MSB Analog DAC

[jpgr4blu]

Thanx Adam. Have a great time.

[Glisse]

Excellent thread, Adam.

I replaced my BADA DAC2 with the MSB IV Signature in my main system despite swearing I would never spend that much on digital. The crunch came when I heard the MSB with the Galaxy clock added to it. It was an Over the Hills and Far Away moment.

Up until then, the BADA had been satisfying, and had replaced my Metrum Octave, because I found the dynamics and harmonics of the BADA just a little better. In part, I suspect, due to the balanced outputs of the BADA suiting my system better. I still do enjoy the BADA, now used in a less resolving system.

I actually find the biggest difference with Redbook, where the MSB seems able to pull out detail and soundstaging that I did not realise was there, and had assumed was lost forever in lousy digital transfers. Many of these favourite recordings I could only listen to on vinyl.

I have also listened to the Analog DAC on many occasions, and agree with your comments. It seems to have the natural sense of timing of the Platinum series, but lacks the resolution in direct comparison. The Analog DAC is single ended, despite having XLR outputs. It sounds better from the single ended outputs. I had wanted to buy the Analog DAC, rather than the Platinum. But the Burmester amps I use are happier with balanced equipment.

My own thoughts on the MSB range, after playing with a few of the different versions is:

• the discrete ladder DAC modules they use (and which contribute to their very high prices) have an ease to their presentation which seems to be missing in many other DAC types.
• the resistor count in the DAC modules affects resolution, so as you go up the range, this is what you get more of.
• the clock accuracy seems to affect soundstaging and temporal performance, ie the accuracy of harmonic decay and ambient sensations. The Galaxy clock (77fS) makes a big difference for me.

The Platinum IV Signature is nowhere near as cable sensitive as the BADA. It was happiest being used with a Shunyata Zitron Python power cable, but that may be a system effect.

Very much looking forward to your continued investigations with the remarkable array of DACs you have assembled. I have not had the opportunity to listen to dCS gear in my own system, and am interested in the differences.

Enjoy the warmth of the Maldives, as winter in Europe seems to be dragging along

[Elberoth]

Originally Posted by MyPal

Adam...Which Atol? So many choices. South Ari has some great diving sites. Maldives are my favourite holiday destination.

No idea My wife took care of everything. I'm gonna explore diving possibilities - I used to dive a lot, I was a member of our university student's diving club for many years, have a licence (not sure if it still valid though) to dive up to 50m.

I'm going for 10 days + 2 days in transit + 2 days on my way back in Dubai, so I will be back in 2 weeks. On Marth the 10-th, so just a few days after my return, the new owner is to show up to pick up my Sashas I sold last week (he also went for holidays, chence the speakers are still with me) so I will need to borrow some speakers to finish with the DACs.

[Elberoth]

Originally Posted by Glisse

I replaced my BADA DAC2 with the MSB IV Signature in my main system despite swearing I would never spend that much on digital.

I can hear you. Those have been my experiences as well. I have a BADA and DAC IV Signature side by side in my system now, and indeed the MSB is much better. In fact, it is better than anything I have heard to date, including my Scarlatti CDT+DAC.

[JohnThomas]

Originally Posted by Elberoth

I have just replaced the Diamond DAC (+ Femto) with the Platinium Signature (+ Femto) one.

The problem is, that I have changed my speaker cables at the same time as well (went from Anaconda ZTron to vdH Cumulus), so I'm not sure what brought what.

I love the sound of the Diamond + Femto, I think it is the best I have heard so far, the only thing I do not like is the price

Well I just went from the Platinum Signature + Femto after 6 months to the Diamond + Femto. It's worth the price of admission plus an arm, ok an arm and an leg. I don't know if it's as good as DCS since I've never had the opportunity to listen to that company.But it will do for now. Next step a speaker upgrade then I'm done for good.

[bzr]

[Elberoth]

Originally Posted by JohnThomas

Well I just went from the Platinum Signature + Femto after 6 months to the Diamond + Femto. It's worth the price of admission plus an arm, ok an arm and an leg.

That is my feeling as well. The price performance ratio is almost linear on MSB gear. Those hoping that you can get 90 or 95% of the Diamond performance at half the price, will be dispointed.

[Priaptor]

Originally Posted by Elberoth

That is my feeling as well. The price performance ratio is almost linear on MSB gear. Those hoping that you can get 90 or 95% of the Diamond performance at half the price, will be dispointed.

Well I ordered my Diamond yesterday. I need no more convincing. I am not sure about a linear relationship of price to performance but it is better than most high end gear I have owned or auditioned.

[Elberoth]

Wow, congrats !

[Glisse]

Originally Posted by Elberoth

That is my feeling as well. The price performance ratio is almost linear on MSB gear. Those hoping that you can get 90 or 95% of the Diamond performance at half the price, will be dispointed.

I like the sound of the MSB DAC very much, but conversely dislike their pricing structure.

Not because their product is expensive, as one expects state of the art products to be relatively expensive. But their approach to pricing. If you buy one of their Platinum DACs, level doesn't matter, you then have to buy a power supply to get any sort of decent performance out of it.

My perspective is that any product should already have a power supply provided, and that power supply should be designed to get the optimum out of the product. Yet MSB charges many thousands of Euros/ dollars additional for a power supply.

Then there is the tiered approach. Staying with power supplies, there are very minor differences between the 3 power base platforms for the Platinum DACs. They only make one chassis and one board. They basically take a few components out: a capacitor here, a transformer there, bit of thin aluminium shielding, etc. yet the price difference between the very similar power supplies is substantial.

But wait, there's more

The list of options puts the German car manufacturers to shame. By example, the remote control will not actually turn the DAC off. For that, you need to pay an extra $500 so the power base will respond to the IR command. Even worse for the Analog DAC, as you cannot change a number of the DACs settings (such as phase, IIRC) without the optional WiFi interface at $1000 (50% more in Europe).

So whilst I enjoy listening to the MSB, I remain resentful of their pricing approach. This is not something I feel about any of my other components. I have the impression they spend as much time engineering their pricing structure as they do on product engineering. I also have the impression that the relevant person at MSB was schooled in marketing and sales at a car dealership, and that up-selling options generates higher margins. It is distasteful, and at odds with the quality of the product itself.