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  #21  
Old 08-17-2011, 09:37 PM
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Jerome, I don't mean to divert the thread to another subject but this is somewhat related and may be of interest to you if you are really serious about pursuing Shindo...

Matt, I know John DeVore has demoed his speakers at various shows with Shindo and they are usually thought of as being synergistic. We know there are a few AAers here (Alberto and Serge) who have paired up Shindo with Tannoys and are liking the combo. What are some of the other tube-friendly/Shindo-friendly speakers lines that you have found to be a nice match-up with Shindo amplification? I know every situation is unique and each speaker will have an optimal match-up but if you think in general of stable impedance loads above 6/8 ohm type speakers that are relatively to very efficient (90dB and up), are there any speaker lines that you prefer to demo the Shindo gear with? Thanks
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  #22  
Old 08-17-2011, 09:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C220MC275 View Post
Hello Shindo friends !
I'm about to order a pair of those.
Any thoughts ?
Hi Jérôme, thinking about this further -

Augmenting your setup with a Shindo preamp is something you should seriously consider, if you are looking to move into the Shindo line. More often than not, most of my customers who are looking to benefit from what Shindo has to offer, start with the preamp. Especially, considering you already have a suitable amps for your particular speakers. Then, in the future, as funds permit, you can look toward a Shindo amp, etc.

This way, you have a super linestage and phono at your disposal. Pairing a Maseto or Vosne Romanee to your amp would be quite excellent.

I understand this is not what you had planned on, but it's my recommendation.

-M
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  #23  
Old 08-18-2011, 12:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C220MC275 View Post
Hello Shindo friends !
I'm about to order a pair of those.
Any thoughts ?
Congrats Jerome I know how bad you wanted them
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  #24  
Old 08-18-2011, 01:46 AM
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Ok folks, many good thoughts here. Thanks a lot !

Serge, I'm not sure if I 'm prepared to shop for new speakers if Shindo amps don't match mine. It does not seem very logical to me.
As many here, I think that the logical way to do in audio is to find speakers that you like, and then find the correct amp(s) to drive them.

I cannot ignore Matt's recommendations and yet my experience with low power amps with the EB1i tells me that the 70 W Class A CCQ should be more than enough to drive them the way that I want to.

I haven't been clear about my goal with this project so here I go.

There is nothing wrong to me with the sound of the 2301's. Most of the time, I listen at moderate volumes. Yesterday night, I was listening at Patricia Barber's Fortnight in France, and I wanted to crank the volume up to peaks of 300 W but it does not happen often.
My goal is to have the choice of an other flavor, an other sound, but still with my speakers, as I can't put multiple speakers side by side.

In june, I tried the Verdier 845 Triode Spirit : SET of 20 W in class A. It was able to reach high levels of SPL, although much less than the 2301's.
They were fast, involving and grain free. Indeed they sounded more musical and refined to my ears, for music only without vocals, than the 2301's. The sound was more direct, more alive, yet highly refined. Completely intoxicating. Certainly not as neutral as the 2301's but giving me more pleasure. I was about to write the check for them and was fully under their charm when I listened to a cd of Diana Krall and realized that I did not recognize her ! After many cds and lps of female singers, it was obvious that although things were wonderful for music only, the voices were all presented a tone higher than in the real life. All singers were like 10 to 20 years younger + leaner. The Mcs were head and shoulders above the Verdier for voice reproduction on my speakers. Maybe due to a problem of impedance matching, I don't know. Strange because things were ok for bass and treble. I would not have suspected a problem of impedance for the mids. I told this story to my friend Jean Marc and he immediately said : " the McIntosh mids are the best I know. You won't find better elsewhere if you like this sound".

I told about this to a dealer in Paris who sells highly musical amps and speakers, among them Leben, Ear, Nagra, Verity Audio and he told me this : you always loose a certain degree of finesse and musicality with high power amps. He's willing to let me try at home the Nagra 845 PushPull class A. 2 x 50 W. I asked about their sound to Massimo, a member here that owns both the Nagra amps and the 2301's and he told me that although he did not make an A / B test, the Nagra sounded more refined to his ears compared to the 2301's but of course, less powerful.

All this story reminded me of the will of that dealer to let me the Nagra 845's in my home. This is not often for such gear in France. My ARC dealer, which I bought the Ref2 from a month ago, and my Clearaudio TT told me that he could make a demo of the Ref 5 in my home but could not let it to me for a few days !
I cannot ignore both the kindness of this Nagra dealer and the 845 amps. If they sing the way I want on my speakers, then I may end up buying them or trying the Shindo CCQ ( the Shindo idea will continue to torture me until I hear one ! ). If the Shindo is not my cup of tea, I will sell them and buy the 845.
I'm a bit reluctant to do that because this dealer is so kind and professionnal that I feel it would not be fair to him if I try the 845 and finally end up ordering the CCQ. Maybe I could tell him all the story and propose him to pay for the tryout of the 845 if I don't buy them finally ?

Ordering a Shindo preamp is a no no at this time. Too complicated to have 2 preamps in my system. Monoblocks are much easier to switch.
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Last edited by Jerome W; 08-18-2011 at 01:53 AM.
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  #25  
Old 08-18-2011, 02:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmalak View Post
Matt, I know John DeVore has demoed his speakers at various shows with Shindo and they are usually thought of as being synergistic. We know there are a few AAers here (Alberto and Serge) who have paired up Shindo with Tannoys and are liking the combo. What are some of the other tube-friendly/Shindo-friendly speakers lines that you have found to be a nice match-up with Shindo amplification?
Audio Note.
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  #26  
Old 08-18-2011, 02:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C220MC275 View Post
...

I told about this to a dealer in Paris who sells highly musical amps and speakers, among them Leben, Ear, Nagra, Verity Audio and he told me this : you always loose a certain degree of finesse and musicality with high power amps. He's willing to let me try at home the Nagra 845 PushPull class A. 2 x 50 W. I asked about their sound to Massimo, a member here that owns both the Nagra amps and the 2301's and he told me that although he did not make an A / B test, the Nagra sounded more refined to his ears compared to the 2301's but of course, less powerful.

All this story reminded me of the will of that dealer to let me the Nagra 845's in my home. This is not often for such gear in France. My ARC dealer, which I bought the Ref2 from a month ago, and my Clearaudio TT told me that he could make a demo of the Ref 5 in my home but could not let it to me for a few days !
I cannot ignore both the kindness of this Nagra dealer and the 845 amps. If they sing the way I want on my speakers, then I may end up buying them or trying the Shindo CCQ ( the Shindo idea will continue to torture me until I hear one ! ). If the Shindo is not my cup of tea, I will sell them and buy the 845.
I'm a bit reluctant to do that because this dealer is so kind and professionnal that I feel it would not be fair to him if I try the 845 and finally end up ordering the CCQ. Maybe I could tell him all the story and propose him to pay for the tryout of the 845 if I don't buy them finally ?
Jérôme, I suggest you to try the Nagra VPA.
You consider that it is not easy to try at home these components.
You can feel lucky for this opportunity.

The sound of 845 & KT88 is different, the 845 sound is more intimate and refined.
However, you consider that the NAGRA VPA are very abnormal 845 tube amps.
A very transparent sound, It's probably the sound you are looking for.
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  #27  
Old 08-18-2011, 02:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m.tonetti View Post
Jérôme, I suggest you to try the Nagra VPA.
You consider that it is not easy to try at home these components.
You can feel lucky for this opportunity.

The sound of 845 & KT88 is different, the 845 sound is more intimate and refined.
However, you consider that the NAGRA VPA are very abnormal 845 tube amps.
A very transparent sound, It's probably the sound you are looking for.
Thanks for the input Massimo
Yes, I will try them at home if the dealer still agrees for that. They may be exactly what I'm looking for.
+ they are fully balanced so no need to use other cables from the C1000 than my actual Wireworld XLR cables.
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  #28  
Old 08-18-2011, 02:58 AM
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Out of curiosity, how come no recommendation to pair Shindo amps with Shindo speakers?

I remember reading somewhere, someone had bought the Shindo TT. Might as well go for the full lineage to get the right SHINDO sound - from input to output? Am I missing something here?

I had this "weird" inclination as after going thru the "mix and match" combo systems I owned before, I finally found the "Meridian sound" (as a system) is that much wholesome. Thats probably true for an entire McIntosh Reference combo too (this Ivan have to chip in). Somehow, I think voicing had to do with this - right from the creation of the gear.

I stand corrected on this thinking though. Welcome opinions on this.
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  #29  
Old 08-18-2011, 03:50 AM
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The more I think about it, the more I realize that I won't be happy until I get Shindo amps in my system. I'm too curious.
The Shindo Corton Charlemagne Q monoblocks will be ordered today.
Will sell them if I don't like them.
We only live once !
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  #30  
Old 08-18-2011, 07:14 AM
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Originally Posted by C220MC275 View Post
Come on guys, the Corton Q is already pretty expensive. Give me some time to breathe !
Congrats. Jerome ! I am looking forward to reading your impressions of your new mono amps. Our little group is very good at spending your money .
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