Burmester 911mk3 - is it right for me?

[Rocco]

Originally Posted by Anatta

I heard once the EB1is and they had very bloated bass; I think they need an amp with a high damping factor to control them and control is Burmester's middle name.

As for your last question, check this review (the 911mk3 is also mentioned).

Innerworld Audio - Audionet Amp Max Monoblocks

Hello.

I know very well the Audionet Amp Max Monoblocks and their sound is great, but I prefer over to them the sound of a stereo Burmester 911 MK3 which has extreme neutrality, musicality, linearity, refined sound and better tonal balance; all of there parameters are amazing with Burmester. I did a direct comparison side by side 3 years ago. During the years and around the world I had the pleasure to listen closely all I can simply affirm/consider the Burmester 911 MK3, especially the mono-pair, the sonically best power amps (no matter solid state or tube) at any price.

According the attached rewiew, I'm not agree because were used Transparent cables that even they're excellent cables, unfortunataley with Burmester not match perfectly and consequently the sound is not so good, because being the 911's is an amp with an high damping factor, his overall performance, especially the dynamic, will be deteriorate.

[Echo]

Thanks for the welcome. I am now in the middle of un upgrade. I own al ready à very fine Dynaudio Confidence C2, but with an SS amplifier which Will be replaced soon by a tube system (Octave MRE 120 mono blocks and an old Octave HP200).
Besides that the Burmester 911 is on my list (for more daily playing of my music) but I am afraid I have to save another year('s?) for being able to purchase that one...

Most important is of course my eclectic collection of music based around a lot of post-punk and grown now to all different musical styles.

I hope to be here a lot for learning and discussing...

[jdebonth]

Originally Posted by Anatta

I heard once the EB1is and they had very bloated bass; I think they need an amp with a high damping factor to control them and control is Burmester's middle name.

Anatta - that is awesome to hear - the EB1i's are notoriously difficult to integrate into even moderately large listening rooms; it took me months and months and required the purchase of a calibrated measuring microphone and analyzing waterfall plots to dial them in... I am now getting fantastic bass with my MC402 (@ 400W into 8ohm). I'm hoping with slightly less power at 350W into 4ohm and the higher damping factor the bass will be improved further.

[jdebonth]

Originally Posted by JohnThomas

That's a great deal and you will love it. But I would definitely find a Burmester preamp next for good synergy.

John, Joe - I used to be a firm believer in the preamp. Not a single DAC I tried sounded better without the preamp. Then came the Medea with the no-compromise analogue output stage design.

Running it with the C2300 gives a great and easy to enjoy sound but its like the high's are dipped in a hint of 'liquid tube warmth'. Sounds GREAT, but it makes all different types or recordings some somewhat similar. Without the pre the high's are so incredibly hyper-detailed yet so tonally accurate and natural sounding its like hearing deeper into the recording as the recording engineer had intended it to sound. Every recording sounds unique and this keeps me on my toes.

Other tonal qualities of the C2300 are virtually transparent- I think this is why it's such a highly regarded preamp. As I have only 1 source I am somewhat lucky as I don't need to use a pre to get in the way of the sound.

What I am trying to achieve with my system is complete accuracy and neutrality; I want to remove as much coloration as possible from the equipment so that what I am hearing is ONLY the music as it was recorded. I have found removing the preamp to be taking a step towards this design goal.

These are my experiences of course, as always, and especially with other converters, YMMV.

[jdebonth]

Just as a second data point, the stereophile review of the Burmester 001 CD player mentions preference for power amp direct with that unit also. I think if the CDP/DAC has an output stage equal in robustness to that of a high end preamp (i.e. with low output impedance), the theory holds true that the preamp can ONLY either filter or color the source signal. Anyways- this is the conclusion I have drawn from my various listening tests and reading of accounts online.

My first attempt to use the Burmester 001 sans preamp involved simply switching it to variable output and moving the Audience Au24 unbalanced interconnects from the preamp's output to the 001's. The sound was undeniably better. There was a reduced noise floor, most noticeable as a deeper soundstage, blacker silences, and a much better sense of the air and space around instruments. But the major components of the 001's personality—the warm tonal balance, the softened transients, the largish images, the lack of air—were all still there. -Brian Damkroger

[joeinid]

Hi jdebonth,

The Weiss Medea is highly regarded and I will take another look at it. One dealer/installer I trust sent me a list once of what he felt was worst to best as far as sound quality goes. The Medea and another (I will post the name when I find it) he listed as being the best.

As far as a preamp is concerned, it's personal preference but I don't like the absolute truth I do like a little warmth.

Joe

[joeinid]

Hi jdebonth,

Any updates on the 911mk3 and the Weiss Media DAC? I am very curious.

Joe

[jdebonth]

Joe - its been in the system since Sunday, see pics attached- still need to set things up properly.

I will go into further detail in a separate post, but for now let me put it like this: based on past amp and DAC upgrades I was expecting a noticeable but somewhat subtle improvement; something I would need to focus on to appreciate. This was not AT ALL the case, the 911 has improved by a WIDE margin every aspect of musical reproduction I know how to describe and listen to. I still just cant come to grips with the level of sound I am getting out of my system now... it is like for the first time i am completely surrounded in the music (almost like a 5.1 setup) and everything around me just vanishes apart from the music. The MC402 just cannot even come close to competing on this level. The synergy with the Weiss (I am going power amp direct) and the PMC's is as good as I have ever heard.

[joeinid]

Originally Posted by jdebonth

Joe - its been in the system since Sunday, see pics attached- still need to set things up properly.

I will go into further detail in a separate post, but for now let me put it like this: based on past amp and DAC upgrades I was expecting a noticeable but somewhat subtle improvement; something I would need to focus on to appreciate. This was not AT ALL the case, the 911 has improved by a WIDE margin every aspect of musical reproduction I know how to describe and listen to. I still just cant come to grips with the level of sound I am getting out of my system now... it is like for the first time i am completely surrounded in the music (almost like a 5.1 setup) and everything around me just vanishes apart from the music. The MC402 just cannot even come close to competing on this level. The synergy with the Weiss (I am going power amp direct) and the PMC's is as good as I have ever heard.

Hi,

Thanks for the update. People I know who hear Burmester, are absolutely floored. The level of sound is NOT subtle. I just don't know how they do it. I am very intrigued by your going direct with the Medea and I am investigating the Medea+ along with some other products like a Burmester DAC/CD player or dCS gear. I am extremely happy to read your results and your system looks great. There are still other amps I want to hear but I always come back to my trusty 911mk3.

Joe

[Masterlu]

It is most definitely a very special sound, one which appeals to me very much.