AudioAficionado.org

AudioAficionado.org (https://www.audioaficionado.org/index.php)
-   Marantz (https://www.audioaficionado.org/forumdisplay.php?f=49)
-   -   Marantz SA 10 vs SA11S3 (https://www.audioaficionado.org/showthread.php?t=42251)

4music 02-20-2018 12:58 PM

Marantz SA 10 vs SA11S3
 
I would really appreciate it if someone had a chance to compare both players head to head. What are the differences? I am especially interested into Red Book CD playback. Is the SA10 much better for CDs?

Beet Farmer 10-23-2018 07:37 AM

Now, two thirds of a year later, the player to compare with the SA-10, is the new Marantz SA-KI 'Ruby' just introduced. has the same drive as the SA-10, same chassis, slightly different internal boards.
There was a limited edition available only in EU called "Pearl" but now it has been turned into a Jr. version of the Flagship SA-10.
It also uses the same DSD 'MMM" sort of decoding. But has less 'state of the art' electronics included. Also no balanced out, only RCA outputs.
I would almost buy one as a backup...

RaceCarDriver 11-14-2018 11:28 AM

I had the PM-14S1 & PM-14S1 for some time. IMO For the price they were great pieces, performing well above the price of admission.

The $2,500 SA-14S1 "entry level" reference player was discontinued recently along with the matching PM-14S1.

The Ki-Ruby pieces are replacement/upgrades to the PM-14S1. The Ki-Ruby celebrate 40 years of Ken Ishiwata with Marantz.

The Ki-Pearl pieces are pieces from 2009. SA-Ki Pearl & PM-Ki Pearl. They are 30 year anniversary pieces from Ken Ishiwata with Marantz.

The reason for the Ruby & Pearl names is that Rubys are traditional gifts to celebrate 40 years together and Pearls are the 30 year traditional gift.There have been several other Ken Ishiwata Signature editions over the years, the Ruby just happens to be the latest. It would be cool to see a Ki-Gold here in another 10 years.

https://www.us.marantz.com/DocumentM...merica_Inc.pdf

The $8,000 PM-10 & $7,000 SA-10 are still the top dog reference pieces by Marantz. The Ki-Ruby pieces are not replacements for those. I have both the PM-10 and SA-10, that SA-10 is a very special 40lb beast. I can't see myself ever getting rid of it! If you happen to get any of the Marantz gear it all of it is very special. If you end up with an SA-10 I am sure you will be very happy!

Beet Farmer 11-14-2018 11:40 AM

Just to mention the older Marantz SA-KI PEARL is a different machine than the Marantz SA-Ki RUBY!
The PEARL does not use the SA-10 spinner. Nor does it use the SA-10 decoding machine
Where the Marantz SA-KI RUBY Does use the same disc drive as the SA-10 and also the same decoding machine as the SA-10
So the RUBY is much better than the PEARL, all around.
The reason I discovered these things was a PEARL was for sale used.. So I read up on it, alas it is not the same... Though that chassis is also nearly identical in shape and size.
The chassis is identical between the SA-10 and RUBY. The difference is three pounds weight. Also the RUBY does not have balanced out, only single ended.
Interior images of a SA-10 and SA-KI RUBY do show a different design main circuit board, the RUBY does not have shielding on the transformer. The SA-10 does. Otherwise all main parts are in the same places, and look alike.
(they remind me of the Sony SCD-1 and SCD777.. Nearly identical, with the better one using better quality parts)

RaceCarDriver 11-14-2018 12:38 PM

Correct, The Pearl is from 2009. The Ruby is the current Ki line for 2019. The "10"s are still the top models from Marantz.

The SCD-1 was awesome, heavy and mine was kind of finiky, the reason I sold my set a while ago.

Beet Farmer 11-14-2018 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaceCarDriver (Post 940406)
The SCD-1 was awesome, heavy and mine was kind of finiky, the reason I sold my set a while ago.

I still own my SCD777ES. But it is relegated to the bottom shelf. And sits unused. Mine became finicky too. Not reading the SACD layer of dual discs. And was so slow to load! I say I can take a nap between hitting close/play and the start of the music. I loved it when it was new.
I never even tried to compare the sound of the SCD777ES to the SA-10.

Formerly YB-2 11-14-2018 06:57 PM

So sad that Sony stopped making the optical blocks for their 777ES series. The rest of the system is good for 20yr, or more.

doggiehowser 11-14-2018 08:48 PM

I know someone who compared the SA-10 to the SA-14 and came away preferring the SA-14.

The SA-10 is IMHO a revolutionary engine - it uses an FPGA DSD decoding engine (not unlike Playback Designs/EMM Labs and PS Audio) so it is a different sound to traditional Burr Brown DACs used in the SA-14.

You may or may not like the sound - so best to listen first.

The SA-Ruby is the 40th Anniversary unit in limited numbers. In this instance, it is the SA-10 minus balanced output (pretty much).

The SA-Pearl was the 30th Anniversary model that was based off the original SA-14 (also single ended only). There was also an SA-Pearl Lite (based on the SA8005 - non Reference model).

AFAIK the SA-14 hasn't been discontinued - the SA-10 replaced the SA-11 but I imagine the SA-Ruby will not be a regular production model after this.

RaceCarDriver 11-15-2018 03:33 AM

The 14s were removed from Marantz’ website not too long ago and is no longer available at places such as Crutchfield. Prior to the SA-14S1 I had the 13S2 combo. I still prefer the SA-10 to them all.

GeAllan70 11-15-2018 09:47 AM

:lurk:

http://www.the-ear.net/sites/default...0-internal.png

RaceCarDriver 11-20-2018 12:05 AM

Just gotta day i’m really enjoying the DAC in the SA-10 tonight. I picked up my new Bluesound Node 2i and I find the DAC in the Marantz superior to the Bluesound, obviously. Listening to Gunships new album and even some Eagles on Tidal.

doggiehowser 11-20-2018 03:37 AM

But you don't get MQA on the Marantz..

audio bill 11-20-2018 09:37 AM

If RCD is using the Bluesound's digital output it does provide MQA Core decoding even if the Marantz doesn't support MQA.

RaceCarDriver 11-20-2018 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by audio bill (Post 941231)
If RCD is using the Bluesound's digital output it does provide MQA Core decoding even if the Marantz doesn't support MQA.

I have digi coax and optical running from the Node 2i into the SA-10 and even RCA outputs to let the Node do the rendering.

I did a little of listening with both the optical & digi coax into the SA-10 along with the RCA output of the Node2i. With the Nodes DAC it seemed to of lose all the low end and the soundstage narrow even though I think with the digital outputs of the Node you are limited to 96k?

I've run my Sonos Connect, NA-11S1 and MacBook into the SA-10. I am able to get 384K with the Mac into the SA-10s USB input, but I usually don't feel like plugging in the Mac with a long USB cable.

I even messed around with the Audiquest USB DAC for MQA out of my Mac. Not that it was a bad option to go analog from that into my PM-10 I had, but found I rather either stream something into the SA-10s digital inputs if I didn't use the USB input from the Mac. I'm at the point where I prefer less cables, less adapters.

I was totally into MQA about a year ago and took the summer off not really listening to much music. Now that the colder part of the year is back time to refresh my memory and see what's new.

Prior to picking up an SA-10 I did the same with the NA-11S1, but now I have the SA-10 I don't use the NA-11S1 even though it's a wonderful option if you don't want to spend $7K on a disc spinner!

audio bill 11-20-2018 12:34 PM

Even though the Node's analog outputs provide full MQA decoding, you're likely hearing the clear superiority of the Marantz DAC despite sacrificing MQA rendering when being driven by the Node's digital outputs.

RaceCarDriver 11-20-2018 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by audio bill (Post 941263)
Even though the Node's analog outputs provide full MQA decoding, you're likely hearing the clear superiority of the Marantz DAC despite sacrificing MQA rendering when being driven by the Node's digital outputs.

Yep! That was why I figured I'd chime in on this thread. Love this player and use the input more so than spinning a disc.:thumbsup:

Mac6 06-21-2019 10:42 AM

Getting the SA-KI Ruby disc player delivered today. Should be interesting....looking forward to it.

Formerly YB-2 06-21-2019 10:24 PM

Think I liked my SA8004 better than my current Oppo 203. Looking forward to your review.

rnrmf1971 06-23-2019 12:44 AM

I'm using the SA-10 in a second system without anything to compare to but I like everything I hear. There isn't anything I even nitpick about, which is rare. It seems detailed and smooth, both as a DAC and disc player. I wish I could compare with my Oppo 205.
I like it enough that I'd consider another one for that system, though.

If your SA-KI Ruby approaches the same performance I perceive from the SA-10, I can't imagine being less than pleased with it.

GSOphile 06-23-2019 08:19 AM

No dealers that carry Marantz Ref gear anywhere near here, and almost nothing on the SA-10 seen on various forums a year or two ago, else I very well might have bought the Marantz unit over the more expensive Esoteric K-03X. SA-10 technology/build quality is impressive. I play mostly classical, so MQA not a big deal for me (e.g., more inclined toward Qobuz than Tidal).

rnrmf1971 06-23-2019 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GSOphile (Post 969797)
No dealers that carry Marantz Ref gear anywhere near here, and almost nothing on the SA-10 seen on various forums a year or two ago, else I very well might have bought the Marantz unit over the more expensive Esoteric K-03X. SA-10 technology/build quality is impressive. I play mostly classical, so MQA not a big deal for me (e.g., more inclined toward Qobuz than Tidal).

I decided to try it based on the handful of reviews I read and the Marantz aesthetic of champagne color components.
I got the matching PM-10 integrated and I don't have any regrets in the few months I've been using them.

There are a lot of reviews on the Marantz UK site:
https://www.marantz.co.uk/uk/product...productid=sa10

Mac6 07-11-2019 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mac6 (Post 969484)
Getting the SA-KI Ruby disc player delivered today. Should be interesting....looking forward to it.

I've put around 100 hours on the SA-KI Ruby SACD player. This player sounds fantastic. I have a McIntosh MVP871 also hooked up and have done a few A/B tests. The Marantz sounds at least as good, probably a bit better (richer) than the McIntosh. Very enjoyable.

The McIntosh won't read all my SACDs anymore so I bought the Marantz (One expensive repair was enough, I was not going to do it again with the MVP 871).

Formerly YB-2 07-11-2019 08:36 PM

Yes............. the MVP871 is pretty long in the tooth. Too bad the Ruby does not have XLR outs.

Mac6 07-12-2019 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Formerly YB-2 (Post 972553)
Yes............. the MVP871 is pretty long in the tooth. Too bad the Ruby does not have XLR outs.

I have Kimber XLR connections on the McIntosh. I did A/B tests with RCAs a few years ago. No difference.

GSOphile 07-12-2019 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mac6 (Post 972636)
I have Kimber XLR connections on the McIntosh. I did A/B tests with RCAs a few years ago. No difference.

Much depends on the brand/model/implementation - not just the connector. On components with a fully balanced implementation rather than just a balanced to single ended conversion for processing, there may be a significant difference in SQ.

Juanra74 08-04-2019 06:23 AM

Hi guys! just arrived here :)

I'm looking for SACD/CD player for, at least, a decade. I have a big doubt between the Ruby and the SA10 (even I'm thinking about the dark side, ESOTERIC... sorry).
But, talking about the Marantz, is any big difference between both? I only could test the Ruby with Copland tube amp and a pair of Klipsch Forte III and it was amazing. I wonder if the SA10 is worth double the price (or the esoteric...)

Kind regards, have a nice summer!

rnrmf1971 08-05-2019 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Juanra74 (Post 974948)
Hi guys! just arrived here :)

I'm looking for SACD/CD player for, at least, a decade. I have a big doubt between the Ruby and the SA10 (even I'm thinking about the dark side, ESOTERIC... sorry).
But, talking about the Marantz, is any big difference between both? I only could test the Ruby with Copland tube amp and a pair of Klipsch Forte III and it was amazing. I wonder if the SA10 is worth double the price (or the esoteric...)

Kind regards, have a nice summer!

Tough question; I think I've read that the Ruby is much of the SA10 but without the balanced circuitry.
Although I had (still have) my SA10 and Esoteric K-01x at different times and in different systems, I might suggest that the Marantz offers as good or better performance versus similar costing Esoteric units. There are too many variables to be sure about that and I've never heard the Esoteric players in that range, let alone their recently updated players, though. They're both undoubtedly quality components, as far as I'm concerned.
But given that you like the Ruby, ask yourself if you could be happy with it. If it ticks all the boxes for you, it would seem like a good value. Otherwise, seek out the SA10 or an Esoteric player to see how they move you.

Masterlu 08-05-2019 09:48 AM

Juanra74... Welcome to AA! :wave:

Formerly YB-2 08-05-2019 08:44 PM

The two Ruby pieces were Ken's last 'statement' pieces for Marantz before they give him the 'retirement' boot.

Juanra74 08-31-2019 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rnrmf1971 (Post 975084)
Tough question; I think I've read that the Ruby is much of the SA10 but without the balanced circuitry.
Although I had (still have) my SA10 and Esoteric K-01x at different times and in different systems, I might suggest that the Marantz offers as good or better performance versus similar costing Esoteric units. There are too many variables to be sure about that and I've never heard the Esoteric players in that range, let alone their recently updated players, though. They're both undoubtedly quality components, as far as I'm concerned.
But given that you like the Ruby, ask yourself if you could be happy with it. If it ticks all the boxes for you, it would seem like a good value. Otherwise, seek out the SA10 or an Esoteric player to see how they move you.

Thanks! I'm going to try the Esoteric 05xs next week... :)

tom1120s 03-10-2020 02:50 PM

Just bought a SA-10 to pair up with my PM-10. Hope its the last spinner I buy.


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:38 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.10
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
©Copyright 2009-2023 AudioAficionado.org.Privately owned, All Rights Reserved.