SACD vs HD

[Mille162]

Im 99% vinyl (1% radio), but enjoy doing A/B comparisons between different pressings. Recent sessions at a friends house has us also comparing his SACD’s to the our favorite vinyl pressings.

This has me wanting a digital source in my system to do the same at home. Since memory is cheap in comparison, is there a difference between a SACD output (digital) and reading the same digital file off of a HD?

I realize the DAC built-in to the SACD is half the sound, but I could prob spend less (and have my friends full library) by going the “music server” route and a stand alone DAC.

Please let me know if you’ve done any A/B comparisons to using a HD and what your overall thoughts are. Also, what your preferred hardware and software was for the server.

Txs

-Ron

[crwilli]

The digital output of SACDs is not enabled unless it is via a proprietary cable to DAC made by the SACD player’s manufacturer. You have to rip the SACD to DSD/DSF file in order to stream it.

Anyway, there are a TON of variables possible with the equipment you can use to stream digital files that makes it impossible to answer your question without knowing the equipment.

You will also read here that the DAC is not the end all answer of the SQ of a digital system/file. There are other things involved.

I use a dedicated purpose built PC as my server. I use ROON as my library manager/streamer to the DAC of my Esoteric K-03X. My files are located on a NAS.

I cannot tell any difference between an SACD played in the K03x or it’s ripped DSD version from my NAS. I do not have a TT so can’t make those comparisons.

[Formerly YB-2]

Craig - know you are a proponent of DSD and am wondering if one must rip CDs into DSD file format to play them back as DSD files or can one rip in FLAC files and play back as DSD? Do know from you that my Oppo 203 will not rip SACDs. Can one rip SACDs from using the Sony UBP-X1000ES?

If I understand correctly the Sony HAP-Z1ES has the built-in capability to play FLAC files as DSD. Do you know if this is unique to the Sony or will all/most servers do the same?

[crwilli]

Hey Glenn,

I only listen to DSD in native format. Eg only from ripped versions of my SACD or Downloads.

You can only rip CDs to 16/44.1 formats. FLAC is one and a good one.

The Sony along with many other DACs/Streamers etc offer the capability of playing your FLAC or other files in DSD but it is a manipulation of some sort (I have no idea how). I find playing a files Native format best and never upsample or try converting to DSD in the DAC on the fly.

I will have to research your Sony player’s capability to rip SACDs. (I suspect not)

Update : Your player is not cited as having the vulnerable chipset needed but it is so new that is not surprising. Further, since it is a Blu-ray player and so new, I highly doubt it can be manipulated to archive your SACDs.

Need a player that uses the MediaTek MT8560 or MT8580 chipsets. “like Oppo 103/105, Cambridge Audio 752bd/cxu, Pioneer bdp-lx58/88 ) or MT8560 (like Pioneer BDP-160, 170 and BDP-80FD” from computer audiophile dot com.

[crwilli]

Apologies to the OP for the diversion here.

[Kal Rubinson]

Originally Posted by Formerly YB-2

Craig - know you are a proponent of DSD and am wondering if one must rip CDs into DSD file format to play them back as DSD files or can one rip in FLAC files and play back as DSD?

That is not possible. One can reconvert them to DSD but it only introduces more variables.

Do know from you that my Oppo 203 will not rip SACDs. Can one rip SACDs from using the Sony UBP-X1000ES?

AFAIK, no.

If I understand correctly the Sony HAP-Z1ES has the built-in capability to play FLAC files as DSD.

That is not possible. One can reconvert them to DSD but it only introduces more variables.

[Formerly YB-2]

Hmm.......... thanks for info Craig & Kal.

Originally Posted by Mille162

This has me wanting a digital source in my system to do the same at home. Since memory is cheap in comparison, is there a difference between a SACD output (digital) and reading the same digital file off of a HD?
-Ron

To answer this question, DSD digital out from an SACD player should be the same as a DSD file from an HD/SSD. DSD format is DSD format.

Hopefully, Ron (the OP) is learning about ripping SACDs, as I am.

Craig - you ripped your SACDs using your K-03x?

My goal is to get rid of my CDP once my library of discs is ripped, except for ripping use on that odd occasion, so I do not see an Esoteric CDP in my future. With only 30-40 SACDs think I'll either have to be happy with FLAC files or depend on the generosity of others in ripping SACD files. Will also guess that Ron will depend on his friend for ripping SACD files as it doesn't make much sense (at least to me) to purchase a CDP solely for ripping the relatively few SACDs available. While I was convinced that I wanted 'the disc' in my hot little hands, I know downloads are the wave of the future. So much so that Samsung has just announced that they will no longer produce disc spinners of any sort.

[crwilli]

Originally Posted by Formerly YB-2

Hmm.......... thanks for info Craig & Kal.


To answer this question, DSD digital out from an SACD player should be the same as a DSD file from an HD/SSD. DSD format is DSD format.

—— Sort of, only you can’t get the DSD stream ‘out’ of a SACD player - unless it goes from the player to a DAC using a proprietary connection.

You can’t take that stream and connect it to any DAC...


Hopefully, Ron (the OP) is learning about ripping SACDs, as I am.

Craig - you ripped your SACDs using your K-03x?

——- No, I use an OPPO 103 to archive my SACDs.

My goal is to get rid of my CDP once my library of discs is ripped, except for ripping use on that odd occasion, so I do not see an Esoteric CDP in my future. With only 30-40 SACDs think I'll either have to be happy with FLAC files or depend on the generosity of others in ripping SACD files. Will also guess that Ron will depend on his friend for ripping SACD files as it doesn't make much sense (at least to me) to purchase a CDP solely for ripping the relatively few SACDs available. While I was convinced that I wanted 'the disc' in my hot little hands, I know downloads are the wave of the future. So much so that Samsung has just announced that they will no longer produce disc spinners of any sort.

See my two inputs above ——-

[Kal Rubinson]

Originally Posted by Formerly YB-2

To answer this question, DSD digital out from an SACD player should be the same as a DSD file from an HD/SSD. DSD format is DSD format.

Sorta. In between, there may be differences as the files stored on the HD/server can be in ISO, DSF or DFF form (as well as some others).

Craig - you ripped your SACDs using your K-03x?

Not likely but I, too, would like to know.

My goal is to get rid of my CDP once my library of discs is ripped,.......................... While I was convinced that I wanted 'the disc' in my hot little hands, I know downloads are the wave of the future. So much so that Samsung has just announced that they will no longer produce disc spinners of any sort.

I have done this with all the files in either FLAC (from all PCM sources) or DSF. It has been a transforming and positive change.

[nicoff]

Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson

....
I have done this with all the files in either FLAC (from all PCM sources) or DSF. It has been a transforming and positive change.

I have done the same and fully agree that it is a transforming and positive change.

As noted by crwilli, in order to be able to rip SACDs you need players that meet the following conditions: "a player that uses the MediaTek MT8560 or MT8580 chipsets. “like Oppo 103/105, Cambridge Audio 752bd/cxu, Pioneer bdp-lx58/88 ) or MT8560 (like Pioneer BDP-160, 170 and BDP-80FD”. I own an Oppo 105 and used it to rip all my SACD discs.

The Sony HAP-Z1ES CAN convert FLAC files, WAV files, etc. to DSD64 for listening. It does so on-the-fly but you cannot save the DSD file.

A music player like HQPlayer can also take any type of lower resolution file, convert it to DSD, and upsample it up to 512DSD. This is also done on-the-fly but it does require lots of computer power. I use HQPlayer and I can now listen to ALL my CDs (stored in FLAC) in 512DSD.

Formerly YB-2 asked: "...am wondering if one must rip CDs into DSD file format to play them back as DSD files or can one rip in FLAC files and play back as DSD?". You cannot rip a CD into DSD. But you can rip a CD, save the file as FLAC/WAV/AIFF/Etc and convert that file to DSD during playback as noted above.