Revel Ultima Salon 2/Marantz MA9S2?
 

To those in the know....since the Revel's sensitivity is only about 86, could these monoblocks do them justice? Does anyone think that I would really want to get something different for power or perhaps double down and buy a couple more amps and try to bi-amp the speakers?:scratch2: Would I need another SC7S2?

I suspect that the amps could push them fine but I wonder about the limitations that high volumne listening would induce upon the amps in general.

Curious at this stage. Prices are coming down and I suspect if Marantz introduces new reference gear, more MA9S2 may appear on the used market.

Speculation, I know.

Thanks to all who post.

I owned the Salon 2's. If I was buying amps today for Salon 2's I would buy Classe CA-M600's, McIntosh 1.2kw or the Pass x600.5's (a pair just went up for sale here on AA).

I think 750 watts @ 4 ohms is the minimum for the Salon 2's and quite honestly I would suggest staying north of 1kw. I know there are some here who would disagree, but I found the more juice you give the Salon 2's, the more they ate and the better they sounded.

If you need cheap power - then the Anthem M1's are worth a look. The reviews aren't stellar though - however, we do have a user here on AA who has the Salon 2's and Anthem M1's and liked it a lot on the Salon 2's. That being said, he is upgrading to the Classe CA-M600's. His username is MDP - maybe you can talk to him about his M1's?

Great speakers by the way! I loved mine when I had them.

Mike

Mike.......Good advice. One thing is certain, you learned 300 watts per channel doesn't cut it with the Salon 2's.

That is good advice. However, the Marantz amps 'double down' with the wattage based on loads(as I understand it). So, since the Revels are rated 6 ohms nominal, would that not mean the Marantz may be generating roughly 450 wpc+/1 giving the load it is pushing?

I had a feeling the speakers could absorb a lot of power, hence my question.

Thanks to all.

Would you guys stop already with this "not enough power for the salons" talk? You are really starting to make me feel insecure with my measely 400 wpc MC452 :sigh: Do I really need more power for the Salons? :nail::paranoid:

:D

Do I hear dual MC452's? :yes:

Jeff.......I own a MC452 and can tell you it is one powerful two channel amplifier. I believe you meant to say it puts our 450 watts per channel, not 400, but that's only part of the story. The MC452 can easily deliver 650 watts per channel on peaks with out breaking a sweat or flickering the Power Guard lights. The MC452 is the perfect place to be with the Salon 2's unless your typical listening level consistently approaches stadium rock concert levels. You have no reason to be nervous about anything. :thumbsup:

Thank you Dan! I feel much better now. :thumbsup:

And Joe? You are my neighbor! You're supposed to tell me it's OK, just like Dan, lol.

Here is a pic I took when I had my 601"s easily pumping 450 watts thru my Kefs and the amps still sounded amazing and the amp could easily do more

It's ok! Dan is right, that 452 is woefully under rated. Like the 601's too.

Dan is right, the 2301's are awesome and they sounded sweet on the Salon 2's, but those Salon 2's of mine were power hungry!!

Look, Mom. No Power Guard light. :applause:


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8197/8...fdb1fd86_c.jpg

hahah nice Dan :)

I realize this entire site seems to be designed for McIntosh users, hell, I had a McIntosh MC402 before to the Marantz. Saying that, I was looking for information regarding the suitibility of the MA9S2 mono blocks with this particular speaker in a Marantz forum(at least that is what I thought).

No matter. Thanks again for your help.

Tom - I've owned the Salon 2's and based on the specs of the Marantz, I don't think it's a great fit. It will work, but you need more power my friend to get the best out of those wonderful speakers of yours.

Ok. Next question. What will work better? See my response above.

Mike
P.S. yes, this is a heavy Mcintosh forum.....but we are widely versed and experienced with other non-Mc gear.

Interesting. So everyone agrees that a McIntosh MC452 WILL drive these speakers without issue and the Marantz will not-at least as well, correct? That is remarkable-to me. My theory and thoughts: Although the McIntosh MC402 could drive my JBL 1400 Array speakers, the Marantz does it better in the bass regions while the mids/highs are a bit more detailed than the McIntosh, although the Mac did have a very warm, pleasant sound(this is according to me). It was explained to me that it was not so much about the wpc but more so of the supplied current for transients. From what I can glean, the Marantz have 150 amps of peak current where the McIntosh was in the ballpark of 100 amps. Also, while considering the move from the 402 to 501 monoblocks or the 452, I noticed that the 452 actually has a lower stated current supply than the 402.......weird, I thought. Personally, I suspect that some speakers require more current than others to shine. I would expect the amps listed in the first response to be of similar or much better quality than the Marantz amps but I am unwilling(at this point)to upgrade. I guess I would rather stay the status quo-which is fine by me.

Again, I thank all for the responses. It is still a leaning process for me. One that will continue until I can really discuss the technology in a more proficent and concrete way.

I don't agree the 452 is a good match. So, no....not everyone - especially the guy who owned them! Mark here on the forum owns the Salon 2's and he will tell you the 501's will barely enough and certainly not optimum. He is driving them now with 2000 watts a channel (into 4 ohms) for what it's worth. Anthem M1's.

But if you like the Marantz - get them! Marantz makes great stuff!

Mike

Thanks. However, I have the Marantz amps already (see signature). I just happened to see a pair of Revels for sale near my area for about 50% retail and was thinking........that said, The JBL 1400 Arrays I have are great-to me. As most here will attest, the 'upgrade bug' sometimes arisies. To tell the truth, I suspect the Salons would be a tad to big for my modest room anyway.

Thanks again to everyone. Maybe if a pair of Klipsch P-37 Palladium speakers are out there.......Perhaps a efficient speaker is what is on the horizon......:smoking:

Not to try to keep your bug alive, but have you heard the Salon 2's? You might be swayed with a good listen, like I was. I did the same thing, got them used at 50% retail, which is a steal in my book for anything approaching this level of SQ. I tried to power them initially with a Sunfire 200wpc amp that doubled down into 4 and 2 ohms. It sucked, and I couldn't understand why, since many of the reviews I'd read had used amps with lesser power. The guys here "harassed" me :) into buying a more powerful, better quality amp. I came across another great deal on a used MC452 and jumped on it. To say the improvement in SQ was enormous is an understatement. Now, can I tell you that Mike is right and this beast, with more power, will sound even better? I cannot, as I've not made that comparison, and frankly I don't feel the need to, as I am extremely happy with where I am now. Having said that, there has been a time or two where I saw the needle pegging, and I wondered if I was pushing the 452 to the max, but that's been so infrequent that it hasn't been an issue. So, as far as 450 watts and the MC452, I think this is a fine amount of watts and a fine amp to get real pleasure from the Salon 2. More power may in fact be better, but I think with 450/452, the threshold of satisfaction and enjoyability has been firmly crossed.

Jeff.......:laughin: . :roflmao: . :lmao:

I have yet to hear the Salon2's - but they are the ones I am referring to. As indicated, I am not going to change up the current set up I have with the Marantz gear. I like it that much. Again, My thoughts are that how the amp(s) operate with enough current (and wpc) have more effect than just wpc. My JBL Arrays are rated at 89 and sound quite nice driven by a lonely 300 wpc(8 ohm)600 wpc(4 ohm)-better than the McIntosh MC402 I had before. As a matter of fact, I just came across a picture of the Salons WITH the complete Marantz reference system but because of reasons I do not know(perhaps I have to be a member?), I can not upload it. It was at a audio show.......

Tom.......Your Marantz MA9S2 amplifiers are beauties. I can see why you are proud of them and don't plan to swap them for anything.


http://us.marantz.com/assets/images/...L_MA-9S2_D.jpg



http://us.marantz.com/Assets/images/...A-9S2_back.jpg

Well, you did.:o

Thankfully, I finally listened :yes:

And now I'm enjoying audio bliss :music::banana:

I really do think the question here is how the Salons would sound with what you have. My guess is they will sound fantastic, as the Marantz amp is plenty powerful and of sufficient high-end quality to do justice to the Salons. Read the many reviews (and forum discussions) of the Salon 2 and you will find that many lower powered but high-quality amps were used by reviewers (and owners) to their great satisfaction. I have read that Revel themselves voice the Salon 2 with the Levinson 432h, which is a 300wpc amp. So, if Mike doesnt mind, let me put his suggestion in some context: the Salon 2, IMHO, will sound great with good power from a quality amp. You have that. However, the beauty of the Salon 2 is that you can probably make it sound even better with a higher power/quality amp if you so choose. It's that good of a speaker. The question is, can you live with great sound, or will the fact that you may not wring every last bit of greatness out of the Salon 2 with your current amp going to bother you? Only you can answer that, but, IMO, be not afraid to go forward with the Marantz/Revel combo.

You can thank me later :yes:

PS- Dan, how'd I do at my first attempt at "AA harassment school?"

Ok,I just finished reading this entire thread. Your MA9S2 amps are fantastic amps,absolutely first rate. I agree with you about current,and this may surprise a few people, but the way your amps double down really means something and I think they will do a fine job driving the Salon 2's !!
How loud do you usually listen ?
What kind of music do you listen to ?
What are your room dimensions ?

The Salons can certainly "Use" the extra power if its available , but I still think your Marantz amps are up to the challenge !!

As I've said before,there is no other speaker that can touch the Salon2's for the money spent, and I highly recommend you go and listen to them.

If you have any other questions, feel free !!!


Mark

+1 :thumbsup:

Your MA9S2 amplifiers are rated at 600w/4ohms and can supply current peaks of 150 amps. I would not be as worried with the Salon's sensativity as much as the lowest impedence. If you over drive the amps they will shut-down and go into protect mode, I've seen this with electrostatics that dip below 2 ohms and no harm was done. Just how loud do you want to listen ? :music:

Go to Marantz's web-site and read all the reviews for the MA9S2's, I think one of them used the Salon's. You will need to do a search for the MA9S2 since it is no longer listed as current product. Remember what you discovered when you replaced the 402, the MA9S2's outperformed the 402 in bass punch and control. Although the 452 is a huge improvement over the 402 it is an Autoformer based amp. It will never approach the current drive (capability) of your MA9S2 which has much lower output impedence (aprox. 0.01 ohms).
It is nonsense (unrealistic) to compare your amp to one which will output 1.2kw, four time the power.

interested to see how this turns out for you tom. I have B&W 800d, not particularly efficient speakers either. I'm thinking about upgrading from my current Rotel 200w/channel amp and the Marantz monoblocks are at the top of the list. Have heard Mcintosh and thought it was too flabby and the bass muddled. If I can find a pair of the Marantz I will likely pull the trigger....I just find it hard to believe that 600w/4ohms high quality power is not enough, even for inefficient speakers like the Salons or the 800d.

I've had the Salon 2s for 2 yrs. Originally, I drove them with an Anthem amp producing 225 w/ch and I was dissappointed with the purchase. I decided to upgrade the electronics and moved to ARC including a 450 w/ch class D amp - wow, a significant improvement. The speakers sing with good quality gear. My room is 19X16x10.

I've heard them with ML 300 w/ch and they sound nice.

While the Salon 2s love power, quality makes a bigger difference than the number of watts.

Interesting. From what I remember, Marantz targeted the B&W Nautilus speakers in producing these mono blocks. They were built with the mission of driving less than ideal speaker loads and I recall the B&W speaker to be the template.:yes:

I have a medium sized room right now. It gets loud with the Arrays with plenty of juice left from the amp(s). Again, since I love the reference system so much and will not change, are the Salons bi-ampable? Would I need an active crossover? How about some nice tubes on top...?:scratch2:

I don't know if the Salons are biampable? Hope this provides a point of reference. My room is 14X31 and I'm driving Thiel 3.7's which are power hungry. My system will play extremely loud and has never run out of power.

They are biampable, but you must use the same amps. All four of the same.

That's what I've been advised as well. :yes:

I think you can mix amps as long the amp input sensitives are the same.

I have two sets of amps but can't bi-amp since the ARC Ref250 has much lower sensitivity than the Krell.

Rich