just thoughts......

[BillK]

I agree on the PH8 and LS27 being a good match for what he wants to spend, but as always a careful audition is warranted.

I wanted to like the LS27 but was disappointed.

[larevoj]

There are two camps:

1) All electronics from the same brand and some to the extreme includes speakers and accessories.
2) Mix and match to your preferred sound.

I used to have all electronics from the same brand (Camp 1) but now I see the benefits to mix and match according to the sound I prefer. However, folks in camp 2 tends to take longer but the process and results are usually rewarding.

Audition or home trail to see if it fits your taste

[Fabiano]

Billk, larevoj and karsajid,

Thanks all for the inputs. You guys have opened my mind to even other options.

Bill, my budget is around $13k extra, but in case I decide to sell my C2300, I can probably get another $6k for it.

I should have mentioned before, but the upgrade from the mc402 to 2 x mc601 are already on the way. Just waiting for delivery.

I really like Mc sound signature and there is no wish really to stir away from it. This whole thing started with the wish to upgrade only the phono section of the C2300. Since I have a close friend that has very similar setup (futuras + 601) but uses Ref5, which i really like also, I opened my options to include a ref 5 on the equation, but going for the less expensive PH8 (compared to the Ref2).

I am really excited with some of the responses here regarding just getting the Ref2 and leave the rest as it is. Some have warned me that Ref5 + PH8 has to low overall gain (tks for this heads up), but do you know if the C2300 + PH8 would have this same low overall gain?? If I am not mistaken, C2300 (15dB) + PH8 (58dB), is it too low?? only 3dB more than ref5+ph8.

Once again, thanks a lot for all the help.

[SundayNiagara]

My suggestion is to go for the SE phono, especially if you use extremely low-output moving coils. Then, you are not limited in any way.

[microstrip]

Originally Posted by BillK

I agree on the PH8 and LS27 being a good match for what he wants to spend, but as always a careful audition is warranted.

I wanted to like the LS27 but was disappointed.

BillK,

From my experience with several Audio Research pieces using the 6h30 tubes and the new capacitors used in the REF5 and CD8 - no direct experience with the ls27 - it seems your listening opinions are based on listening at around 200-300 hours. This is the worst phase of burn-in. These ARC new units usually play nice for the first tens of hours, degrade significantly after them and only reach their best again after 400-500 hours. Please do not ask me why!

[TMcD]

Agreed, my Ref 5 did not reach its full potential till between 500 - 600 hours, but after that wow!

Thinking of the SE upgrade down the road, but I am concerned I will have to go through break in again.

[BillK]

The person I talked to at ARC specifically stated this regarding the LS-27:

Bass and treble, and overall musicality will be affected by break-in, but it's our experience that apparent soundstage width remains unchanged from when the unit is new.

[Fabiano]

Guys, thanks a lot for all the inputs. I will start my long process trying to listen to these components. I have relatively easy access to audition a PH8 and will have to work harder to listen to a ref 2. In the future, i will post my findings here.

[Barry1]

Originally Posted by microstrip

BillK,

From my experience with several Audio Research pieces using the 6h30 tubes and the new capacitors used in the REF5 and CD8 - no direct experience with the ls27 - it seems your listening opinions are based on listening at around 200-300 hours. This is the worst phase of burn-in. These ARC new units usually play nice for the first tens of hours, degrade significantly after them and only reach their best again after 400-500 hours. Please do not ask me why!

This break-in comment follows my experience exactly with ARC Ref 40.

[BillK]

Right, but I don't see what the ARC rep would have to gain by not telling the truth; instead he was honest and ARC has my respect as a result even if they didn't sell me an LS-27.