McIntosh d1100 USB
 

Anybody here using USB input on their d1100? If you are, I would love to know if it works perfectly for you, or if you have any issues. I am facing two minor issues

1) When playing any album, roughly the first half second is lost

2) When playing an album, transitioning between tracks has intermittent issues. Specifically, sometimes at the end of one track and before the next, the DAC loses lock on the signal. When this happens, I lose the very first part of that next track, similar to issue 1. This only happens between some tracks and on some albums, but I can reproduce it readily with many different albums.

I have done a lot of testing. I have tried Windows with the McIntosh ASIO driver, Apple MacBook Air, and also my raspberry pi acting as Roon Bridge. I have tried several software packages as well. They all have the same issue. One exception is that when using JRiver, if I change the settings so that it adds 2 seconds of silence at start, it seemingly solves the first problem, but not the second. Also, I am not a JRiver user, and don’t want to be.

I would love to hear mostly what other people’s experiences are with the d1100 USB input. Mine runs firmware 1.02 and is controlled by my c1100, although it behaves identically in pre-amp mode also.

Thank You.

I use MCD1100’s DAC via USB a lot. I don’t know whether/how MCD1100 and D1100’s DAC+USB implementations are related, but they might be related, so I would like to share my experience here.

The issue I am facing is a very faint whistle like noise from inside the machine, between two tracks, in USB mode.

It seems to me that the DAC does some “reset” operation between tracks, because I hear the exact same sound when turning the “input” knob.

Sometimes this behavior is due to how the album is ripped. Ripping software and settings chosen when ripping can produce these issues. Can you expand further on the albums that you mention?

Well, for issue #1, all albums. Here are 3 great test albums, where missing the first half second is very obvious

- Beatles - Please Please Me (You miss part of the 1,2,3,foooowa!)
- Beatles - Hard Day’s Night (First part of iconic chord)
- AC/DC - Highway to Hell

Issue 2 is all over the map. I will also mention that my previously owned Bryston BDA3 had neither of the issues. Same hardware, same software. All my CD’s were ripped bit perfect with dbPwerAMP. It also happens with high resolution downloads, and DSD sources from my SACD rips, so it is not a rip specific file problem

I have done all the tshoot one can possibly do, so this isn’t even really just about that. I genuinely want to know if I am the odd guy out here, or if this is simply how the DAC behaves.

Thanks,

Joey

McIntosh d1100 USB
 

Issue #1 is normal operation for D1100. Mine does same thing.

And I betcha all current McIntosh DACs.

IIRC, basically this is McIntosh’s “fix” for the issue of different sample rates from successive songs hitting the dac which causes (or may cause) some sort of artifact, I believe a chirp or some other type of digital noise. They chose to truncate the first milliseconds (half a second??) so this digital artifact is not reproduced.

It is annoying but I’m used to it now. This is NOT isolated to USB but occurs with coaxial and AES too in my system.

I will have to check and see if MCT connection is same thing.

McIntosh d1100 USB
 

It has absolutely nothing to do with your rips.

Chirp, yes that’s what I heard. And I agree it’s not related to the gap settings of CD ripping, because I have the same issue when streaming Tidal.

I have the D1100 and I noticed this behavior as well. Interestingly enough, The Beatles were also part of my troubleshooting

In my testing, I only found issues in albums that were ripped from CD using EAC, dbPoweramp, etc. Filesets purchased from HDtracks, 7digital, etc had no skipping or transition issues. I have seen the DAC lose lock on these filesets, but it doesn't affect the audio at all.

If your Bryston had perfect playback on the album's you mention, then I guess this is how the D1100 DAC behaves .

Thanks. What is your experience with behavior between tracks? BTW, we have nearly identical system, nice!

Do you have the issue when spinning CDs and SACDs?

McIntosh d1100 USB
 

I will have to check and report back. I’m not home at the moment. I can’t recall if it happens with the MCT input on D1100 which is how I connect my spinner, MCT450, to my D1100.

For the record, I don’t have the issue when spinning physical CD, but I use optical for that. I don’t have a McIntosh SACD transport to try. So, for me the issues are isolated to USB, which is what I use to play 100% of my digital music. I only tried a physical CD player to be thorough.

Joey

I don't have the issue with physical CD either, I use a coax connection here.

Over USB, I guess I'm lucky to only get this issue once in a blue moon. The Beatles US Albums (Beatles 65) rip comes to mind as having this issue, but the same album (almost)on the Beatles in Stereo rip or Beatles in Mono rip does not have the issue on my system. The "I'm a" on I'm a Loser is cut off on only 1 of the 3 versions.

McIntosh d1100 USB
 

It does it with MCT input too. Every track. It doesn’t matter the input.

It is simply built into the DAC. It mutes the output when it encounters silence .... between tracks or when skipping tracks.

The only reason you don’t hear it EVERY time is because the song starts in such a fashion where the mastering or actual notes are not there during that brief McDAC mute.

If you listen close you can pick it out on many tracks.

For instance, I just picked Tom Petty’s Wildflowers album via MCT450 (MCT cable). It’s most notable on track 5, “It’s Good to be King”. That track immediately starts with a cymbal crash which is completely absent when played back on the D1100.

Steamed it via Spotify on my phone to confirm the missing cymbal.

I can also hear the unmuting as a subtle “slurring” of the leading edge of first notes when a new track starts. Listen for it, you will hear it.

I knew this going in on my purchase and I am still glad I own the D1100. In the end, it doesn’t ruin my experience, quite the opposite, the D1100 sounds splendid!!

Thank you for the feedback. I agree with you 100% that the d1100 sounds awesome, especially paired with the c1100. I really like the sound of the DAC. Sadly, I'm struggling with this. I am an album guy. This is distracting from the album experience. It may be a deal breaker for me.

Maybe I am a perfectionist, naive, or whatever you want to call it, but I personally expect a reference DAC in this class and price point to be pretty perfect when it comes to playback. The ability to play albums without missing fractions of a second on all available inputs seems to be a pretty basic expectation. I know that I put a lot of effort, time, and money into achieving bit perfect playback. That all goes out the window, as soon as you start missing the start of tracks.

Looking forward to hearing other people's experiences.

I agree. Why would they choose a fix for sample rate changes among successive tracks over albums with the same sampling rate? I'm with you Joey in that I listen to albums as opposed to songs on shuffle. To have the issue on physical CD and SACD playback is even more crazy, although I have yet to hear a song on CD where the note starts right at 00. I can't wait to find one a try it though.

That being said, I am going to check out some of the tracks mentioned here and report back my findings.

Found this from a review of the D1100 when a reviewer noticed a similar behavior. I hope this helps.

Manufacturer's Comment: "The “fade-in” issue described in the review is a result of the DAC chip being used for both PCM and DSD audio. If the fade in was not present, DSD tracks could make a popping sound when they started playing. To avoid this, a very minute fade in was added."

It does it with my MCT450 connected using the MCT connector, but not a coax cable. It is annoying and Mac knows about the issue.

It is unacceptable that an $11k dac/transport combo can’t properly play a cd or sacd without cutting off the first 1/2 second...after all, that is its sole purpose.

McIntosh d1100 USB
 

Here is a comment that Chris Connacker of Computer Audiophile made regarding the D1100 muting :

“The issue boils down to the fact that the DAC chip is normally muted until it receives non-silence data. But, this non-silence data can't be just any non-silence data, it must be at a minimum volume level for the DAC to unmute. When the track reaches a certain volume level, the DAC unmutes and quickly fades-in to the music. In other words, the fade-in is triggered by a minimum amplitude, not by the start of a stream of USB data. Many DACs use a similar mute technique to reduce or eliminate pops on sample rate switches, but this is the only DAC I've seen that requires a minimum amplitude to unmute the volume.”

Cajunpepe... Welcome to AA! :wave:

I have the D1100 MCT450 connected using MCT and I don't have any problems. I read this thread the past hour I've play CDs and SACDs without the issue that's being discussed.

Thanks Masterlu...!!

What d1100 firmware? Strange how several people here report the same issues with the same equipment , but yours seemingly behaves differently.

For those testing with MCT only, how about your USB experience?

No problems at all using the aurender music server via usb

I don't have nearly the issues of others here, but I guess it's because I use JRiver for USB playback. I did not know until it was mentioned that it is "supported" by Mcintosh. I have yet to hear any issues with physical CD via coax. I have The Beatles US Albums CD box and I'm a Loser plays just fine, but my flac rip of it plays back with "I'm A" completely muted and kicks in at "Loser." This is why I initially thought the issue had to do with rip settings.

This is not the first time problems have been reported with Mac DAC's (standalone and inside their preamps). This DAC was high on my list to purchase as it would look really nice with the rest of my Mac gear, but it's going to be another Lampizator for me. Glad I waited.

McIntosh d1100 USB
 

I wouldn’t say it is a problem. It’s normal operation and other DAC manufacturers decide to mute a fraction of a second to prevent a digital artifact, well at least according to Chris Connacker and he is a far more well versed dac reviewer than myself.

The muting is inherent to ALL current McIntosh DACs. If you don’t hear it, it’s because it’s really really subtle on most all tracks.

Here is Ron-C’s response to my email inquiry this morning :


“Yes, we receive reports of excessive delays from some customers while others do not report this. D1100 like all McIntosh digital engines has a 1/10 second mute at the beginning of a song to identify the file format.

If you have a longer delay on 192 files as opposed top 16/44 this is a computer or music program issue. We test with a mix of files from MP3 16/44 through DSD256 Using JRiver 23.”


So there it is. It’s a 1/10th of a second mute with normal operation. Usually very subtle. If it’s longer, then could be because computer/driver/USB issue.

It doesn’t bother me or decrease my enthusiasm for this DAC. It’s a wonderful piece and worthy of any McIntosh based system. It’s so subtle that most all McIntosh DAC users don’t report it as a problem. And it didn’t stop computeraudiophile from placing it on its recommend components list for 2017 and gave it pretty glowing praise.

I would say it is a problem, at least for me, because of these reasons:

1) The delay is audibly at least 1/2 second of the first track of every album, sometimes more depending on file format. Maybe the DAC hardware/firmware implementation is supposed to go from muted to the point where you are hearing sound within 100ms, but that does not happen for me, for sure. To me, it's not subtle, it's very noticeable. It's not like I'm sitting here with an oscilloscope or analyzing a wave form to see if the delay is 101ms just so I can raise a support case. If it was that low in experience, it wouldn't be something you even hear. Again, I use the example of "I Saw Her Standing There", "A Hard Day's Night" and "Highway to Hell" - Play those tracks where you are missing the first part of Paul's count in, missing the first part of debatably the most iconic opening chord in rock and roll history, and the first part of Malcom's riff. That's noticeable. For example, I hear paul coming in on "three, four". "One, two..." that I am missing is certainly more than 100ms time. No question. So, while the implementation might be designed to be 100ms, that is certainly not what is actually happening in my case.

Same for many of the cases concerning problem #2 below, except it is less predictable.

2) The DAC visually loses lock between some tracks of many albums, resulting in a noncontinuous album playback experience where you are missing at least 1/2 second of the following track. It's not a once in a blue moon event, it is common. This is not all albums, only some and only between some tracks (where it actually loses lock). I have had the DAC for 2 weeks and have played many many different albums. It's probably 50/50 weather you see issue #2 depending on content.

3) I have tested this on Windows with ASIO driver and an Apple MacBook air with USB plugged directly into the DAC and with files stored on the local hard disks, and with many different pieces of software, all resulting in the same two issues. On Windows I tried Roon and foobar2000. On Apple I tried Roon, Quicktime, VLC, Vox, and JRiver. I also tried using my Roon core to stream to a raspberry pi running Linux/Roon Bridge and get the same results. The one exception was that when using JRiver, if you change the setting so that it inserts 2 seconds of silence at startup for hardware synchronization, it solved the first problem in one of my tests, but it did not solve the second.

So, I have done testing on 3 operating systems, 3 different computers, 2 USB cables, and 6 pieces of software, and they all exhibit these symptoms. Additionally, my other DAC didn't display the problem, and other people here have a similar experience with MCT transport on the d1100 MCT input. I don't believe I have some sort of unique issue on 3 different computers, and every piece of software tried, and that the people having MCT issues are also somehow unique. Now, other people have reported the same problems, some reported no problems, so maybe it is something intermittent, maybe it is something we don't fully understand yet, but I don't think you can just say there is no problem. There is an issue for some of us, and perhaps it is just a matter of weather or not you care about the issue or not in the long run.

McIntosh support has been looking into this with me, and has been great, very responsive and understanding of the issue. I will continue working with McIntosh support on this, and hope they can come up with a way to address it. At the end of the day, it's a great sounding piece of equipment, pairs awesome with my system, and is every bit as great as the reviews say. There is no question it is superb sounding, so hopefully this gets worked out so I can keep it. If not, I'll get a comparable DAC in the same price range that will better meet my expectations. It's really as simple as that.

Joey

I got the D1100 last November and told the dealer to make sure it had all the latest firmware update. I borrowed a friends Sony HAP-Z1ES Music player and hooked it up to D1100 via USB and had no problems. I'm going to buy a streamer most likely Lumin U1.

Most people seem to be having problems with ROON.

Within JRiver, go to Tools->Options->Audio.

"Play silence at startup for hardware synchronization:" set to 1/4 second (1/2 if you believe the delay is closer to 1/2).

Under Track Change, UNcheck "do not play silence."

See if that helps in any fashion.

McIntosh d1100 USB
 

@ Joey, I understand your position. It’s obviously a problem listening closely to what you have described. I did not intend to come across in a negative way. I was talking in general terms. Maybe using a computer it is much more noticeable (i.e longer mute) than my music server or MCT. I will also play the Beatles albums you mentioned, especially listening for Paul’s count in and Acdc HTH riff. Fingers crossed McIntosh support and/or E’s advice fixes the issue for you although I’m inclined to believe I will find the same cut off on my system whether playing files or the actual CDs on my MCT450 into D1100.

McIntosh d1100 USB
 

Joey ..... Here are the findings on my system via usb Aurender N10 to D1100.

I saw her standing there: only “3,4” on 2009 mono remaster file and streaming remastered file via Tidal. But “1,2,3,4” on 24/44 file sourced from the Apple USB stick.

A hard days night. Same thing ... missing the first hard sharp part of the initial guitar chord on both the 2009 mono file and remaster stream via Tidal but it’s there in its entirety on the 24/44 file sourced from the Apple USB stick.

Highway to Hell. Missing part of the opening riff on 16/44 original CD and Tidal stream but it’s all there on my digital rip of 180g remastered LP, both 16/44 and 24/96 vinyl rips.


I am running original firmware V1.00

Thanks for sharing. No negativity meant from me either at all, just wanting to share the info I have accurately

I don’t use JRiver though so that will not be a long term solution for me

I am having issues with all as well.

My dealer installed a complete new system in my place 3 months ago...D1100, C1100, MC601s, MCT450, and MPC 1500. My dealer has also been over on three occasions and can verify that the “fade in” is NOT 1/10 of a second—-in some cases, it is actually a full second (documented with video).

I have a $550 OPPO that doesn’t have this issue..Did I mention this is an $11,000 disc player combo??

I can’t help but think the manufacturer knew about this but chose instead to let the DAC out to market anyway (sort of like the CD500 DAC non compatibility with Apple—inexcusable for a $6500 CD player in the year 2016).

I let Mac know about my issues the day after I bought mine and it was set up—it’s now been 5 months and I have heard nothing.

j3brow—-Dead & Co. was pretty darn good in NOLA a couple nights ago....did you go? (I am in NOLA)

McIntosh d1100 USB
 

Cajunpepe: Well, it would appear this is a universal issue with the D1100. Buying your D1100 just 3 months ago, I would assume you have the latest firmware v1.02?

I’m still running v1.00. Called my McIntosh dealer today about getting the update. I have been informed there is also a service bulletin D1100sb01+052317. I assume whatever this sb is, it was issued last May and yours and Joe’s would be up to date, so I’m not expecting bringing my D1100 up to current will change the mute/unmute behavior whenever silence is encountered. I bought mine Feb 2017.

Did you buy your gear from Rich?

Regarding Dead and Company, yes I was there. It was phenomenal. Those guys are firing on all cylinders. Just a fantastic 2017-2018 run so far. I started a thread for this show back in December here.

McIntosh D1100 and MCT450 via MCT.
I Saw Her Standing There (mono remaster): Only "1 [half of it], 2, 3, 4".

McIntosh C52 and MCT450 via MCT.
I Saw Her Standing There (mono remaster): "1, 2, 3, 4".

McIntosh C52 DAC doesn't have similar problems with MCT450 via MCT.

McIntosh D1100 firmware is V1.01.

You may not be able to identify this problem, if you are just listening music. A random person might say that the D1100 sounds really great and not notice the problem.

Picky picky, enjoy your stereo you have a great system. Don’t get bent out of shape over something so minor

If using JRiver, did you try the suggestions from -E-???? He’s the JRiver whisperer...

j3brow....


Yes, I am running the latest firmware on both pre and DAC.

Yes, bought it all from Rich (also have a c500, MC501s, D100, and another MPC1500 I bought from Rich).

Rich is coming here tomorrow to install a firmware update he just got from Mac—I will post if it cures the ailment.


...and caught the boys in Boulder, Los Angeles (Hollywood Bowl), Dallas, and Austin last year!...getting ready to log some more Phish shows this summer (Atlanta, Dick,s, and possibly The Gorge).