Subs for Salon2

[Pio]

Originally Posted by Pampero

Pio, no crossover, but I have played with ducking the output of the amp by cutting the 25Hz eq through the C52. Doing it that way adds another variable I could do without. A crossover would make it so much more precise, but I don't feel like substituting the preamp section of my mid-grade Denon receiver or bypassing my C52 and using my Oppo's crossove/management for alignment. I'm sure you understand! This is an advantage to JL, since the management is built in but even then I still need a high pass for the Revels. I didn't think about this when I dove in. Chasing the dragon is becoming a routine. My wife has been remarkably pleasant and compliant but how far can I push this?

I've been eyeing the JL CR1, also been wracking my brain to come up with a decent analog pro crossover. There are very few left on the market, and the ones that are don't pique my interest. I may borrow a Rane AC22 (B version, which has balanced connectors) from a friend. It offers the preferred 24dB/octave LR filters that match the Revel, but it's no longer in production. If it works, it would be an inexpensive approach and I'm sure I could scour one up. Bryston's crossover certainly would be another option.

I'm feeling better but this cold is hanging in and I still feel kind'a crappy Low energy mostly.

Both you and I have incredibly great wives, mine just smiles... Hey, doesn't the SVS offer a built in crossover? I believe they have 24/db/oct slopes built in or might even be adjustable. Anyways, Just go preamp to the SVS and the high pass to your power amps. I did that for a while when I had my PB13Ultras until I got a pro crossover.

Brystons crossover along with JLs CR1 are great but incredible expensive. I am toying with the idea of a digital crossover, but think I'm going to get a Parasound JC3+ phono preamp instead. Really like the way my subs are integrated to the system right now.

PS - I hear lugging around 200lb subs does nothing for someone under the weather to get better sooner....

Very interested in the SVS vs JL shootout in casa de lew - kind of a David v Goliath battle - though, not sure which would be "Goliath"...

[Ricjor1]

When I had dual JL Audio F110 v2s, I used them with the CR1. It was easier to blend them; however I sold everything to get new speakers. I bought the SVS SB16 Ultra to use in my surround sound system, but thought I would try it in my 2-channel system. I've concluded I either don't know how to get subs to work right in my system or I just prefer 2 channel without a sub.

[Pio]

Originally Posted by Ricjor1

When I had dual JL Audio F110 v2s, I used them with the CR1. It was easier to blend them; however I sold everything to get new speakers. I bought the SVS SB16 Ultra to use in my surround sound system, but thought I would try it in my 2-channel system. I've concluded I either don't know how to get subs to work right in my system or I just prefer 2 channel without a sub.

I am SOOOO tempted to get a JL CR1!!

[Pampero]

Originally Posted by Pio

Both you and I have incredibly great wives, mine just smiles... Hey, doesn't the SVS offer a built in crossover? I believe they have 24/db/oct slopes built in or might even be adjustable. Anyways, Just go preamp to the SVS and the high pass to your power amps. I did that for a while when I had my PB13Ultras until I got a pro crossover.

Brystons crossover along with JLs CR1 are great but incredible expensive. I am toying with the idea of a digital crossover, but think I'm going to get a Parasound JC3+ phono preamp instead. Really like the way my subs are integrated to the system right now.

PS - I hear lugging around 200lb subs does nothing for someone under the weather to get better sooner....

Very interested in the SVS vs JL shootout in casa de lew - kind of a David v Goliath battle - though, not sure which would be "Goliath"...

The SB16 doesn't include a high pass filter (neither do the Fathoms). I think the E Series JLs do include a true high pass. IMO this makes the integration considerably harder to get right with (also my opinion) speakers like the Salon2s since they already do an admirable job with their near 20Hz extension. I'd been fretting over this since the idea of using subs with these speakers entered my little rat brain.

In the case of the SVS, I think the bulk of their market is HT, at least that's the impression I get in respect to the feature set on the SB16. I think/guess a lot of their uses have pre-pros or AVRs so the crossovers (for better or worse) are already integrated into the existing electronics. Same with the automated bass management systems; SVS doesn't provide that either. Gear like mine designed for higher end 2 channel becomes the orphan baby. The features of a true crossover seem to be overlooked, same thing with JL Fathoms although they do have built in bass management. I assume this oversight is in the desire to save a few bucks and/or to avoid redundancy. But in the end, it makes integration a whole bunch harder/more expensive if you really want to do it properly in a true high end stereo system. Or so say I.

Originally Posted by Ricjor1

When I had dual JL Audio F110 v2s, I used them with the CR1. It was easier to blend them; however I sold everything to get new speakers. I bought the SVS SB16 Ultra to use in my surround sound system, but thought I would try it in my 2-channel system. I've concluded I either don't know how to get subs to work right in my system or I just prefer 2 channel without a sub.

You're not alone. I am having a devil of a time getting the SB16 to integrate perfectly. Things have been improving as I play with it, but so far I have not achieved the um..."absolute sound." I don;t think I can without some control of how the Salons integrate. One of the benefits of the big Revel sub is that it has the necessary high pass built in. However, I don't have one or a pair of those, do I? The daunting prospect of buying a pair Rhythm subs to get 'er done overwhelmed my personal sense of propriety and now they're no longer available anyway. As far as overall tonality and "fastness" I have yet to achieve the sound that my mains alone provide so effortlessly. I like the fullness and thump I get with the sub, but I haven't been able to make a "system for all seasons" out of this mash up as yet and the upshot is that I have to be very careful with gain structuring the sub's output if I don't want the whole affair to denigrate into a woofy and loose sounding mess.

Pio's question is right on the money: what am I going to do about the main system's high pass?

[Pampero]

Originally Posted by Pio

Both you and I have incredibly great wives, mine just smiles...........

Very interested in the SVS vs JL shootout in casa de lew - kind of a David v Goliath battle - though, not sure which would be "Goliath"...

I forgot to reply to the critical part in bold! Yeah, great wives! I think mine has just given up struggling over this. Of course, I've placated her with comments like: "It's an investment in happiness" and....."at these prices it's like saving money." Then, I remind her that I can't wait until I'm old because I'm already old so there's no more waiting time available.

I think the CR1 represents the best hardware option but my wife's tolerance surely must have limits. Even I sense the folly in chasing this dragon. It's more like chasing my tail! When I contacted SVS they seemed to think integration without a crossover wouldn't be a big problem and it may be that I just haven't found the magic combo yet but deep in my bones I sense that it is futile to cross over such sophisticated speakers.....without a crossover! I need to get on with the instruments but I fear I already know where this is going. I''m not even sure what my instruments coupled with my skill level will tell me.

I'm picking up the JL F113v2 today. I'm imagining that the JL's bass management package will make the job easier. I really don't want to throw another bunch of money at the crossover and that's my decision, not my wife's. And yet.....oi!

[Pampero]

My wife helped me get the F113 out of the car onto a hand truck and into the house (sort of) but quit when facing the stairs that go up to the room. Enlisting daughter's boyfriend to help get it the rest of the way tomorrow.

One thing you notice even before opening the box; the packaging is superior to SVS' in that the JL is crated onto an interior pallet, McIntosh style. More once it's in the room. It's smaller but it is one heavy mother!

[Pampero]

And one more thing! In the search of a clever (cheap!) "one way" crossover I googled "variable high pass filter." Look at the happy google response!

"Audio High Pass Filters - Holiday Coupon - 17% Off"

Have I finally reached the end of the internet?

[Ricjor1]

Any update on the F113 vs the SB16?

[Pampero]

Tomorrow or Tuesday. It gets lugged upstairs and installed today.

[Pampero]

I posted initial impressions between the two subs in the subwoofer section where I think it fits and may have more value to folks other than just us Revelites.

Here's the link

Feel free to discuss it here or there, here especially if you want my impressions on mating the two beasts to the Regal, Revealing and Righteous Revel Salon 2s.