiit Designed For The Real World

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #31  
Old 06-01-2019, 03:56 PM
PHC1 PHC1 is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pa
Posts: 19,524
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Puma Cat View Post
Fully agree, Serge.

I would love it if Schiit made a sweet little EL34 tube power amp, but I think they are set on solid state for power amps.

I'll bet the Harbeths sound absolutely wonderful with EL34 tubes; I am envious!
Yes, Iím very happy with both the PL-EL34 and Luxman. If I ever get bored, I also have the option of sticking anything from the various EL34ís to from KT66 to KT150 to play around since the PrumaLuna HP allows it. Plenty of experimentation ahead but Iím in no hurry, the stock EL34 sound great
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 06-01-2019, 04:24 PM
Puma Cat's Avatar
Puma Cat Puma Cat is offline
conrad-johnson, baby!

 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: East Bay, CA
Posts: 8,204
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PHC1 View Post
Yes, Iím very happy with both the PL-EL34 and Luxman. If I ever get bored, I also have the option of sticking anything from the various EL34ís to from KT66 to KT150 to play around since the PrumaLuna HP allows it. Plenty of experimentation ahead but Iím in no hurry, the stock EL34 sound great
Yeah, I saw that on the PrimaLuna web site. Have to say I'm envious. I'm stuck with 6550s or KT120s with the LP-70S
__________________
conrad-johnson CT-5 and LP70S, Michell Gyro SE MkII, SME V, Koetsu Urushi Vermilion w/ EAR324, Oppo BD-83SE, Sonore OpticalModule with Uptone Audio LPS-1.2 power supply, SOtM UltraNeo with Keces P3 power supply, Shunyata Alpha USB cable, Schiit Gungnir Multibit Gen 5 USB DAC, Schiit Loki DSD DAC, Mac Mini/Roon, Dynaudio Contour S3.4 with Esotar 2 tweeters, REL R-305, Audioquest Colombia and Colorado ICs, Shunyata Venom speaker cables, Shunyata Zitron Cobra and Black Mamba CX and Venom 3 power cords, Shunyata Triton, Synergistics Research HFT acoustical tuning devices
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 06-01-2019, 04:38 PM
PHC1 PHC1 is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pa
Posts: 19,524
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Puma Cat View Post
Yeah, I saw that on the PrimaLuna web site. Have to say I'm envious. I'm stuck with 6550s or KT120s with the LP-70S
Not a bad place to be Stephen. Besides, the PL HP integrated or their amps do come up on the market from time to time and they are rather inexpensive as far as audio goes
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 06-01-2019, 04:56 PM
Soundmig Soundmig is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Colorado - Western Slope
Posts: 184
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Puma Cat View Post
Hi Soundmig,
Respectfully disagree (just a little bit! ). My Dyns are 4 ohm nominal and 86 dB @ 1watt and if I were to hazard a guess, the Aegir would drive them to very satisfactory SPLs just fine. Why? Because most of my listening is done at average of approx 70dB or so. I would estimate 85% is between 65-75 dB, and 95% is at 65-80dB. Once the SPLs get past 82 or 83 dB, I'm reaching for the volume control. No way I'd be listening at 87dB (except for very occasional loud transients). YMMV, of course, based on the size of the room, but, when one does most of their listening between 68-72 dB (with notably less than 1 watt of power would be required), 20 watts of Class A power at 8 Ohms and 40Wpc at 4 ohms should be more than enough for most people, most of the time.

Cheers, PC
Given your listening level habits - Aegir would be more than enough and I know that you would like the sound My dedicated listening room is small, but (having mixed one too many an album at too high of an SPL) I tend to listen quite a bit louder than you do, so I may try two Aegir's in mono? I can always send the second one back if it isn't working out. Hmmm .... then again, I haven't yet found myself wanting more volume, so I guess I'll hold at one Aegir for now
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 06-01-2019, 11:15 PM
Puma Cat's Avatar
Puma Cat Puma Cat is offline
conrad-johnson, baby!

 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: East Bay, CA
Posts: 8,204
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundmig View Post
Given your listening level habits - Aegir would be more than enough and I know that you would like the sound My dedicated listening room is small, but (having mixed one too many an album at too high of an SPL) I tend to listen quite a bit louder than you do, so I may try two Aegir's in mono? I can always send the second one back if it isn't working out. Hmmm .... then again, I haven't yet found myself wanting more volume, so I guess I'll hold at one Aegir for now
__________________
conrad-johnson CT-5 and LP70S, Michell Gyro SE MkII, SME V, Koetsu Urushi Vermilion w/ EAR324, Oppo BD-83SE, Sonore OpticalModule with Uptone Audio LPS-1.2 power supply, SOtM UltraNeo with Keces P3 power supply, Shunyata Alpha USB cable, Schiit Gungnir Multibit Gen 5 USB DAC, Schiit Loki DSD DAC, Mac Mini/Roon, Dynaudio Contour S3.4 with Esotar 2 tweeters, REL R-305, Audioquest Colombia and Colorado ICs, Shunyata Venom speaker cables, Shunyata Zitron Cobra and Black Mamba CX and Venom 3 power cords, Shunyata Triton, Synergistics Research HFT acoustical tuning devices
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 07-07-2019, 04:37 PM
Soundmig Soundmig is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Colorado - Western Slope
Posts: 184
Default

Having now lived with Aegir for several weeks, I have a couple of additional observations. One is that Aegir's greatest strengths is its ability to convey dynamics both macro and micro. This ability is critical when it comes to "realism" associated with the attack envelope of voices and instruments. To say that music "comes alive" with Aegir may be an understatement. So much so that some recordings almost sound like different recordings compared to listening to the same through other amplifiers. One such recording is Monty Alexander's "Goin Yard" from Telarc. The close mic'd and HARD hit piano along with hand drums (congo's?) on the opening cut (The Serpent) sound like a close mic'd hard hit piano and hand drums (imagine that). Using two other amplifiers (both with audiophile cult followings) the distinctive attack (like you hear if you're actually there) was rounded off with these other amplifiers (sweet and pleasant, but not accurate). Interestingly Aegir does this (reproduces the hard and sometimes nasty attack) without sounding "harsh" or "etched". Another example of digging deep into the micro dynamics is in Chris Isaak's vocals on "Blue Spanish sky" where he transitions from throat voice to mask as he goes up in pitch. With the Aegir you can literally hear the tongue switch positions as the air moves into the mask (nasal cavities) and pushes the pitch higher and changes the timbre of the voice to the desired effect. Again, on the "other" amps this microdynamic detail is mostly lost.

Aegir may or may not be your cup of tea, because it doesn't always sound like and "audiophiles" amp, but it does always (to my ears) sound realistic and accurate. The only place where macro dynamics may be less than stellar is when you push the volume to where Aegir is taxed to provide the power (its' only 20 watts). At that point you can get some softening of the bass "impact". Even so, I've yet to hear Aegir clip - even under some pretty tough pushing. I've just ordered another one to try Aegir as mono blocks :-)

Another thing that I ran into at a friends house was the fact that Aegir is very senstive to DC. The amp simply would not stay out of protection mode for very long in his system? He's had some problem with noise in his A/C supply suspects that there may be some DC in his lines. I contacted Schiit to find out what they thought, and they said that likely there is DC in his A/C supply as Aegir is VERY sensitive to DC and will shut down if any DC is detected. They were also suspicious of the Cardas Clear Beyond power cable we were using at his house, but i don't think that power cable could cause a problem?

Anyway, I'm really enjoying Aegir and look forward to reporting on Aeigir x2.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 07-07-2019, 05:22 PM
PHC1 PHC1 is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pa
Posts: 19,524
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundmig View Post
Having now lived with Aegir for several weeks, I have a couple of additional observations. One is that Aegir's greatest strengths is its ability to convey dynamics both macro and micro. This ability is critical when it comes to "realism" associated with the attack envelope of voices and instruments. To say that music "comes alive" with Aegir may be an understatement. So much so that some recordings almost sound like different recordings compared to listening to the same through other amplifiers. One such recording is Monty Alexander's "Goin Yard" from Telarc. The close mic'd and HARD hit piano along with hand drums (congo's?) on the opening cut (The Serpent) sound like a close mic'd hard hit piano and hand drums (imagine that). Using two other amplifiers (both with audiophile cult followings) the distinctive attack (like you hear if you're actually there) was rounded off with these other amplifiers (sweet and pleasant, but not accurate). Interestingly Aegir does this (reproduces the hard and sometimes nasty attack) without sounding "harsh" or "etched". Another example of digging deep into the micro dynamics is in Chris Isaak's vocals on "Blue Spanish sky" where he transitions from throat voice to mask as he goes up in pitch. With the Aegir you can literally hear the tongue switch positions as the air moves into the mask (nasal cavities) and pushes the pitch higher and changes the timbre of the voice to the desired effect. Again, on the "other" amps this microdynamic detail is mostly lost.

Aegir may or may not be your cup of tea, because it doesn't always sound like and "audiophiles" amp, but it does always (to my ears) sound realistic and accurate. The only place where macro dynamics may be less than stellar is when you push the volume to where Aegir is taxed to provide the power (its' only 20 watts). At that point you can get some softening of the bass "impact". Even so, I've yet to hear Aegir clip - even under some pretty tough pushing. I've just ordered another one to try Aegir as mono blocks :-)

Another thing that I ran into at a friends house was the fact that Aegir is very senstive to DC. The amp simply would not stay out of protection mode for very long in his system? He's had some problem with noise in his A/C supply suspects that there may be some DC in his lines. I contacted Schiit to find out what they thought, and they said that likely there is DC in his A/C supply as Aegir is VERY sensitive to DC and will shut down if any DC is detected. They were also suspicious of the Cardas Clear Beyond power cable we were using at his house, but i don't think that power cable could cause a problem?

Anyway, I'm really enjoying Aegir and look forward to reporting on Aeigir x2.
Great write up! The eye flinching transient response reproduction and the dynamic contrast some amp/speaker combos are capable of is indeed entertaining but often does lead to a feeling of a sterile and sometimes harsh response overall depending on the recording. The balance of having a great dynamic contrast, to be able to hear every note of every instrument start and stop on a dime in a realistic fashion but to keep things sounding natural and with proper weight and tonal balance is no easy feat.

I loved the Wilson/D'Agostino combo for that. The Harbeth/Luxman can't quite match that reference point that has been established in my mind having lived with them for a few years but then again there is a limit what one can achieve on a given budget to build such gear.

That Aegir exhibits these traits of flushing out dynamic contrast without sounding clinical is already a great testament. Most budget amps can not be both smooth and flush out great dynamic contrast, some much higher end amps are excellent at dynamic contrast but sound clinical and I'm not going to name them

At the price of the Aegir, even if is only 20w/40w of Class A, kudos to Schiit for pulling it off. I'd love to take the Aegir for a spin just to see what Schiit has achieved for under $1k. So far every piece of Schiit (no pun intended, it's not my fault they chose that name ) that I have laid my hands and leaned my ears on, has been nothing but tremendous bang for the buck. Enjoy your Aegir and looking forward to further x2 impressions.

Last edited by PHC1; 07-07-2019 at 05:59 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 07-08-2019, 10:25 AM
Soundmig Soundmig is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Colorado - Western Slope
Posts: 184
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PHC1 View Post

That Aegir exhibits these traits of flushing out dynamic contrast without sounding clinical is already a great testament. Most budget amps can not be both smooth and flush out great dynamic contrast, some much higher end amps are excellent at dynamic contrast but sound clinical and I'm not going to name them
Its impressive and encouraging. Put Hermida: Lela (arr. Duran) by Elina Garanca from the Sol Y vida Album on Deutsche Grammaphon through the Gungnir MB, Freya (with NOS tubes), Aegir combination (on the F228Be's) will resolve every last detail of the music and the recorded space AND raise the Goose Bumps as well. Not "clinical" sounding at all - very musical.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 07-20-2019, 10:16 AM
Soundmig Soundmig is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Colorado - Western Slope
Posts: 184
Default Aegir x2

So I now have 2 Aegir's running as mono blocks. The new one is "burned in" and now sitting side by side with my other Aegir. While I really like the Aegir as a mono block, I have to preface my comments with the fact that Stereo Aegir can only use RCA inputs and mono Aegirs can only use XLR inputs. My pre to amp RCA's are AQ-Jaguars and my pre to amp XLR's are AQ Panthers. So from a cabling standpoint its "similar" but not apples to apples. There is no way for me to know what differences are due to stereo vs monoblock, XLR vs RCA and/or Jaguar Vs. Panther.

So, with the cable caveat in mind, what changes when you run Aegir x2 vs. a single Aegir? A listen to Mozart's Ave Verum (Dr. Chesky) can demonstrate most everything that I've been able to "hear". First, it's immediately noticeable that there is more "umphh" in the bass (pipe organ pedal notes). There is simply more air moving - even at same volume levels (if that makes any sense). Second, low level detail is more easily heard giving the recording a greater sense of space and depth. Each voice in the choir has a larger 3D space around it and the "room" is more palpable giving an even greater sense of "you are there". Third, there is a touch more "body" to the organ and to each voice making the male voice parts sound more natural and easier to hear clearly. This added body also makes the sound of the organ slightly more resonant and brings the mechanical sounds of the organ some realism that is easier to hear - more "lifelike".

Every recording I've listened to with Aegir x2 demonstrates the above mentioned improvements to one degree or another. The added "body" is particularly nice as it lends an even greater sense of warmth and "realism" to the overall sound. The only similar experience between similar amps in my memory banks was about 18 years ago when I had a Krell FPB 300 and an FPB 600 in hand for a while. The FPB300 (or was it 200?) sounded great, but the FPB 600 was "wow" - a different level. Aegir x2 is "a different level".

Is it all good news? - well no. Aegir x2 makes one twist the volume knob a bit further around (because its so warm and clean and inviting) but mono Aegir's running Revel F228Be's in mono can run out of gas (even in my small listening room)! On occasion one or the other of the two amps has shut down for a second or two upon delivering a large bass transient (such as a Telarc Concert Bass Drum played loudly). I was probably playing it louder than it needed to be, but its happened several times with different types of music (another example: Coldplay "magic"). Again reducing the volume to only too loud (instead of way too loud) fixes the issue, but i find it puzzling since running a single Aegir in stereo mode NEVER shut down for any reason. Perhaps as a monoblock, Aegir isn't overly fond of the 3.42 Ohm min. impedance (at 98 Hz) that the F228Be's present? I've inquired of Schiit and they seem puzzled as well - they are "working on" an answer for me? I'll follow-up if they come up with anything other than "over current" "turn it down".

Even with the small limitation, I am impressed with Aegir x2. The "level" of reproduction definitely moves up a notch or two and the added "warmth" is a really nice touch. AT $1600 for the pair the performance is quite good. There are some amps out there near that price range that also should be considered, but if you can live with 80 watts (mostly class A) I'm not sure you can touch Aegir x2 performance for the price.
__________________
Speakers: Revel F228Be, DAC: Gungnir MB, Pre: Parasound JC2, Amps: Parasound A23+, Phono: Well Tempered Classic with Monster Alpha 2 (rebuilt by SS), Phono Pre: Parasound JC3+, IC's: AQ Panther, AQ Jaguar, Cardas Neutral Reference, TPD Dms, Speaker Cable: AQ CV-6 with DBS (bi-wire).
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 07-20-2019, 03:29 PM
Puma Cat's Avatar
Puma Cat Puma Cat is offline
conrad-johnson, baby!

 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: East Bay, CA
Posts: 8,204
Default

Great review!
__________________
conrad-johnson CT-5 and LP70S, Michell Gyro SE MkII, SME V, Koetsu Urushi Vermilion w/ EAR324, Oppo BD-83SE, Sonore OpticalModule with Uptone Audio LPS-1.2 power supply, SOtM UltraNeo with Keces P3 power supply, Shunyata Alpha USB cable, Schiit Gungnir Multibit Gen 5 USB DAC, Schiit Loki DSD DAC, Mac Mini/Roon, Dynaudio Contour S3.4 with Esotar 2 tweeters, REL R-305, Audioquest Colombia and Colorado ICs, Shunyata Venom speaker cables, Shunyata Zitron Cobra and Black Mamba CX and Venom 3 power cords, Shunyata Triton, Synergistics Research HFT acoustical tuning devices
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Audioaficionado.org tested by Norton Internet Security

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:53 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.10
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
©Copyright 2009-2019 AudioAficionado.org.Privately owned, All Rights Reserved.
Audio Aficionado Sponsors
AudioAficionado Subscriber
AudioAficionado Subscriber
Inspire By Dennis Had
Inspire By Dennis Had
Harmonic Resolution Systems
Harmonic Resolution Systems
Wyred4Sound
Wyred4Sound
Dragonfire Acoustics
Dragonfire Acoustics
GIK Acoustics
GIK Acoustics
Esoteric
Esoteric
AC Infinity
AC Infinity
JL Audio
JL Audio
Acoustic Sciences Corportation
Acoustic Sciences Corportation
Legend Audio & Video
Legend Audio & Video
Audio by E
Audio by E
Canton
Canton
Bryston
Bryston
WireWorld Cables
WireWorld Cables
Stillpoints
Stillpoints
Bricasti Design
Bricasti Design
Furutech
Furutech
Shunyata Research
Shunyata Research
Accuphase
Accuphase