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Revel Speakers The Science of Sound

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  #21  
Old 10-16-2016, 02:07 PM
Pampero Pampero is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug760 View Post
I went with a pair of JL Audio F113 subs on Ivan's sub stands. I just need to experiment with plugging the port now but a bit hesitant as I may need to pull the bottom plinth off to do so.
How do you like the integration otherwise?
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  #22  
Old 10-20-2016, 09:30 PM
Doug760 Doug760 is offline
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I am very happy with the seamless integration of those subs in my system. I spoke with Barry Ober from JL Audio regarding setup and took his advice as well as Bill Bush from NHT back when I had an all NHT setup. I would love to get a pair of gothams but I may need a structural engineer to ensure my floor can handle those beasts...

Doug
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  #23  
Old 10-25-2016, 10:23 PM
Doug760 Doug760 is offline
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I forgot to add that low to mid level listening still sounds great...
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  #24  
Old 10-26-2016, 02:41 PM
Pampero Pampero is offline
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Thanks, Doug. I remain undecided but after all, what's the rush? I've been experimenting with speaker locations but whatever I gain in low end seems to be at the expense of some other quality at this point. I've discovered that my Salon2s deliver more and somewhat tighter low end when placed about 14 inches off my rear wall but that seems to come at the expense of depth and" immediacy." In other words, I get a little more of the room when I push the speakers back into proximity with the rear wall.

No doubt subs would help me here.
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Last edited by Pampero; 10-26-2016 at 02:45 PM.
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  #25  
Old 10-27-2016, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pampero View Post
Thanks, Doug. I remain undecided but after all, what's the rush? I've been experimenting with speaker locations but whatever I gain in low end seems to be at the expense of some other quality at this point. I've discovered that my Salon2s deliver more and somewhat tighter low end when placed about 14 inches off my rear wall but that seems to come at the expense of depth and" immediacy." In other words, I get a little more of the room when I push the speakers back into proximity with the rear wall.

No doubt subs would help me here.

I experience the same effect as well when the speakers are closer to the front wall. In my room I settled with them closer to the side wall with the speaker selector to contour for now. The wide soundstage is amazing and there's less room interaction at the low end with the compensation switch.
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  #26  
Old 10-29-2016, 12:20 PM
Pampero Pampero is offline
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Pete, I'm experimenting with placement before I do anything rash, like spend money. Placed in closer proximity to the wall, my Revels deliver a lot of slam, enough to satisfy me. I like the soundstage and sense of intimacy better when they're about four feet off the rear wall though, which I suspect suggests comb filtering in my room. The measurements don't change that much in either position but the sense of 'envelopment' does. I'll work on finding a compromise position, but I'm starting to think the ideal is to have the speakers where I like them for spaciousness/focus with a sub in the corner and the speakers high passed. I really don't want to spend the extra for a crossover to accomplish that and have been looking for a good solution to create a filter. Since I have a C52, I could use the eq (the 50Hz center) to roll off the lows as a starting point, but that seems too easy
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  #27  
Old 10-30-2016, 10:09 AM
Rex Anderson Rex Anderson is offline
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Sounds to me like you have a problem with room acoustics and your listening position in relation to your speakers. The Revel Salon 2's have plenty of low end level and extension, I only imagine needing a sub for a 5.1 system just for the sub channel. Have you looked at Bob Katz's website? Bob opted for the Revel Gem2 and 2 JL Audio F112 subs so he could optimize the bass in his room. It does not look as elegant as using a tower speaker, but he is not concerned with the aesthetic, only full range flat response with smooth even bass. It seems wrong to me to high pass the Salon2, a waste of a great speaker.

Even if you add one or two subs, you may have problems integrating them with the Salon2's in your room. A corner (or corners if you use 2 subs as Bob recommends) may not be the best place for the subs. You need a good audio engineer/acoustician with a room tuning system (like SMAART) to work out your issues. Proper acoustic treatment is also essential for best in room response too.

Last edited by Masterlu; 10-30-2016 at 03:52 PM. Reason: Bad link
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  #28  
Old 10-30-2016, 01:54 PM
Pampero Pampero is offline
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Hi Rex!

The room is decent and measures well but of course most domestic rooms present problems that make treatment and/or compromise a necessity. My colleague, Ken Bleecher, ( formerly with Harman, now with Panasonic) was over last weekend with his SMAART suite. It was he who suggested moving the speakers closer to the wall after a quick measurement of the room and some critical listening. After his assessment and having schlepped the things back to the wall I had to agree that the LF response was considerably enhanced. Since my last post a couple of days ago, I've had more time to listen to the things in their new location and I'm starting to think that my initial placement (using Revel's suggestions and rules of thumb) was off the mark in my specific situation. Or perhaps I misinterpreted them. In any event, I'm getting used to the differences and starting to like them but more tweaking may be required. I'm not in the "near near" field as I was when I originally settled on a position further into the room but as I get accustomed to the new location, it's been growing on me. I chalk it up to my belief that a little cut and try is inevitable when a room is not designed from scratch.

Regarding SMAART: Sam Berkow is a friend and former colleague although I've never met Thorny Thornton. I'm pleased to see you are aware of the work that has ensued as the concepts have been developed by SIA and the ensuing owners. I was a contractor for Harman in the early days when SIA was associated with JBL. I can both accept and endorse your recommendations and encourage others who might be interested in precision acoustical measurement tools, albeit they were initially designed with larger spaces than mine in mind.

I've recently purchased a moderately compatible app (junior program, you might say) that has a SMAART compatible module (Audio Tools). I hope this low cost solution can do well enough for me as I play around.

I have not done anything in respect to low frequency absorption. That's a possibility for the future. I will continue to update this thread as I reach new conclusions and I'm happy to have comments and suggestions like yours included here.


Much appreciated.
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Last edited by Pampero; 10-30-2016 at 02:01 PM.
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  #29  
Old 10-30-2016, 03:51 PM
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Rex Anderson... Welcome to AA!
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  #30  
Old 10-30-2016, 07:02 PM
Rex Anderson Rex Anderson is offline
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Hi Guys (and gals?),

Obviously I'm new to this forum (both AA and Revel). I have a long history at The Gear Page forum because I am a guitar player, but they also have a recording and live sound forum that I frequent. I'm so new here that I can't post on the Introductions page. I worked as the Audio Director for the School of Music at the University of Illinois School of Music tor 32 years. My job involved recording, mixing, editing, mastering and live sound engineering. I retired from that job in 2010 but started doing live sound for a church with a great band about a year ago, so I'm still active as an audio professional.

I'm on the Revel forum because I did a lot of research and bought a pair of F208's about eighteen months ago. After getting them I was so impressed I continued researching and learning as much as I could about Revel and the folks who have made these amazing speakers.

I'll post more when I have time. Looking forward to getting to know you all.

Last edited by Rex Anderson; 10-31-2016 at 07:42 PM.
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