720P HD versus 1080P HD

[tigerhonaker]

For those that have owned projectors that were 720P/1080i and then up graded to the newer 1080p just how much difference is there in the picture

If you use Dish Network and watching an HD movie which I now see in 1080i.
And you are watching the same movie with 1080p just how much difference is there ?

I think we all know if we were using different projectors and different screens all this would certainly effect what we saw.

So, I suppose I really am saying to those that had the 720p and watched movies from Dish Network in HD.
Then up graded to a 1080p projector of the same quality how much difference did you see ?

You only changed projectors, not your screen.

Next question ?

Going from a DVD player to the Blu-Ray player same movie.
How much difference is there actually between the two of them ?

I think I can ask these questions on this Site as this Site has Adults as members.
Versus some other sites that I will not name that one is reluctant to ask even a simple question.
(Because of the Childish Comments to the question ask)

Just trying to get a rough idea of what the real difference is and I'm sure many of you know.

tigerhonaker

[bart]

Hi Tiger,

I have a Pioneer Kuro 60", so no projector, but it comes close in experience.
Climbing up from low to high quality I would put:
- Standard Def TV (digital)
- Upscaled DVD's (in my Oppo)
- HD TV channels: a huge leap forward from SD. We have some 20 HD channels here. They broadcast in 720p which is upscaled by the Kuro.
- Blu-ray pictures and concerts. Another big step forward, but I'd say not as big as SD to HD.
And to answer your other question: yes, a DVD movie played by a good BD-player will upscale better than a good DVD-player. Of course, if you have a top projector, it can also upscale. But in the tests I read, good BD-players were hard to beat in this area.

Bart

[Masterlu]

Every time you go up the pixel ladder, it's a good thing. A good analogy would be like looking at a newspaper pic and a magazine photo.

There isn't a dramatic difference between 1080i & 1080p but if you have a good enough projector, you'll still see the benefit.

DVD to BR will have increased resolution, and a better soundtrack if you're using HD codecs via HDMI.

[metaphacts]

Originally Posted by bart

Hi Tiger,

I have a Pioneer Kuro 60", so no projector, but it comes close in experience.
Climbing up from low to high quality I would put:
- Standard Def TV (digital)
- Upscaled DVD's (in my Oppo)
- HD TV channels: a huge leap forward from SD. We have some 20 HD channels here. They broadcast in 720p which is upscaled by the Kuro.
- Blu-ray pictures and concerts. Another big step forward, but I'd say not as big as SD to HD.
And to answer your other question: yes, a DVD movie played by a good BD-player will upscale better than a good DVD-player. Of course, if you have a top projector, it can also upscale. But in the tests I read, good BD-players were hard to beat in this area.

Bart

Processing depends on many factors. Using a Wolf Pro Scaler and native out of a DVD yields a much better result than any DVD or Blu Ray player up scaling. It's really not close.

Where and how you process becomes more and more important as the resolution and picture size go up.

[chessman]

tigerhonaker,

I have a 92" screen and a 1080p projector about 14 feet from my screen. My projector up converts everything to 1080p as currently configured. The difference between DVD and Blu-ray is dramatic, both in video and audio. Now 1080i and 1080p is just de-interlacing. Another issue is frames per second. Many players use a "3:2" algorithm to take a 30 frame per second video transfer to approximate a 24 frame per second movie original. Others, like mine, display at an actual 24 frames per second. Ability to process the up-scale is another variable. My Oppo blew away my PS3 as a processor, but I have no doubt a Wolf Pro Scaler would blow away my Oppo. Set-up geometry also matters - a high res display can look better or worse depending on how close you are sitting to it and what your viewing angle is.

So, like audio systems, the answers to your questions are "it depends." Generally, however, I think my answers are like Bart's and Ivan's above:

1) Blu-ray beats DVD and

2) If your display is large, higher resolution is better.

For getting started, I would buy an Oppo 95 Blue-ray player and a projector that can up-scale to 1080p/24.

P.S. Do not forget that Blu-ray will display in letterbox format (black bars). This drives some people crazy, especially wives. The Oppo has a "zoom" feature that allows the image to expand to 1.2 of original (among other choices), which allows a movie filmed in widescreen to use most of a 16:9 screen without losing the edges like "pan and scan" does.

P.P.S. Ask any questions you want to here. We were all new at this at one point. I learn something new here everyday.

[chessman]

Terry, I just saw the Runco thread where you described your set-up. You obviously know all about aspect ratio since you have a four way masking set-up. And a hell of a good projector, too. My bad.

[tigerhonaker]

Originally Posted by bart

Hi Tiger,

I have a Pioneer Kuro 60", so no projector, but it comes close in experience.
Climbing up from low to high quality I would put:
- Standard Def TV (digital)
- Upscaled DVD's (in my Oppo)
- HD TV channels: a huge leap forward from SD. We have some 20 HD channels here. They broadcast in 720p which is upscaled by the Kuro.
- Blu-ray pictures and concerts. Another big step forward, but I'd say not as big as SD to HD.
And to answer your other question: yes, a DVD movie played by a good BD-player will upscale better than a good DVD-player. Of course, if you have a top projector, it can also upscale. But in the tests I read, good BD-players were hard to beat in this area.

Bart

Originally Posted by Masterlu

Every time you go up the pixel ladder, it's a good thing. A good analogy would be like looking at a newspaper pic and a magazine photo.

There isn't a dramatic difference between 1080i & 1080p but if you have a good enough projector, you'll still see the benefit.

DVD to BR will have increased resolution, and a better soundtrack if you're using HD codecs via HDMI.

Originally Posted by metaphacts

Processing depends on many factors. Using a Wolf Pro Scaler and native out of a DVD yields a much better result than any DVD or Blu Ray player up scaling. It's really not close.

Where and how you process becomes more and more important as the resolution and picture size go up.

Originally Posted by chessman

tigerhonaker,

I have a 92" screen and a 1080p projector about 14 feet from my screen. My projector up converts everything to 1080p as currently configured. The difference between DVD and Blu-ray is dramatic, both in video and audio. Now 1080i and 1080p is just de-interlacing. Another issue is frames per second. Many players use a "3:2" algorithm to take a 30 frame per second video transfer to approximate a 24 frame per second movie original. Others, like mine, display at an actual 24 frames per second. Ability to process the up-scale is another variable. My Oppo blew away my PS3 as a processor, but I have no doubt a Wolf Pro Scaler would blow away my Oppo. Set-up geometry also matters - a high res display can look better or worse depending on how close you are sitting to it and what your viewing angle is.

So, like audio systems, the answers to your questions are "it depends." Generally, however, I think my answers are like Bart's and Ivan's above:

1) Blu-ray beats DVD and

2) If your display is large, higher resolution is better.

For getting started, I would buy an Oppo 95 Blue-ray player and a projector that can up-scale to 1080p/24.

P.S. Do not forget that Blu-ray will display in letterbox format (black bars). This drives some people crazy, especially wives. The Oppo has a "zoom" feature that allows the image to expand to 1.2 of original (among other choices), which allows a movie filmed in widescreen to use most of a 16:9 screen without losing the edges like "pan and scan" does.

P.P.S. Ask any questions you want to here. We were all new at this at one point. I learn something new here everyday.

Originally Posted by chessman

Terry, I just saw the Runco thread where you described your set-up. You obviously know all about aspect ratio since you have a four way masking set-up. And a hell of a good projector, too. My bad.

Thanks to all of you for your responses.
I'm certainly no expert but have general knowledge on the HT scene.

I wanted to read what many of you thought on up grading from two things.
720/1080i to 1080p.
DVD to Blu-Ray.

If all works out tomorrow afternoon I may join the Modern HT scene once again.
I made the move like 9 yrs. ago with my current HT equipment.
I tried then to purchase quality components.
Going to this time to at least go with what I think is a High-End 1080p projector, Runco VX-11D W/DHD4 Processor.
VideoXtreme
And a Sony Blu-Ray player which will not be high end but if I am right the more important choice here is the projector with it's Professional Quality Processor.
So, I will let it do the processing of the image and not spend a ton on the Blu-Ray player.
Got to start someplace.

Terry

[chessman]

Terry, like I said, it looks like one hell of a good projector you have coming. Major CONGRATS!

[W9TR]

DVD to Blu-Ray

The quality of the transfer and the quality of your scaler will drive your experience. The best Blu-Ray discs are better than the best DVD's, even with an exceptional scaler.

720p to 1080p
The secondary effects around improvements in projector performance will swamp the difference in many setups, strongly favoring the newer 1080p machines.

Tom

[W9TR]

You will love your new VX-11D and scaler! A huge improvement to what you are running now.