Pass Labs XP-25

[turntable]

Originally Posted by Whart

I am futzing with phono stages at this moment too. So much of this is entirely system dependent: the cartridge, the line stage, amps, speakers, and how the overall system in the room is voiced. I'm not suggesting it's all relativism, and that there aren't absolutes, but the comparisons based on somebody's experience in their system, with their ears, taste, prejudices and predilictions, have to be put into full context to be meaningful. I think you have to know a little about the listener, their system and their predilictions to extropolate one person's experience to what you may find with the same piece of equipment in your system.
As to the cartridges, I haven't heard the Atlas. I found the Titan i, which i lived with for a while (after the Parnassus), to be very spot lit, not necessarily "bright" in a bad sense, but bordering on artificially amp'd up for the sake of hi-fi. I gather that the Atlas does not share this attribute.

Hi Whart

Very true. One persons bright is anothers neutral, etc etc

I have not heard the Titan i, however you will never say the Atlas is bright. Very detailed/quiet/transparent and coherent top to bottom.

cheers

[dazngad]

What,

The Titan i is bright if the VTF is too low by the tiniest drop. Also the armistice be able to control resonance. It puts out a lot of energy.

Shane,

I can't imagine any ARC product having the bass I am looking for. So far to date I have found all ARC slightly light weight be transparent.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using A.Aficionado

[Whart]

Well, as i said in my note, context is everything, i used the Titan i in both a Triplanar VII (or whatever the most current version was 4-5 years ago) and in my Airline; both were set up properly. I found the Titan to be extremely VTA sensitive, something I didn't necessarily mind because adjusting VTA (yes, I know, you said VTF) on the fly is a snap on the Airline.
Mind you, i didn't say bright, I thought it was overemphasizing to a degree that made the treble better than life and therefore less real. And, again, context. I'm listening to horns, so you could dismiss these comments out of hand. By contrast, the Airtight does not sound dramatic in the way the Titan did, but everything, including dynamics is there. Not suggesting the Titan is flawed, or that the Airtight is better, but that's what i heard, in my system.

[dazngad]

Whart,

Funny as I found the PC-1 bright. Only affirms your explanation of context and systems earlier.

But until I had the Titan i in the right arm it was bright. I can't see a low mass arm such as the Triplanar or any linear tracker having the ability to control the Titan i. Also I had to use a brass mounting plate (not the aluminum which is lower in mass) to make it sing on my Schroeder.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using A.Aficionado

[Whart]

Dazngad- interesting indeed. Thanks for the response, and appreciate that you recognize this isn't a pissing contest-all in the quest for better reproduction.
I've thought about adding an arm at some point to cover things that the my existing one-arm set-up can't. I have a fair number of mono records from ye good olde days, and wouldn't mind having a different stereo cartridge set up as well. The Kuzma makes this somewhat easy, by buying additional arm towers. Maybe something I should reconsider when I next have a burning desire I also have room for more than one table- I do have an old SP-10 that I bought new, back in 1973, but it is not a mk II, so it's not in the same league. Best,
bill hart

[JohnA]

Originally Posted by turntable

I compared the Pass XP-25 and the Esoteric E-03 in my system over the past few days. The Pass XP-25 is the better sounding phono in my system.

After playing some Grant Green, Radiohead, Prince, Mark Lanegan, Kraftwork and Depeche Mode the XP-25 was overall the more enjoyable and lifelike phono stage, especially at higher volumes.

the Pass has better drive and pace in the bass, however on some recordings with overblown bass the dryer Esoteric was prefable. The pass was quite a bit better in the mids with it being more 3d, had a deeper soundstage and more transparent with more musical action and information . Soundstage was quite a bit wider and higher than the Esoteric. Overall the music with the Pass was more as one and coherent where the esoteric is not quite as coherent top to bottom.

Listening to the Esoteric on its own was very nice, however with the Pass I want to listen to more music. That after all is the most important part of hifi.

the Esoteric is fully run in and the Pass has about 20-25 hours now and is only sounding better as it runs in.

On this comparison spending more $$ does get you better sound.

I still have to compare the XP-25 to the Brinkman Edison in a couple of weeks, that is if I don't pull the trigger in the mean time.

cheers

Thanks for the write up Shane. With the pass only having 25 hours on it, it can only improve further one would think.

The esoteric is no slouch, and the second time i heard it in my system it was vertually on par with the audia.

I do hope the brinkman arrives soon, because i simply cant wait any more. I have not been able to enjoy my system for a while now.

[turntable]

Originally Posted by JohnA

Thanks for the write up Shane. With the pass only having 25 hours on it, it can only improve further one would think.

The esoteric is no slouch, and the second time i heard it in my system it was vertually on par with the audia.

I do hope the brinkman arrives soon, because i simply cant wait any more. I have not been able to enjoy my system for a while now.

Ah ha ha. Once you go up, it is very hard to go back, especially with your new arm.

You should post your new arm here.

I am guessing the Brink will not be here by this weekend?

[JohnA]

not sure if the brinkman will be here this weekend or not mate.
i'll shoot off an email to the guys later today as they should have a tracking number one would think t know how far away it is.

You are right though, once you go up, hard to go back as i have just found out......

sometime ignorance can be bliss.

Will post pics in another thread

[Cyclotronguy]

Back in post #27 TURNTABLE wrote: "the Pass has better drive and pace in the bass, however on some recordings with overblown bass the dryer Esoteric was prefable (sic)."

I would make one comment to "Turntable".

The beauty of phono-stages like the Pass Laboratories XP-25 with convenient adjustable cartridge loading is that you have the tools at hand frequently to ameliorate things like overblown bass in the odd recording.

Frequently lowering the resistive load a touch will bring the bass under control. Top end too hot, a little shunt capacitance of 75pf - 100pf can make all the difference in the world.

Cyclotronguy

[turntable]

Originally Posted by Cyclotronguy

Back in post #27 TURNTABLE wrote: "the Pass has better drive and pace in the bass, however on some recordings with overblown bass the dryer Esoteric was prefable (sic)."

I would make one comment to "Turntable".

The beauty of phono-stages like the Pass Laboratories XP-25 with convenient adjustable cartridge loading is that you have the tools at hand frequently to ameliorate things like overblown bass in the odd recording.

Frequently lowering the resistive load a touch will bring the bass under control. Top end too hot, a little shunt capacitance of 75pf - 100pf can make all the difference in the world.

Cyclotronguy

Thanks for that Cyclo.

Trouble is using the loading or cap as a tone control also is not preferable sonically in most occasions.

The Lyra Atlas for example sounds at its best at around 500ohms, you lower the loading and it can lose its top end sparkle and air. Same to a lessor degree the Dyna XV-1s.

I found that if the bass was too overblown, the rumble filter was a better option than changing the loading.

All in all, at this level all the phono stages are great - you just gotta find the one that synergises into your system

cheers