#51
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Road trip!
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Ivan FLORIDA MX136, MC1.2KW(10) MC2KW(2), MCD1100, MS750(2) MVP881, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT-2 SUBS(2) HT3F(2) WS350(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) XCS350(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" MOTORIZED SCREEN, CINEMA-TECH SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES Reference System: ACCUPHASE A300 AMPS, C3900 PRE-AMP, DP1000 CD/SACD TRANSPORT, DC1000 DIGITAL PROCESSOR, DG-68 DIGITAL EQUALIZER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, PS1230 POWER SUPPLY, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WW PLATINUM CABLES CAPE COD MX150, MC501(2) MC1.2KW(10) MC2301(2) MR88, MVP881, MCD1100, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, ESOTERIC K-01X 30th ANNIVERSARY (BLACK) SACD/CD PLAYER, G02-X CLOCK, HT3F(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(4) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) KALEIDESCAPE STRATO & TERRA SERVERS 80-TB, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" SCREEN, SONUS FABER STRADIVARI, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, FORTRESS SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES Analog Rig: CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD, UNIVERSAL ARM w/ Da VINCI' CART, 2nd UNIVERSAL ARM w/ GOLDFINGER STATEMENT CART, HRS-MXR REFERENCE RACK-GLOSS BLACK w/ M3X SHELVES, AESTHETIX RHEA SIG PHONO-PRE, BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, WW PLATINUM CABLES Reference System: BURMESTER 911MK3 AMP(3), 088 PRE-AMP, 089 CD PLAYER, 100 PHONO PRE-AMP, 948 POWER CONDITIONER, ACCUPHASE DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, AVID ACUTUS REFERENCE SP TT, GRAHAM PHANTOM II SUPREME ARM, BENZ MICRO LP-S CART, GRANDIOSO P1X/D1X STACK, G1X RUBIDIUM MASTER CLOCK, N05 NETWORK PLAYER, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, SONUS FABER AIDA SPEAKERS, JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(2) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) WW PLATINUM CABLES Library System: GRANDIOSO M1 MONOBLOCK AMPS, C1 LINESTAGE PRE-AMP, K1X CD/SACD PLAYER, G1 MASTER RUBIDIUM CLOCK, E02 PHONO-PRE, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, AERIAL ACOUSTICS 20T V2, AERIAL SW12 SUBS(2), CANTON REF K1’s, VPI HRX TT w/ SDS POWER SUPPLY, ORTOFON CADENZA BLACK CART, KLAUDIO RCM, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2, SHUNYATA OMEGA QR’s, WW PLATINUM CABLES Esoteric/Bryston System: ESOTERIC C02-X PRE-AMP, P-02X TRANSPORT, D02-X DAC, G02-X CLOCK, BRYSTON 28B3 CUBED MONOBLOCK AMPS(4), BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2(2) EVEREST 8000 POWER CONDITIONER(2) ALTAIRA CG & SG HUBS, AMR-DP777-SE DAC, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, QUADRASPIRE RACK, WW PLATINUM CABLES Accuphase/Canton System: ACCUPHASE E800 INTEGRATED, DP570 CD/SACD PLAYER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, PS530 POWER SUPPLY, CANTON REF K3’s, CANTON REF K5’s, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS MXR REFERENCE MAHOGHANY RACK w/ M3X2 SHELVES, WW GOLD CABLES |
#52
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I have owned all subs mentioned and two other brands. I really feel the F212 is an amazing sub, it is tight and I think a tad bit quicker than the 113s yet with more power more sq foot of driver and more air movement. I feel it does it all very good. It overs enough cross over and filters steps gain etc to get it done for me in my rig.
If I play scads various genres of music and a few tweaks I did program into my MX150 for movies most always requires no tweaking. Some sound tracks in movies and effects like it Batman with Keith Ledger get too intense. But if one had an even larger room the Gotham would be step up two or more of course. Also JL does make a very nice audiophile grade active crossover if you need even more control. I guess I am a JL convert having owned others. There are a few I know of that may be better but you are getting into 5 figures each for a sub |
#53
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Quote:
Having said that, adding just a single F113 has made a big enough difference in the room to make me less anxious to go out and buy another, but that does seem inevitable. In my pantheon I'd also considered the Rhythm (which became unavailable a few months ago after Harman closed it out) and Funk Audio, but the F113 was a simple solution and came with excellent credentials which it backs up with fine performance at a price I can live with. Last edited by Pampero; 12-27-2016 at 02:18 PM. |
#54
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I appreciate the opportunity to learn about subs by reading these posts. (I'm considering adding a second sub to my basement system.)
FWIW, following is how I handle sub-woofer crossover. I use Oppo universal players that provide "bass management" - i.e., a built-in crossover, and an RCA line-level connection for a powered subwoofer. With Oppo's bass management, the low frequencies are off-loaded from the main amp and speakers. The last 4 generations of Oppo players have bass management (the newer models have adjustments for the crossover): UDP-205, BDP-105, BDP-95, and DV-980H. They all play SACD, CD, and DVD. The newer models play downloaded hi-res FLAC files, Blu-ray (audio and video), and the newest model plays UHD discs. I've chosen the high-end Oppo products because they are "universal players", and have a high-quality DAC built-in. I have all of the Oppo units listed above installed in different stereo hi-fi systems, mostly employing vintage amps. (No AVRs.) The Oppo units listed above all have variable output (i.e., volume control on remote) enabling them to be connected directly to a tube power amp (i.e., no pre-amp) – assuming good system synergy. And, for a vintage integrated amp, they add the convenience of remote volume control. |
#55
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I haven't been too active on this forum lately, but here's an update on my current configuration.
I have added a second F113 and a CR1. The crossover especially has made the whole shebang much easier to dial in and much better all around, just as I knew it would. I now cross over much higher (110 Hz). I arrived at that setting by trial and error. It provides a less "fat" sound but is very tight and tuneful. On the way, I tried crossover points of 40Hz, 80Hz and 100Hz before settling on 110Hz. My settings use the 24dB/octave slopes of the JL CR1. I set levels and phase using Barry Ober's "find the null" technique. That was quite easy and intuitive to do. In my system the settings I have arrived at result in very tight sound with little or no bass hangover (slop). I have also treated the room with four bass traps and gobos at the first reflection points which aided greatly in imaging and focus as well as low end accuracy but that's another story. I found that the higher the crossover point yield subjectively less bass but better tonality and overall integration. I now have very natural bass that is satisfying to my ears and reflects a direct relationship to the amount of low frequency energy in the program material. Folks, you can't really integrate a sub properly with out a good crossover. For most of us, room treatment is also going to be required if we want to make the most of our limited/compromised living spaces. In audio, there don't seem to be many ways around the rules of physics. A nice aspect/side effect of my rig as it is set up now is that I can employ playback levels limited only by the main amplifier's output power. since my room itself is a better environment all around. There are no shortcuts. You need the crossover. You will probably need some consideration of your room's acoustics and at least a modicum of treatment in our smaller domestic spaces. I'm happy to discuss the specifics of my tune but the settings are unique to my room and equipment so once you've assembled the tool kit, you'll need to settle on a sensible methodology for adjusting all the various parameters. As I said previously, there really are no shortcuts. Last edited by Pampero; 03-07-2018 at 10:45 AM. |
#56
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Everyone is different as to how they value a particular component. I had the CR1 with dual JL Audio F110s. I prefer my single F112 without the CR-1. I'll take another F112 over a CR-1 everyday of the week.
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Jeff Rowland 625 S2 amp, Corus preamp, Chord Dave DAC, Antipodes DS GT music server, Monitor Audio PL500 II, dual REL G1 MKII subwoofers and more |
#57
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I'm sorry sirs if I intrude but I have a curiosity:
Anyone has ever compared, at least on paper ehehehe , these two beautiful subwoofers, with what IMHO is a valid and musical sub, that is, the Paradigm Reference Signature SUB25 (now discontinued in America , but not yet in Italy ) ... What do you think of this sub? I think it would tear them up both, ehehehe ... A pic of the monster: Last edited by McIntosh-maTRiX; 03-16-2018 at 12:26 PM. |
#58
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I submit no sub will "tear up" a JL Audio sub; however you may prefer another sub to a JL Audio sub. I've had several subs over the years and like most things it's about individual preferences.
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Jeff Rowland 625 S2 amp, Corus preamp, Chord Dave DAC, Antipodes DS GT music server, Monitor Audio PL500 II, dual REL G1 MKII subwoofers and more |
#59
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I absolutely agree with what you say, but maybe I expressed myself badly in the previous post:
"tear up" in the musical and audiophile sense, not powerful and annoying (like a Pro subwoofer). I apologize for the misleading term. You should hear it... |
#60
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I know what you meant and I responded. Again, it's my opinion no subwoofer will destroy JL Audio or any top end sub musically in an audiophile sense. It doesn't mean you may not prefer something over JL Audio.
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Jeff Rowland 625 S2 amp, Corus preamp, Chord Dave DAC, Antipodes DS GT music server, Monitor Audio PL500 II, dual REL G1 MKII subwoofers and more |
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