The Vintage Altec Codex

[junker]

I measured something closer to 15" to put the horn near ear level with the Flamencos. Keep in mind that the Flamencos are a bit shorter than Valencias and the bottom doesn't have the riser skirt. Ear level with the horn is the bottom line whatever that works out for you not what shindo did for his room and seating and body size / ear level. And I disagree on that point too... I feel his leg height is closer to 12-15" than 8" that is for sure. And also don't neglect that he has a scalloped cross brace that visually makes the legs look several inches shorter. As long as the center of the horn throat is near your effective ear level it is good to go.

[grantray]

Originally Posted by CFz

Grantray, thanks so much for posting this picture of the Valencias on your
stands, and giving your impressions given the O93s as a baseline... Curious, in both your cases you seem to have the speaker elevated by a foot or more. Why did you opt to go that route? In my case I was thinking of about 8-9" which would be ear level for me. I'm sure there is no 'right' answer per se, just curious how you guys came to your numbers.

Thanks for the kind words!

Personally, I'm not a believer in the rule that horns/tweeters must be ear height for "perfect" playback. To me, that's simply a false, hubristic logic. Sound happens to perfectly fill a room at the given ear level of the listener as much as our flat earth is the center of the universe.

With the 846As, I focused on positioning the speakers at a height that most suits the space they reside and create pressure in during playback. The O/93s helped me come to that conclusion, actually. When I felt a track deserved my utmost attention, I usually found myself sitting on floor, with my ears just below the O/93's tweeters.

But to play my own Devil's Advocate, that may also be because I spent several years in the small jazz clubs, music venues, and bars of New Orleans listening to unmic'd musicians, who were on very short stages, generally no more than a couple of feet, just above head height. The way all their instruments filled those rooms had a certain "rightness" to how the sound was able to cascade down on the audience, and that's what I strive to replicate by giving attention to the room above all else.

Of course, I understand not everyone will have the same emotional response to my notion of rightness in sound reproduction. But I hope hope that helps answer your questions about the height I chose for the Altecs' stands.

[CFz]

Thank you both for the replies! I sit on a couch that is shorter than most when I listen, that is why I was figuring the 8-9 inch number. I will aim to keep the horn throat around ear level, perhaps slightly above. I'll post some pics when done for comparison sake.

Thanks again!

[junker]

The 811 horn has 40˚ vertical dispersion (20˚ above and below).

[grantray]

The 10uf CCCP caps came in, but I'm still waiting on the 4.0uf caps. They'll get here when they get here, I suppose...

In other seriously awesome news, I swapped out my Wester Electric WE16GA speaker cables for the Duelund DCA16GA. (I repositioned my amp to a side wall and needed longer cables) I'm pretty shocked how much better they are in just a few hours as I was expecting way more of the forward, metallic harshness in the beginning that generally happens with tinned copper Belden/WE cables before they mellow. Instead I got bonkers lushness right off the bat. Don't get me wrong, they still need to settle, but I'm amazed how painless the transition was. Burning in my Belden 9497 ICs was wayyyy rougher in the first few hours.

And the cables I ran with the O/93s? Yeah, those would have cost $1300 for the same length if I bought them finished from the factory. I spent 2/10ths that on the Duelands, hooked them up nude, and they're already better with the 846As. Go figure, eh?

[Sancho22]

so would you say the Duelund is an improvement over the WE?
I am using 16 and 14 ga WE and love it. Dont miss the A23 when switch from it to the WE

[grantray]

Originally Posted by Sancho22

so would you say the Duelund is an improvement over the WE?
I am using 16 and 14 ga WE and love it. Dont miss the A23 when switch from it to the WE

For my 846As, the Duelunds and the LM211ia are considerably better. They reduced hum, reduced tracking/groove noise from my ZU DL-103 Mk.II to almost nothing, they took away a good chunk of the aggressive forwardness I was occasionally getting on certain resordings, tones are more lush, and any fatigue is almost non-existent. Except when I crank the LM211ia for extended amounts of time. Whoops!

The difference has made me rethink using the WE stuff for my 846A crossovers. Now, I'll either go Dueland or Belden 9497, and the WE16GA will probably get put up for sale. In all seriousness, maybe I have WE cable that's not quite up to snuff, because I didn't expect that level of obvious difference. And speaking of rethinking, I used to think the LM211ia was decent, but not a serious performer. However, the current set-up I have is sounding really, really good right now. My interest/desire/lust/need for "upgrading" to Air Tight or Shindo has basically evaporated. (Unless something comes along at a stupidly dumb low price, of course.)

Oh! Speaking of 846A crossovers, all the CCCP caps are in! Now I'm waiting on my new Fluke to arrive for testing (maybe Tuesday) and then ordering up the remaining components for the build. Exciting!

[Sancho22]

thanks for the detailed reply. I may give it a try especially once I get to the XO /re-wiring the Flamenco...

[Idler]

Lately I've been working on my Valencias, preparing to cut new back panels and playing with the Werner Jagusch crossover. I was trying to be good! But what to my wandering eyes should appear, but a local estate auction including a lovely pair of Altec Iconic Flamencos.

I had to bring them home. So far they look really nice. I've opened up one of them and they are very clean. Date code on 806A driver indicates 1965. Does this sync with Iconic manufacturing dates? Both drivers indicate 16 ohms. When I get time I will hook them up for a listen. Then I will have to make a big decision! Only one pair will be able to stay. As one of my co-workers likes to say, it is a first-world problem. Truly an embarrassment of riches.

Idler

[CFz]

Originally Posted by Idler

Lately I've been working on my Valencias, preparing to cut new back panels and playing with the Werner Jagusch crossover. I was trying to be good! But what to my wandering eyes should appear, but a local estate auction including a lovely pair of Altec Iconic Flamencos.

I had to bring them home. So far they look really nice. I've opened up one of them and they are very clean. Date code on 806A driver indicates 1965. Does this sync with Iconic manufacturing dates? Both drivers indicate 16 ohms. When I get time I will hook them up for a listen. Then I will have to make a big decision! Only one pair will be able to stay. As one of my co-workers likes to say, it is a first-world problem. Truly an embarrassment of riches.

Idler

Hey Idler,
I'm kinda in the same position but a bit reversed. I've had my Flamencos for a while now. I have my Werner's and new baltic birch plywood backs, but I'm needing some time to dedicate to put it all together.

For me personally, I prefer the look of the Valencias. Definitely more neutral and not as much of a 'statement' like the Flamencos, but it's all a matter of taste. That said, I do recall Art Dudley mentioning some sonic differences between the two when he review the Flamencos.

I think regardless, you will come out a winner! Congrats on the purchase.