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Tube and Solid State
Hoping for some feedback on something I have thought about for a few years. I currently have a 2600 preamp and 1.2kw’s and am happy with the sound. I’ve been wondering what differences I might have if I tried a solid state preamp? There is nice clarity now - has anyone A/B’d this?
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#2
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#3
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Ankkor-
You have a great combination with the 2600/1.2's. Personally I prefer a tube Mc pre-amp to solid state. The only thing you might consider is an 1100 pre-amp. This would require also buying a DAC (if you use one) as well. Before making such a move, an audition of the 2600 and 1100 as well as a solid state unit is a must. In the end it's all very subjective. Again, you have an outstanding pre-amp so approach the chase of upgrade with caution.
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AKA J2Ordan McIntosh/Legacy/VPI/Bricasti/DIYCable |
#4
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Consider the C 1100; McIntosh’s latest two box tube preamp. Super quiet, fully balanced, with that glorious valve midrange and none of drawbacks. Outstanding phono section as well.
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Main System: Amati Futura Mains Amati Homage VOX Center, Proac Response 1sc Rears, Three MC2301's for L,C,R MC 602 for the rears C 1100, MX 151, MCD 1100, MR 80 Nottingham Dais with Wave Mechanic Sumiko Palo Santos Presentation SurfacePro 3, RPi 4, ROON, WW Starlight Platinum USB, Schiit Yggdrasil, Benchmark DAC3 HGC MX 151, OppO BDP-95, JVC RS-500 DILA projector, 106" diagonal Stewart Luxus Screenwall Deluxe with Studiotek 130 G3 material. Lake House: Ohm F, MC 275V, C2300, MR 77, Rega P3 OnDeck: McIntosh MAC 4300v |
#5
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Agree with John and W9TR. Several years ago I chided Mac for not having a reference SS pre. Their response was the C1100 was the best pre they knew how to make. PHC1 is correct when he says Mac tubes and SS sound similar. Years ago when SS was just coming out Mac's goal was to make their SS sound identical to their tubes, their goal being superb sound plus added reliability. Mac's an old company. They succeeded. I like my 1.25 a lot better than my older 1.2. It sounds the way I remember my MC275 sounded years ago. If you want the ultimate pre the C1100 is the unit. I personally would stay away from the DAC modules. But that's just me. I remember as a kid I heard the first SS C24. It sounded bright noisy and brittle compared to my Dad's C22. Not even close. One of the very best SS vintage Mac pre's was the little known or respected C29. It was a truly quiet pre.
Best Charles ____________________ Charles Updated System: Wilson McIntosh Audioquest Most recent updates: AQ Diamond USB replaces AQ Coffee; Wilson Audio Specialties Alexx replaced by Wilson Audio Specialties XVX Chronosonic; new subwoofer crossover; new Galaxy Grey Thors Hammer; Wilson Pedestals Amps: McIntosh 1.25KW’s (3) set on floor on custom made cultured marble slabs Preamp and DAC: McIntosh D1100 Sources: McIntosh MCD1100 SACD player, MVP881 BR player, MVP851 DVD player, MR87 tuner, Marantz 510LV Laser Disc player, ASUS laptop USB (JRiver Media Center 23) Speakers: Wilson Audio Specialties XVX Chronosonic Sub-woofer: Wilson Audio Specialties Thor’s Hammer (1) horizontal lie and Wilson Watch Controller (abbr: WC) Cables main system: Audioquest Wel Signature speaker cables and balanced IC (preamp to amps); Wel Signature AES/EBU balanced digital IC for CD playback; Audioquest Diamond optical (1) for tuner, (1) for BR player, and (1) for LD player for total of (3); Diamond USB cable; McIntosh MCT cable for SACD playback; Dragon power cords (5 HC cords and 3 source cords for total of 8); Thunder HC power cord for tuner; cables for DVD player not listed Cables subwoofer system: Audioquest Redwood speaker cable (1); Wolf balanced subwoofer IC from WC to amp; Wind balanced IC from preamp to WC; Hurricane HC (2) and Dragon HC (1) power cords Power conditioners: Audioquest Niagara 7000 (1) and Niagara 5000 (3); (4) dedicated 20-amp lines with no. 10 wire straight out of fuse box Isolation: Wilson Pedestals Cabinet: Double Custom Woodwork & Design (CWD) solid walnut cabinet on large casters; holds all sources and preamp; also, Niagara 7000; 11 feet minimum distance from speakers Acoustic Treatments: Room and Echo Tunes AC: Dedicated to this room only, an ultra-high efficiency and quiet recently installed Ruud split system 3-ton heat pump. Room (mancave): 40’L x 15.5’W A-frame; max ceiling height 8’ min 5’; wall within wall construction built of 2 x 6’s; built over garage with custom hardwood floor with gym seal with over 40 Lowes stiffened wooden I-beams supporting floor; complete isolation from rest of house Last edited by Charles; 09-29-2020 at 04:53 AM. |
#6
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If it's from McIntosh, it's almost sure to sound terrific. But I disagree that their tube and solid state amps sound identical. It's been a few years since I picked my C22, but it was immediately apparent to me that the sound was warmer and fuller than the Mc SS I heard (can't remember the model number). I would guess that most readers of our forum would also hear the difference right away.
Just to be clear--this is not to say one is better or worse. I leave that to individual taste.
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Clearaudio Ovation with Tracer Dynavector KARAT 17DX Naim Uniti Core Schiit Yggdrasil McIntosh C22/MC275 Wilson TuneTots B&W DB3D Nordost QKore/QBase/Frey 2 Transparent Super IsoAcoustics GAIA II Stax SR-009S with SRM-700T |
#7
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#8
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Mac pre's have a neutral sound. The difference in Mac pre's becomes apparent as you upgrade to better sources, amps, and speakers. Many like to drop a piece into their system and get "blown away". Many times their ancillary gear is mediocre and 6mo to a year later they are looking for that next "blown away" experience with another piece of gear. Nothing wrong with that. It's what scratches your itch that counts. Folks are always looking to improve their sound. I want folks to enjoy their systems but just remember, folks may not provide follow up, and what works in their system may not improve yours. That's why I like sound signatures. Mine are Wilson, AQ, and Mac. Are their better and much more expensive gear available? Of course. But I like to stay within my sound signatures while trying to improve my system. If I had gone hog wild with amplification and digital sources, I would not have been able to afford my speakers. Almost no one has an unlimited budget. I think Wilson the best speaker manufacturer in the world. I think Mac and AQ are competitive with the best and relatively inexpensive. Have a long term plan for improvement and wait until that special piece of gear comes out that you really want. Meanwhile, enjoy the music. Best Charles Last edited by Charles; 09-30-2020 at 02:18 PM. |
#9
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Ankkor,
Demo'ing the C1100, as Tom (W9TR) suggests may be your best bet. I just upgraded from a C2500 to the C1100, and got more soundstage (depth especially) and clearer mids "out of the box". No regrets. As a point of reference, here's a synopsis of my preamps and amps since I got my first Mc amps in 2008: Yamaha receiver -> MC501s MX136 (C146 "core") -> MC501s C2500 -> MC501s C2500 -> MC2301s C1100 -> MC2301s Each step brought an improvement, along with a myriad of changes to the sources and speakers, as well as a move thrown in. Your MC1.2s probably would take well to the C1100s. Good luck, and let us know what you are thinking, and what you do.
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Sources: Vinyl: Clearaudio Innovation Wood turntable with 9" Universal tonearm, Da Vinci V2 cartridge, Stillpoints SS & Stillpoints clamp, McIntosh MVP 901, Apple Mac mini via Benchmark DAC 1, Aurender N100C via Schiit Yggdrasil Control: McIntosh C1100, Mcintosh MX151 Power: Mcintosh MC2301s (front), McIntosh MC501 (center), Mcintosh MC402 (rear) Speakers: Sonus Faber Amati Futura (front and back), SF Vox center Power/connections: PS Audio Power Port receptacles, RGPC 400 pro (2) WireWorld interconnects and speaker cable |
#10
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I’m thinking it might be fun to get a D1100 and use it as a stand-alone preamp/DAC for a year. At that point I could get the C1100 and use the D1100 as it’s DAC. Only reservation is the D1100 has been out awhile so I’m wondering if a new reference DAC is on the horizon.
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