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Revel Speakers The Science of Sound

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  #11  
Old 04-02-2016, 12:31 PM
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Dave... Beautiful room and setup. The Revel Studio 2's look like a perfect match.
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  #12  
Old 04-02-2016, 01:25 PM
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Dave, congrats on the new Revels and a very nice looking system and room. Craig
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  #13  
Old 04-02-2016, 02:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Formerly YB-2 View Post
Are those Rogue mono-blocks driving them or are you using the large amp in the center (which I don't recognize)?
Glenn, my Rogue M-180's power things during the 'cooler' months, I'll switch over to my Plinius SA-102 sometime in May, even when biased totally into class 'A' it runs cooler than the Tube mono blocks.

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Originally Posted by Masterlu View Post
Thats Plinius, and looking mighty fine!
I see that Ivan answered the question !
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  #14  
Old 04-02-2016, 05:43 PM
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If you don't mind me asking what make of amp stand is underneath the Plinius?
I see you are also running a Fosgate phono,are you using stock tubes or have you rolled others in?
Aaron
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  #15  
Old 04-02-2016, 07:44 PM
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Gorgeous! Just like my pair. Love em in piano black finish

You gotta get a set of Stillpoints ultra 5's under em tho. They LOVE having them under mine.
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  #16  
Old 04-02-2016, 08:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pigman View Post
If you don't mind me asking what make of amp stand is underneath the Plinius?
pig, the damn thing's so old I can't remember ....... sorry

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I see you are also running a Fosgate phono,are you using stock tubes or have you rolled others in?
stock ........and with that being said and if memory serves me right there used to be a guy......'race tripper' I believe who you used to post on here having one, with nothing but 'noise' issues with his, mine is dead silent, I love it !
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  #17  
Old 04-02-2016, 09:49 PM
Pampero Pampero is offline
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Good looking rig. I'm impatiently waiting for my Salon 2s to arrive and I can tell you that your photo didn't make me feel any less antsy. I have a lot of work to do to get my system up and running. Consider yourself an inspiration.
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  #18  
Old 08-10-2017, 02:05 PM
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We are trying to break in our new Studio 2s, and to adapt the rest of the system to these new loudspeakers. They are replacing a pair of bookshelf Sonus Faber Concertos (18 years old and still great). As noted in previous posts, it turns out that a major change in speakers is not always a plug and play experience.

They are now in our living room, looking pretty great in gloss black. They are plugged into a McIntosh MA7900 200wpc integrated, which itself is plugged into a Transparent Powerwave 8. They are positioned about 16 inches from the rear wall and about 18 inches from the edges of the credenza. The credenza holds out TV and the turntable. It is an Ikea unit.

We were lucky enough to be able to sample them at the audio store using a McIntosh MA8900 on the 4-ohm taps, which is substantially identical in power to our MA7900 at home (the MA8900 has a modular digital section... smart).

We are still in the break in period, we think. They have been running quietly at night and louder for listening sessions during the early evenings (mostly) (okay sometimes) (okay pretty late in some cases) (every night). We plugged them in on Monday, and it is now Thursday.

Initially the bass was very thin. They were delivered and installed while I was at work, and my wife was so concerned with the sound that she checked the connections. It turned out that they were still connected to the 8-ohm taps. Oops. She switched to the 4-ohm taps before I got home, saving me the needless panic attack.

The bass was still thinner than we heard in the store, but we know the break-in can take some time. Over the past few days the bass has become more and more full, and they sound pretty balanced now. The highs have also smoothed out.

Here is where it gets complicated. The bass on the turntable was still thin on a lot of recordings. A/B between the CD player and the turntable on the same material sounded thinner (and a lot quieter) on the turntable. In addition, as the bass improved, it caused a warbling feedback loop on the turntable, so anything like normal listening level sounded like the vocalist was doing vibrato. Very bad!

I mitigated this somewhat last night by slightly increasing the tone arm weight. That seemed to make the vibrato effect go away, at least at normal to loudish levels. it also seemed to improve bas performance on LP playback. It reached a point where Leonard Cohen's Ten new Songs on CD and LP were indistinguishable. The LP was a more airy, but the overall tonal balance was sufficiently close to the same as to make no difference to me. It is still necessary to turn up the volume level for the LP playback to reach the same output. The LP system is an unsuspended table with a low output MC.

Now the bass is good, but still not quite as tight and confident as we recall from the dealer.

We are not sure what to do about the bass. The room is our living room, so it may never be perfect, and maybe they are still running in. It seems like the sound is different every day.

What if the bass continues to fill out? The dealer said it could take 30 days for the speakers to fully break in. (!!!!) More bass might shake the turntable even more.

All of this is to ask:

Is cartridge weight really affecting how much room energy gets sent through the needle? Or, do we need to move the table further away? Replace the credenza with a proper audio rack? Our old speakers had way less bass, so we did not have to contend with the issue of isolating the turntable to anything like this degree.

Are we underpowered? The demo was with 200wpc, so why would it be different at home? Should we skip the power conditioner and plug straight into the wall?

How long does break in take with these things? Has anyone had it take more than a few days?

Caveat: They sound awesome. The improvement is sufficient to warrant the upgrade. We are not unhappy, just looking to get the most out of the system.

Solutions not requiring a major spend (like a couple of MC601s) would be helpful. The credit card is still warm to the touch.

Any feedback will be read with interest and appreciation!
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Last edited by BWB75; 08-10-2017 at 02:12 PM.
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  #19  
Old 08-10-2017, 02:49 PM
Rex Anderson Rex Anderson is online now
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I believe it was Kevin Voecks (maybe Floyd Toole) who said speaker break in is mostly a myth.

http://www.audioholics.com/loudspeak...ths-and-truths

http://www.audioholics.com/loudspeak...act-or-fiction

Sounds like you are having room acoustic issues and should try moving the speakers around until you find the flattest bass response at the main listening position. You are experiencing bass peaks and dips at different frequencies. You might (probably) need some acoustic treatment in your room.

Cartridge tracking force should be optimized for best tracking, not too little and not too much. If increasing the tracking force improved sound, that's good, but you need to measure to make sure it is not too high.

You need to acoustically isolate the table and cartridge system to avoid room resonances affecting it. The location of the turntable is probably at a room mode where there is a peak in level at the frequency that is causing the problem. Does the table have a cover that can be closed to isolate the cartridge?

You only need more power if the amp clips before you reach the SPL/listening level you want.

Re: bass on records vs CD's: due to the physical limitations of cutting vinyl, records have to roll off deep bass extension and limit the amount of bass. CD's do not have bass limitations.

You should try the amp plugged straight in to the wall to see if it performs better, it might.

Last edited by Rex Anderson; 08-10-2017 at 03:19 PM.
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  #20  
Old 08-10-2017, 03:36 PM
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Thanks, Rex. A lot of good information in your post.

Especially informative is this: "Re: bass on records vs CD's: due to the physical limitations of cutting vinyl, records have to roll off deep bass extension and limit the amount of bass. CD's do not have bass limitations."

For some reason, I had not connected the dots on this. Our old speakers did not reveal the difference, because they rolled of CDs and records way before the recording limits played in.

We will measure the cartridge weight to make sure it is within spec. Set up was done by a pro, but I had lightened it a bit afterwards. Pretty sure I am close to dead on the recommended tracking force, but will check anyway.

As to turntable isolation: That has got to be it. I am sure a proper rack would also help, but step one is to simply move the thing. We'll see how that works out.

Room effects: I am confident that creating a worse environment for audio would require careful engineering. The left channel is near about 10 inches from the edge of a very low 250 pound sofa, and about 4 feet from a window. The right channel is next to an open dining area, but hits a corner about 20 degrees off axis (away from the listening position). Also, the left channel is on carpet, but the right is on an extension of hardwood from the dining area.

We should think about room treatments.
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