New JL Audio Subs Owner

[blacsno]

The subs have been installed for about a month now. I fully understand why dual over mono in a two channel. The sound stage is fuller and much more detailed. I've finally added Wire World silver XLR 7, and power chords seven series, which enhanced the sound even further. I went with the fully balanced setup.

Here is my question..... I have the McIntosh MEN220 and the JL Audio subs both have their own built-in room correction tools. Which room correction do I use MEN220 or JL's A.R.O's? If both how?

Ken

[Masterlu]

Ken... for subs, I just use ARO.

[chessman]

Ken, when I have had EQ other than ARO that I could use with or instead of ARO, I found that ARO alone worked best.

[o0OBillO0o]

For what it's worth the JL audio ARO is applied to a single EQ band only.

Originally Posted by o0OBillO0o

It sits between the C2500 and the MC275 pair/JL Audio chain and acts as active Crossover and DSP processor (no EQ).

MEN220 set to:
HIGHPASS:40hz, Linkwitz Riley 4th Order
LOWPASS:160hz, Linkwitz Riley 4th Order
Same output levels: 0.0dB
Ran RoomPerfect: 99% Room Knowledge with 7 measurements, and 3 focus positions.

After watching a few movies, with the MEN220 set to GLOBAL and NEUTRAL, I felt the bass impact was much more visceral. Even a car door's "foley effect" sound really "thud" close in a believable reproduction.

Right now, the benefits outweigh the drawbacks.

I'll also add that I run lowpass as LOWPASS Mono.

The instructions cover all this if you need to read more.

I don't know which one is superior, but I use the RoomPerfect DSP for multi band DSP correction.

Note: These are two systems that you have to consider both when optimizing the sound output.

[chessman]

For what it's worth the JL audio ARO is applied to a singe EQ band only.

While a true comment, it obscures what IMO is the real issue. For natural sounding bass, it is far more important to have relatively even decay times than a flat frequency response. I have used EQ to hammer out a table top flat frequency response graph only to have it sound artificial. While ARO is in fact single band, its real virtue is finding and attenuating the most resonant frequency. If each sub is set as master and run alone for the ARO test the results will be very lifelike, even if the frequency response graph is not perfectly flat.

[eljr]

Originally Posted by chessman

While a true comment, it obscures what IMO is the real issue. For natural sounding bass, it is far more important to have relatively even decay times than a flat frequency response. I have used EQ to hammer out a table top flat frequency response graph only to have it sound artificial. While ARO is in fact single band, its real virtue is finding and attenuating the most resonant frequency. If each sub is set as master and run alone for the ARO test the results will be very lifelike, even if the frequency response graph is not perfectly flat.

Great post.

[Masterlu]

Originally Posted by chessman

While a true comment, it obscures what IMO is the real issue. For natural sounding bass, it is far more important to have relatively even decay times than a flat frequency response. I have used EQ to hammer out a table top flat frequency response graph only to have it sound artificial. While ARO is in fact single band, its real virtue is finding and attenuating the most resonant frequency. If each sub is set as master and run alone for the ARO test the results will be very lifelike, even if the frequency response graph is not perfectly flat.

Aside from agreeing with Randy's post above; each and every time I have tried Room Perfect, all that was acheived was complete Bass suck out. This is why I leave the subs off when using RP and letting ARO do its job for the subs, regardless how many are in use.

[blacsno]

So I route the subs to the C2300 vs Men220? Then apply use ARO for sub and the Men220 the mains?

[blacsno]

Originally Posted by Masterlu

Aside from agreeing with Randy's post above; each and every time I have tried Room Perfect, all that was acheived was complete Bass suck out. This is why I leave the subs off when using RP and letting ARO do its job for the subs, regardless how many are in use.

Ahhhhh I get it! Finally the sequence of events of application! Thanks

[o0OBillO0o]

Originally Posted by chessman

While a true comment, it obscures what IMO is the real issue. For natural sounding bass, it is far more important to have relatively even decay times than a flat frequency response. I have used EQ to hammer out a table top flat frequency response graph only to have it sound artificial. While ARO is in fact single band, its real virtue is finding and attenuating the most resonant frequency. If each sub is set as master and run alone for the ARO test the results will be very lifelike, even if the frequency response graph is not perfectly flat.

I'm not savvy enough to explain to which one is better, but can you help me (at least) out in understanding why even decay times are better than flat frequency response?

Why set each sub to master? I mean I read the same reviews as anyone else-that extol the method you mention. The manual provides a guide for multiple subs. There isn't any hard data that supported either way. In the end, the resultant response is a system response and measuring individual responses then joining them together is just as much as craft-work as rest of HiFi. Our ears hear the system response, why not measure ARO or RP the same way? What about running ARO along, then RP with ARO Active?

Originally Posted by Masterlu

Aside from agreeing with Randy's post above; each and every time I have tried Room Perfect, all that was acheived was complete Bass suck out. This is why I leave the subs off when using RP and letting ARO do its job for the subs, regardless how many are in use.

Ivan, I know what you're experiencing. I believe it is the fact that listeners just do not like "flat" and we all enjoy the room gain. I can't comment on how my music sounded in the mastering room, but I imagine it's just a flat as can be and the music was allowed to have the greatest effect. The great thing about the MEN220 or the JL Sub is that end users can tweak the calibrated settings to voice the speaker the way they desire the resultant sound system to sound like.

There is no exact way, I have done all the methods described and today I feel that I am getting the best by using RP and EQ. I do enjoy reading how other do it differently.