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Old 12-23-2013, 08:14 PM
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Default 6H30 Tube recommendations

I sold my LS15 when I ran across a mint LS16 MKII which uses the pair of 6H30 tube topography, as opposed to the quad of 6922s of the LS15. I'm looking for recommendations on 6H30 tube upgrades over the stock ones. Any knowledgeable input would be appreciated.
Happy Holidays,
Jim

I am loving the new Preamp by BTW!
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Main Rig > Audio Research LS17SE - MS Phonomena II+ (mono Arm), PS Audio GCPH (stereo arm), Phonomena II+ (TD-125MkII), updated Aragon 4004 MkII(2) (Bass panels, and Subs), Quicksilver M60 MonoBlocks (EL34L Blue bottle) (midrange panels) Quicksilver Mini Mono Blocks (Svetlana EL34) (Ribbons) Beringer DCX2496 (analog outputs/power supply upgrades by Selectronic of France) - NHT X1 Crossovers, Clearaudio Solution w/Master Solution upgrades/Audiomods Series 5/ZYX R100 Yatra, Jelco 750L/Ortofon 2m Mono, Thorens TD125MkII/ClearAudio Verify CF/Shelter 501 II Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD, Teac A4300 R2R, Dell Laptop w/Meridian Explorer DAC, Maple Framed Magnepan MGIIIa(tri-amped), NHT W2 Sub(2)
Vintage > Yamaha C70 preamp, Yamaha T70 Tuner, Acurus A200, Modified Thorens TD160/Project 9CC/Ebony nude Denon DL103, , Marantz SA8003 SACD, Yamaha NS690 MkI
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Old 12-23-2013, 08:27 PM
Bodhisattva
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Hi Jim, I used to own an Ayon CD-5s which employs a quad of 6H30 triodes in the output stage. I upgraded the factory EB's to a quad of matched 6H30P-DR's, so I might be able to offer some insight. The DR's are mil-spec tubes which were made in the Soviet era for sensitive military applications such as the Soviet space program. As such, they had to be more accurate, reliable and have longer tube life. Upgrading the output tubes to DR's will provide a good improvement in resolution /frequency extension, noise, dynamics & durability (10,000 vs 5000hrs).

The person to speak to is Chris at PCX who is the President. He buys most of his stock from 1986. I recall Chris commenting he preferred the sound of stock from that year, but Chris will tell you that all mil-spec 6h30DR's prior to 1991 all sound about the same, with very minimal variance. PCX also test over 3 of 5 specs (ie: the most critical specs) and supplies tightly matched quads with the individual measurements for each tube recorded on the tube box. That said, PCX are currently out of stock of the DR's, but you could email him and enquire if he is likely to be getting any stock in future.

If you prefer warmer sounding output tubes, you could also consider cryo-treated EH Gold pins which are another excellent option (and quite a bit cheaper). Here is a link fyi -
cryoset.com/catalog

It is generally accepted the 6h30p-DR is the best variant of the 6h30 tube, although ultimately it depends on your personal preferences. Hope that helps

Cheers,

Last edited by jdandy; 12-26-2013 at 08:52 PM. Reason: Active links to non-sponser seller against forum rules.
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Old 12-23-2013, 08:34 PM
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Thanks for the input.
Regards,
Jim
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It's all about the Music, but I sure like the way my gear makes it come alive!

Main Rig > Audio Research LS17SE - MS Phonomena II+ (mono Arm), PS Audio GCPH (stereo arm), Phonomena II+ (TD-125MkII), updated Aragon 4004 MkII(2) (Bass panels, and Subs), Quicksilver M60 MonoBlocks (EL34L Blue bottle) (midrange panels) Quicksilver Mini Mono Blocks (Svetlana EL34) (Ribbons) Beringer DCX2496 (analog outputs/power supply upgrades by Selectronic of France) - NHT X1 Crossovers, Clearaudio Solution w/Master Solution upgrades/Audiomods Series 5/ZYX R100 Yatra, Jelco 750L/Ortofon 2m Mono, Thorens TD125MkII/ClearAudio Verify CF/Shelter 501 II Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD, Teac A4300 R2R, Dell Laptop w/Meridian Explorer DAC, Maple Framed Magnepan MGIIIa(tri-amped), NHT W2 Sub(2)
Vintage > Yamaha C70 preamp, Yamaha T70 Tuner, Acurus A200, Modified Thorens TD160/Project 9CC/Ebony nude Denon DL103, , Marantz SA8003 SACD, Yamaha NS690 MkI
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Old 12-23-2013, 10:33 PM
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I'm using Reflektor 6H30P-DRs in my CT-5; they are mil-spec as David points out and reputed to be extremely durable. They are an improvement over a "regular" 6H30.

With 6H30s, there's not much in the way of tube rolling you can do; it's pretty much a standard one or the mil-spec DR version.
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Last edited by Puma Cat; 12-23-2013 at 10:35 PM.
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Old 12-24-2013, 01:59 AM
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In early 2005, Euguene Karna of Conus Audio made a trip to mother Russia to bring back the last remaining 1500pcs of 6H30Pi-DR. He had pre-sold 700 of these, mostly to The Tube Store. The DR is a NOS tube; there are no replaceable lots. Since 2005 Eugene's haul has dribbled out and the tube gone up in price. In late 2004 - around the time the 6H30 was adopted by ARC to replace the 6922 - the DR varietal was going for $30 ea and today the price is ~ $175-$200+ a piece. The tube has been subject to some imprint misinformation and to counterfeiting. Here is an interesting page on differences between the DR and the EB.

I don't believe there are any differences electrically between DR and EB of the same vintage; the DR went through more scrutinized testing for military use. Perhaps new manufactured EBs are not of the same standard but as far as I know both DR and EB are capable of a 7500-10000hr life span.

I've run DR, EB and cryo'ed EB versions in a variety of Conrad Johnson and Audio Research gear. The DR has a wee bit less grain, slightly improved top-end extension and slightly better focus. However, imo the difference is marginal - no where near the difference between, say, an Amperex 7308 vs a Telefunken. I love tube rolling but did not find the value in the DR premium. Usual caveats apply.
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Old 12-26-2013, 08:18 PM
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Great info here. I checked my tubes, and they are Sovtek 6H30EB. Would the investment in Gold Pin EH 6H30 EB's make sense?
Regards,
Jim
__________________
It's all about the Music, but I sure like the way my gear makes it come alive!

Main Rig > Audio Research LS17SE - MS Phonomena II+ (mono Arm), PS Audio GCPH (stereo arm), Phonomena II+ (TD-125MkII), updated Aragon 4004 MkII(2) (Bass panels, and Subs), Quicksilver M60 MonoBlocks (EL34L Blue bottle) (midrange panels) Quicksilver Mini Mono Blocks (Svetlana EL34) (Ribbons) Beringer DCX2496 (analog outputs/power supply upgrades by Selectronic of France) - NHT X1 Crossovers, Clearaudio Solution w/Master Solution upgrades/Audiomods Series 5/ZYX R100 Yatra, Jelco 750L/Ortofon 2m Mono, Thorens TD125MkII/ClearAudio Verify CF/Shelter 501 II Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD, Teac A4300 R2R, Dell Laptop w/Meridian Explorer DAC, Maple Framed Magnepan MGIIIa(tri-amped), NHT W2 Sub(2)
Vintage > Yamaha C70 preamp, Yamaha T70 Tuner, Acurus A200, Modified Thorens TD160/Project 9CC/Ebony nude Denon DL103, , Marantz SA8003 SACD, Yamaha NS690 MkI
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Old 12-28-2013, 06:14 AM
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6H30 is manufactured by New Sensor in Russia. They are sold under Sovtek and Electro Harmonix brands. Except for pins I know of no difference between these tubes and I have measured some..
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Old 12-28-2013, 08:01 AM
Bodhisattva
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ehoove View Post
Great info here. I checked my tubes, and they are Sovtek 6H30EB. Would the investment in Gold Pin EH 6H30 EB's make sense?
Regards,
Jim
Hi Jim, the stock EH Gold Pins are fuller sounding, smoother, more romantic in the midrange and have a bit more presence in the bass. Highs are also a bit softer. Sovteks are the more lively, faster sounding tubes. The cryo-treated Gold Pins however retain the same warmth and smoothness, with an increase in resolution, dynamic range and speed. The Reflektor 6H30P-DR's are still better overall and have the advantage of longer tube life, but the cryo-treated Gold pins offer more of the sonic goodies of the DR's without the ticket shock!
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Old 12-29-2013, 10:46 AM
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I had an ARC LS16MKII for several years, (I was also an ARC dealer for many years). I found the "DR" version of the 6H30 tubes to be FAR superior in sound over any of the regular 6H30 variety, including any gold pin type.

IMHO, the "DR" really is a major improvement and well worth the investment. Plus they last a very long time.
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Old 12-29-2013, 11:48 AM
Bodhisattva
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mraudio View Post
I had an ARC LS16MKII for several years, (I was also an ARC dealer for many years). I found the "DR" version of the 6H30 tubes to be FAR superior in sound over any of the regular 6H30 variety, including any gold pin type.

IMHO, the "DR" really is a major improvement and well worth the investment. Plus they last a very long time.
Yeah i'd agree with that. In saying that, I found the cryo-treated EH Gold Pins to be a good bit better than stand Sovtek EB's and at about 1/5th the price!
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