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  #111  
Old 07-16-2011, 10:08 AM
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Rafale Rafale is offline
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Originally Posted by metaphacts View Post
Elipsa can be a little more difficult to set up to the nth degree because of the 2pi baffle. The baffle helps to intergrate the mid to woofer smoothly but if you are not careful you can make a bass choice that thins out the bottom of the midrange while it brings the mids forward a bit. The mistake most commonly occurs when using female vocals to assess/choose the position before you have solidified and linearized bass positioning. Female voice is the biggest liar in audio - at least where speaker positioning is concerned. You need information that bridges the range through the woofer-mid crossover. You need to build on top of an extended, powerful, linear bass response to determine where the speaker needs to/can be for the rest of the spectrum.

Working carefully with Elipsa to get the bass right, especially the linearity, is the key to getting it to do the special things that Elipsa does.
Thank you for these advices, very useful
btw read you the Futura review by Colloms ?
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  #112  
Old 07-16-2011, 10:16 AM
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Thank you for these advices, very useful
btw read you the Futura review by Colloms ?
No. What did he say?
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  #113  
Old 07-16-2011, 11:01 AM
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No. What did he say?
This is what said MC :

Even when fully tuned, the AF is undoubtedly concert hall Row 20 than Row 5 and is certainly rather sweeter than the earlier SF Stradivarius or indeed its AA, at least when i last heard it. At the same time it has classically voiced character, generating convincingly natural and spacious perspectives in soundstage, and never jumps up on you or overcrowds the sence of spaciousness.
the soundstage per se is focused mainly in the space between the loudspeakers,this speaker illuminating the listening room acoustic rather less than some others. Thiq leads to a dryer sounding presentation but still with fine image focus and very good depth and transparency-here at least essentially achieving the standard required in this class.
It does play rock, in terms of bass power and extension but in rather adult manner with more refinement and elegance than the more frenetic pulsing drive that is often desired. To some degree the effect depends on the bass lines present and the record production, where the complexity of this speakers's bass design seems to leave the details and tune playing largely in place, while running at a more sedate pace than say a Wilson audio Sophia 3 or an Avalon Diamond. Nevertheless honour is largely satisfied by the sheer elegance of the vocal rendition, and a pure, silky treble that's devoid of sibilant distorsions, tizz or grain.
It's not particularly powerful for a speaker in its price class, and heavy driving results in a degree of softening and thickening at low frequencies, for example on that closely focused Jean Guillou organ recording of Mussorgsky's Pictures at an exhibition ( Organ Transcriptions 1989 Dorian DOR-90117). Here it is good plus rather than excellent and i suspect the modestly dimensioned bass ports may be partly responsible for the perceptible dynamic constraint at low frequencies. However this is an at the limit observation, and i reckon most listeners would consider that the bass is notably even, well extended and a tribute to the graded multiple bass systems that are used here.
Viewed overall the AF is delightfully easy on ear with a full tonal balance that could be described as classically mature. The low fatigue factor allows relaxed listening to be experienced for hours on end. Conversely it also sounds rather restrained dynamically. Transients are softened though not defocused, dynamic expression is a little muted, though remember we are judging at a very high standard here. I the tried my trusty and then notably neutral Linn LP12 based vinyl replay system and felt the sound was rather too laid back, a little too rich for my taste, moving now to Row 40 and not really well suited to analogue RnB. But perhaps that was never the intention of the design team.
i remember it at its best when auditioned with a fine digital recording, the lights switched off, and a string orchestra playing Vivaldi recorded in a church acoustic. This provided near magical transportation to the actual event lacking hardly any sense of mechanical repoduction. Martin Colloms Hifi Critic vol15/n2 april-june 2011

reference components :
WA sophia 3, Quad ESL63,BBC LS3/5 A 15 ohm, BW 805D
Naim NAP 250, Krell evo 402e, ARC REF 5 pre
Niam DAC, Marantz CD7, Linn Akurate DS, LP12/keel/Radikal/ Naim ARO/Koetsu Urishi Vermilion/ Naim superline + supercap
transparent XL MM2 and VDH the first ultimate
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LP12SE,urika phonostage,radikal power supply, dynavector XV-1s,conrad-johnson GAT and LP275M, Sonus Faber Elipsa,yter/naim/Linn cables, vibex, finite elemente
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  #114  
Old 07-16-2011, 05:17 PM
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metaphacts metaphacts is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafale View Post
This is what said MC :

Even when fully tuned, the AF is undoubtedly concert hall Row 20 than Row 5 and is certainly rather sweeter than the earlier SF Stradivarius or indeed its AA, at least when i last heard it. At the same time it has classically voiced character, generating convincingly natural and spacious perspectives in soundstage, and never jumps up on you or overcrowds the sence of spaciousness.
the soundstage per se is focused mainly in the space between the loudspeakers,this speaker illuminating the listening room acoustic rather less than some others. Thiq leads to a dryer sounding presentation but still with fine image focus and very good depth and transparency-here at least essentially achieving the standard required in this class.
It does play rock, in terms of bass power and extension but in rather adult manner with more refinement and elegance than the more frenetic pulsing drive that is often desired. To some degree the effect depends on the bass lines present and the record production, where the complexity of this speakers's bass design seems to leave the details and tune playing largely in place, while running at a more sedate pace than say a Wilson audio Sophia 3 or an Avalon Diamond. Nevertheless honour is largely satisfied by the sheer elegance of the vocal rendition, and a pure, silky treble that's devoid of sibilant distorsions, tizz or grain.
It's not particularly powerful for a speaker in its price class, and heavy driving results in a degree of softening and thickening at low frequencies, for example on that closely focused Jean Guillou organ recording of Mussorgsky's Pictures at an exhibition ( Organ Transcriptions 1989 Dorian DOR-90117). Here it is good plus rather than excellent and i suspect the modestly dimensioned bass ports may be partly responsible for the perceptible dynamic constraint at low frequencies. However this is an at the limit observation, and i reckon most listeners would consider that the bass is notably even, well extended and a tribute to the graded multiple bass systems that are used here.
Viewed overall the AF is delightfully easy on ear with a full tonal balance that could be described as classically mature. The low fatigue factor allows relaxed listening to be experienced for hours on end. Conversely it also sounds rather restrained dynamically. Transients are softened though not defocused, dynamic expression is a little muted, though remember we are judging at a very high standard here. I the tried my trusty and then notably neutral Linn LP12 based vinyl replay system and felt the sound was rather too laid back, a little too rich for my taste, moving now to Row 40 and not really well suited to analogue RnB. But perhaps that was never the intention of the design team.
i remember it at its best when auditioned with a fine digital recording, the lights switched off, and a string orchestra playing Vivaldi recorded in a church acoustic. This provided near magical transportation to the actual event lacking hardly any sense of mechanical repoduction. Martin Colloms Hifi Critic vol15/n2 april-june 2011

reference components :
WA sophia 3, Quad ESL63,BBC LS3/5 A 15 ohm, BW 805D
Naim NAP 250, Krell evo 402e, ARC REF 5 pre
Niam DAC, Marantz CD7, Linn Akurate DS, LP12/keel/Radikal/ Naim ARO/Koetsu Urishi Vermilion/ Naim superline + supercap
transparent XL MM2 and VDH the first ultimate
Meh. It's a typical Martin review - no more no less, including a couple of the comments that let you see his speaker design consultant side. Get's some of it and some of it is undoubtedly due to his system set up. Not too bad I guess, even with the misses.

I should have some of our MASTERS attendees from 2 weeks ago comment of the low frequency power, extension, and clarity of Futura using, interestingly enough, organ music. But heck we had a real monster driving the Futura - the 50w Musica.
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  #115  
Old 07-17-2011, 07:46 PM
VT Skier VT Skier is offline
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I've heard them twice, once with Boulder separates (?) (Bill, correct me if I'm wrong) at the Montreal Hi Fi show, and once with a Boulder integrated, and I did not hear anything like a "perceptible dynamic constraint at low frequencies".

In fact, I would have said the opposite, if I only knew what reviewers mean when they write things like "perceptible dynamic constraint". As opposed to the imperceptible one that my dog complained about?
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  #116  
Old 07-18-2011, 01:51 AM
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I've heard them twice, once with Boulder separates (?) (Bill, correct me if I'm wrong) at the Montreal Hi Fi show, and once with a Boulder integrated, and I did not hear anything like a "perceptible dynamic constraint at low frequencies".

In fact, I would have said the opposite, if I only knew what reviewers mean when they write things like "perceptible dynamic constraint". As opposed to the imperceptible one that my dog complained about?
Go to Hi Fi Critics forum and challenge him on it! I'm sure he's game to join in.
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  #117  
Old 07-18-2011, 02:27 PM
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His review is very strange it blows the cold and the warmth
In 2006 concerning Amati anniverserio homage he gave the maximal note 20/20 in HI-FI news and his conclusion was:
Spacious, focused, dynamic exciting powerful and reveaaling, the Amati hits many important targets spot on. It turns musical reproduction into an event and such commitment to convincing sound quality is rare. .....This outstanding speaker carries my enthusiastic recommendation
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  #118  
Old 07-18-2011, 02:44 PM
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Reviews are always to be taken with a grain of salt. One persons accurate mids might be thin for me, what some called warm might be called mush by others, bright highs could be extended highs for someone else.

Jim
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AMP's: Momentum M-400's
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  #119  
Old 07-18-2011, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Still-One View Post
Reviews are always to be taken with a grain of salt. One persons accurate mids might be thin for me, what some called warm might be called mush by others, bright highs could be extended highs for someone else.
Jim.......My point exactly. The opinion I am most concerned with is mine.
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STUDIO - McIntosh C1000C/P, MC2301 (2), MR88, Aurender N10, Esoteric K-01X, Sonos Connect, PurePower 2000, Stillpoints, Furutech Flux 50, Michell Gyro SE, Michell HR Power Supply, SME 309, Ortofon Cadenza Black, Wireworld, Sonus faber Amati Anniversario
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  #120  
Old 07-18-2011, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdandy View Post
Jim.......My point exactly. The opinion I am most concerned with is mine.
Dan
+1
I am sure we all like it when someone validates our opinion, but in the end it really does not matter.
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AMP's: Momentum M-400's
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Digital:dCS Vivaldi DAC, Clock & Upsampler
Analog:SME 20/3 , Esoteric E-03, Benz Ruby
Speakers: Wilson Alexandria X2 Series 2
Cables: Transparent Opus Speaker & Interconnects & Power Cords
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