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Acura Using Bose Noise Cancellation
Introduced in the '05 Acura RL, and now available in all Acura models, active noise cancellation is said to reduce outside noises and engine noises inside the vehicle cabin. The Bose sound systems in the Acura models use the same type of 180 degree phase shifting as the Bose Quiet Comfort headphones use. Stragically place microphones inside the vehicle monitor noise levels, and using software, a combination of low and higher frequencies are actively canceled. The new Active Sound Control system is much advanced over Acura's previous Active Noise Cancellation system. Where the original noise control system dealt with the elimination of low sound pressure entering the cabin, the new Active Sound Sontrol system has a much broader range including the elimination of unwanted high frequency noise.
Would this type of noise cancellation process be more appealing to you than controlling cabin interior noises with advanced structural and sound insulation designs and materials?
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Dan STUDIO - McIntosh C1000C/P, MC2301 (2), MR88, Aurender N10, Esoteric K-01X, Shunyata Sigma spdif digital cable, Sonos Connect, PurePower 2000, Stillpoints, Furutech Flux 50, Michell Gyro SE, Michell HR Power Supply, SME 309, Ortofon Cadenza Black, Wireworld, Sonus faber Amati Anniversario LIVING ROOM - McIntosh C2300, MC75 (2), MR85, Magnum Dynalab 205, Simaudio MOON Neo 260D-T, Schiit Audio Yggdrasil, Aurender N100H, Shunyata Sigma USB cable, Micro Seiki DD40, Ortofon Cadenza Blue, Nakamichi BX-300, Sony 60ES DAT, PS Audio P10, Furutech Flux 50, Sonos Connect, Stillpoints, Wireworld, Kimber, PMC EB1i, JL Audio f113 VINTAGE - McIntosh MA230, Tandberg 3011A tuner, Olive 04HD, Sony DTC-59ES DAT, McIntosh 4300V, JBL 4312A |
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It is appealing to Honda and every other auto maker since sound insulation adds weight. Weight is just about the biggest enemy of the auto companies. MPG!!
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I think it would be interesting to apply this type of noise cancellation in combination with an active Room Perfect / Audessey type solution in an automobile (have active microphones in various places in the car that send data to a processor that compensates based on noise, speed, and other factors). The noise cancellation would do the phase shifting and the "room correction" could be applied to fix the poor accoustic properties of the car (seats, glass, other hard surfaces, etc).
McIntosh does still do car audio as far as I know so it would be cool to see them come up with a solution like this...
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McIntosh MC501s, XRT29s, XR27, WS350s ModWright LS 300 Preamplifier Denon AVR-A100 HT Receiver JL Audio F113 subs with CR-1 Crossover Schiit Audio Yggdrasil DAC (Analog 2 + Unison USB) Sonore Ultrarendu with Uptone Audio LPS-1.2 Uptone Audio EtherREGEN network switch with LPS-1.2 Oppo UDP-205 with ModWright Signature Truth Tube Modifications Clearaudio Performance SE TT with Hana ML MC cartridge ModWright PH 9.0x Phono Stage ASC & RealTraps Panels; APS PurePower 2000; Daedalus Audio DiDs LAT International, Shunyata, Wireworld, WyWires Cables |
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I have some concerns with the long term psychoacoustic effects of active noise distruction systems. Even though frequencies are being canceled using out of phase, same amplitude frequencies to achieve lower noise levels, I wonder about the impact this approach to noise cancellation has on our brain. Even though relative silence has been developed with this out of phase technique, will our brain subconsciously be aware of these opposing frequencies? Will the brain sense a sound pressure level in this artificial silence that it perceives as a higher sound pressure level than actual silence? I wonder if there have been any long term psychoacoustic studies to determine if this type of sound distruction has any mental impact over long periods of time.
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Dan STUDIO - McIntosh C1000C/P, MC2301 (2), MR88, Aurender N10, Esoteric K-01X, Shunyata Sigma spdif digital cable, Sonos Connect, PurePower 2000, Stillpoints, Furutech Flux 50, Michell Gyro SE, Michell HR Power Supply, SME 309, Ortofon Cadenza Black, Wireworld, Sonus faber Amati Anniversario LIVING ROOM - McIntosh C2300, MC75 (2), MR85, Magnum Dynalab 205, Simaudio MOON Neo 260D-T, Schiit Audio Yggdrasil, Aurender N100H, Shunyata Sigma USB cable, Micro Seiki DD40, Ortofon Cadenza Blue, Nakamichi BX-300, Sony 60ES DAT, PS Audio P10, Furutech Flux 50, Sonos Connect, Stillpoints, Wireworld, Kimber, PMC EB1i, JL Audio f113 VINTAGE - McIntosh MA230, Tandberg 3011A tuner, Olive 04HD, Sony DTC-59ES DAT, McIntosh 4300V, JBL 4312A Last edited by jdandy; 01-16-2010 at 12:28 AM. |
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I think you may be over thinking this one Dan. You may be correct, but noise cancellation has been used for several years now, most notably in headphones. I am not saying those of us who have used them are not a bit crazier.
Isn't negative feedback used in audio products a method of noise cancellation. Jim Last edited by Still-One; 01-16-2010 at 09:12 AM. |
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Quote:
Your point about negative feedback is interesting, but this is acheived in the electronic signal path prior to actual sound generation, and is done strictly for the reduction of distortion components in the audio signal. To me, this is not the same as an actual sound that I hear being canceled by another sound that I hear as artificial silence. I am not paranoid about the subject, just expressing some thoughts that have crossed my mind.
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Dan STUDIO - McIntosh C1000C/P, MC2301 (2), MR88, Aurender N10, Esoteric K-01X, Shunyata Sigma spdif digital cable, Sonos Connect, PurePower 2000, Stillpoints, Furutech Flux 50, Michell Gyro SE, Michell HR Power Supply, SME 309, Ortofon Cadenza Black, Wireworld, Sonus faber Amati Anniversario LIVING ROOM - McIntosh C2300, MC75 (2), MR85, Magnum Dynalab 205, Simaudio MOON Neo 260D-T, Schiit Audio Yggdrasil, Aurender N100H, Shunyata Sigma USB cable, Micro Seiki DD40, Ortofon Cadenza Blue, Nakamichi BX-300, Sony 60ES DAT, PS Audio P10, Furutech Flux 50, Sonos Connect, Stillpoints, Wireworld, Kimber, PMC EB1i, JL Audio f113 VINTAGE - McIntosh MA230, Tandberg 3011A tuner, Olive 04HD, Sony DTC-59ES DAT, McIntosh 4300V, JBL 4312A |
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Phase cancellation is used in digital hearing aids for years now. The CPU in these aids are capable of making 400,000 cancellations per second and this is in a device which smaller than a dime. Now imagine if you have more room and power to process ? I think that not having the noise cancellation is more fatiguing on long trips than having it. I love my bose noise cancelling headphones when I fly. I sometimes disconnect the wire and just use the noise cancellation, the newest ones are even better.
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Quote:
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Sources: Vinyl: Clearaudio Innovation Wood turntable with 9" Universal tonearm, Da Vinci V2 cartridge, Stillpoints SS & Stillpoints clamp, McIntosh MVP 901, Apple Mac mini via Benchmark DAC 1, Aurender N100C via Schiit Yggdrasil Control: McIntosh C1100, Mcintosh MX151 Power: Mcintosh MC2301s (front), McIntosh MC501 (center), Mcintosh MC402 (rear) Speakers: Sonus Faber Amati Futura (front and back), SF Vox center Power/connections: PS Audio Power Port receptacles, RGPC 400 pro (2) WireWorld interconnects and speaker cable |
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Dan,
I don't think there would be any negative brain effects. The brain can only interpret what is picked up by the ear, if the ear doesn't pick it up then its a non-issue. Since hearing is actually different for each of us, I don't think that an application that happens outside of our bodies would have an impact. If what you are saying is true, then deaf people would suffer too, wouldn't they?. The brain is much more adaptive and flexible than we tend to recognize. |
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Rock.......My hypotheses is just that, a tentative assumption made in order to draw out and test the logical consequences of active noise destruction. I am not aware of, nor could I locate any information on a long term studiy associated with the effects of this noise control technique. I am not assuming there are, or are not detrimental effects. My curious nature begs for factual answers, not generalizations, assumptions, propaganda, or hearsay.
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Dan STUDIO - McIntosh C1000C/P, MC2301 (2), MR88, Aurender N10, Esoteric K-01X, Shunyata Sigma spdif digital cable, Sonos Connect, PurePower 2000, Stillpoints, Furutech Flux 50, Michell Gyro SE, Michell HR Power Supply, SME 309, Ortofon Cadenza Black, Wireworld, Sonus faber Amati Anniversario LIVING ROOM - McIntosh C2300, MC75 (2), MR85, Magnum Dynalab 205, Simaudio MOON Neo 260D-T, Schiit Audio Yggdrasil, Aurender N100H, Shunyata Sigma USB cable, Micro Seiki DD40, Ortofon Cadenza Blue, Nakamichi BX-300, Sony 60ES DAT, PS Audio P10, Furutech Flux 50, Sonos Connect, Stillpoints, Wireworld, Kimber, PMC EB1i, JL Audio f113 VINTAGE - McIntosh MA230, Tandberg 3011A tuner, Olive 04HD, Sony DTC-59ES DAT, McIntosh 4300V, JBL 4312A |
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