Can digital compete in sound quality with vinyl?

[Mikado463]

Originally Posted by eljr

I think the question is backwards.

and to that .......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzRvSWPZQYk

[schneice]

Originally Posted by Mikado463

and to that .......



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzRvSWPZQYk

I liked this. Thanks

Helps answer a question that has nagged me...why do people feel music that is recorded digitally sound better played back on vinyl than out of a DAC? The vinyl can’t go back in time and retrieve the lost samples.

Instead it looks like there are a couple of things:
- people prefer the “physical filter” of the vinyl system. Which they can tweet to their likening vs being stuck with the one imbedded in the circuitry and programming of the DAC
- the limitations of vinyl playback put constraints on the engineers that limit the amount of compression they can apply. Thus the information you get is different.

On this last point, I’d love to AB 2 hi res files. One that was designed for digital release vs the one used for the vinyl press.

[doggiehowser]

Originally Posted by Mikado463

and to that .......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzRvSWPZQYk

OMG

Real Engineering puts the stylus magnets in the counterweight!!! :P



(min 4:28)

And also a bit BS about Loudness Wars - music pressed on vinyl has also been subject to loudness wars if they used the remastered versions. Sometimes, a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing.

That said, I can take my MoFi 45rpm Brothers in Arms LP and the MoFi SACD and play them on the same system and the result is always always striking.

Whether it is on a A$2k ClearAudio Concept MM/RSA f117A on a A$3.7k Naim Uniti Atom (vs streaming the DSD on the Atom) or a much pricier system.

[nicoff]

In my experience, there is NO need to spend 5-10 times on a digital set up to match the analog. I think that with the advance in digital technology, if anything, beyond a threshold of say $6k you now have to spend a lot more in analog to equal what you can do in digital.
At that price point you take a digital signal (44/16) and upsample it and convert it to DSD512 and you get equal to or better to analog. And that assumes a pristine record.

[doggiehowser]

When you listen to music at a live concert, there would be the occasional cough or someone clearing their throats.. but it doesn't distract from the music. With some listeners, the same can be said about crackles and pops from a record. And cleaning them with new ultrasonic cleaners restores them to near pristine condition (assuming they weren't damaged.. just dirty)

[Mouse]

Originally Posted by schneice

I liked this. Thanks

Helps answer a question that has nagged me...why do people feel music that is recorded digitally sound better played back on vinyl than out of a DAC? The vinyl can’t go back in time and retrieve the lost samples.

Instead it looks like there are a couple of things:
- people prefer the “physical filter” of the vinyl system. Which they can tweet to their likening vs being stuck with the one imbedded in the circuitry and programming of the DAC
- the limitations of vinyl playback put constraints on the engineers that limit the amount of compression they can apply. Thus the information you get is different.

On this last point, I’d love to AB 2 hi res files. One that was designed for digital release vs the one used for the vinyl press.

I found out from experience that I prefer the sound of vinyl from in store demos. I don't even own a record player yet. Comparing tidal to record, the tidal version sounded compressed. It was like comparing xm/sirius radio against a CD. They sound clearly different. (ignoring artifacts like pops and scratches) I wish I knew why vinyl sounds more natural to my ears, but for now I'm in the market for a good TT.

[Macuser]

Last weekend for the very first time ever I heard vinyl best a cd on an upper end VPI paired with an outboard phono pre that looked like a pair of monoblock amps. In my case spinning vinyl with a Clearaudio emotion tt with a ca aurum beta woodbody cart it's never once beat good digital. Perhaps someday I'll pony up the funds necessary to beat good digital. But the idea of completely starting over from ground zero beginning with better pressings doesn't thrill me. Until that day comes vinyl will be a secondary source here.....able to be enjoyed but with the realization that it does have it's limitations.

[Mille162]

Originally Posted by Macuser

Last weekend for the very first time ever I heard vinyl best a cd on an upper end VPI paired with an outboard phono pre that looked like a pair of monoblock amps. In my case spinning vinyl with a Clearaudio emotion tt with a ca aurum beta woodbody cart it's never once beat good digital. Perhaps someday I'll pony up the funds necessary to beat good digital. But the idea of completely starting over from ground zero beginning with better pressings doesn't thrill me. Until that day comes vinyl will be a secondary source here.....able to be enjoyed but with the realization that it does have it's limitations.

Work on “tuning” your existing system. Is your arm properly weighted? Your cartridge properly aligned? Have you isolated any outside vibrations? Is your vinyl clean? My cartridge was installed and setup originally by someone very well respected in the community. The sound was a bit flat and lacked the separation my previous cartridge did. Months of living with disappointment in an expensive upgrade had me starting to look for a new upgrade. Someone else well respected in the industry offered to check the settings. Turns out the weight was WAY off. Headshell was 6 grams too heavy and arm was struggling with the balance and still needle had too much tracking force. A quick change to a lighter headshell was like taking covers off my speakers! More detail, wider and explicit soundstage, it really was a night and day difference from a very simple setup issue. There are many factors that can effect an analog systems performance when the actual components should be capable of more/better, make sure you’re getting the most out of your current set-up

[1KW]

If your just talking sound quality and convenience, digital streaming with MQA has won in my book however you lose a whole aspect of the hobby in my opinion. Part of what I love is to look around in a record store somewhere and find some old and new recordings , bring them home, clean the records and put them on my turntable and listen to an album. On occasion I find a rare copy such as when I found my RL version of Led Zeppelin II and could not believe how much better it sounds than digital. My digital system does cost more than my vinyl set up but can hold its own with the digital. Bottom line , to me its not a either or, I like both digital and analog. I buy vinyl but I stream digital.

[Antonmb]

Hmmm....what’s better?

Digital or vinyl?
Salmon or halibut?
Steel or nylon guitar strings?
Tubes or solid state?
Beer or wine?
Chicken or pork?
Sex or food...wait, never mind that one

The answer is still the same as ever: it depends on how it’s done, and your taste.

Degustibus non est disputandum (which my father used to translate as “you can’t argue with Gus)[emoji41]