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Old 04-22-2012, 09:48 PM
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Cool Inside Sound Vs Outside sound and treatment help

OK so today I decided to play around some with the nice weather and placed a pair of my 3 way towers on the back deck. Ugg they are massive and heavy

Outside I have it wired to my MX150 and MCD452 amp, and I normally use a Parasound amp connected to the mx150 that has 4 speaker settings 2 for upstairs and 2 for outside but today did some wire swapping. And the wiring in the walls is connected to all the gear that is in the basement.

The basement is fully finished thick pile carpets etc. 8 foot ceiling some pictures etc on the walls and no treatments. Room is NOT a echo box like it was before the carpet 6 years ago when I built it. I would say it is warm and a little on the live side, not to live and not to dead, but seems to me a little constrained and maybe in need of some treaments of sorts, maybe on the rear walls to give it more time delay or something?

I have my deck wired with your basic run of the mill decent not great 12 gauge speaker wire for my normal 8" 3 ways that play tunes for the back fenced in part of the yard when we cook out, drink, chill on the deck etc.


So here is my main observation and a few points of sound features that differ from inside the listening room.

1 out side has much better imaging
2 the tweeters are not brighter, but seem to carry in the air better and hang in space
3 you get of course the natural echo / mild reverb effect when outside.
all this on basic speaker wire only monster cable CL3 12 in wall type.
4 Drum sections seem to have that open carry kick drum sound and less dull and are faster and tighter in the feel of the sound
5 Mids, well that is always the biggest diff from live to studio, they just sound like they are outside to me, the voices have thout typical oudoor sound in the mids.

I kind of really like it, that being the overall sound. The open feel is amazing, reminds you of a concert even sitting only 16 feet feet away you get the sense of the space and not 40 feet, at 30 + it really goes to the next level sounding live.

So not that I want to make the indoors the same as the outdoors, but what acoustic treatments can be done to inside to open up the space and make it feel more outdoors and open in terms on the separation, imaging etc.

Seems to me that even though my room is 22 feet by 34 feet and the area I have the gear and the listening couch in is about a 20x 22 foot section of that space, it just seems rather tight and closed in. The reaming depth of the room is behind my listening position.

Again, it sounds great inside, but again with all the power speakers etc I have it only seems to exhibit the open and better imaging at lower volumes. The room gets small in a hurry to me.

Some other notes.
In the listening room the front main speakers are about 14 feet apart, my sofa is about 14 feet away, and I have 2 custom large subs that are driven with 2 601s and one is on each side of the sofa. The bass is amazing and to me spot on.

I wont go into the surround and other 6 speakers, they are not part of this test and what I am looking to gain in the 2 ch mode.

My gear outside to me sounds outside and somewhat like a live concert, much better though, not the typical PA outdoors big concert sound.


So I would like some feedback on what others on this topic, or own system have changed and or tested, or how you would characterize your sound of your system, and maybe what steps can be done to make he inside better? Well in terms of imaging and separation etc. I dont want outdoors, just better staging, imaging, sense of space, imaging etc. And I would say the issues are mainly in the top end and mid ranges that need the tweaking

PS the outside of the house is a cedar wood siding and a redwood deck for reflective properties.


My gut tells me with well over $200K of gear and as good as all the stuff I own is, and I get some great feedback from those that have heard the system. I just think my system, and to that point most of our systems have the bulk of all our investment put into the gear and not the room.

When I worked in my teen years, back when Edison created electricity the studios had a lot.... I mean a boat load of stuff done to the ceilings, walls, etc for the sound treatments.

Without getting a PRO into my house and having dozens of panels, traps etc. to place by trial by fire, where do you even begin to start
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Dave's Cave
MX150 control center, (3)McIntosh 601 mono block amps, (1)7270 McIntosh amp & (1)452 McIntosh amp, Esoteric K-03

Headphone Rig
Sennheiser hd 650 & Sennheiser hd 700 cans, and Woo Audio WA-6SE with Sophia Princess & matched pair of 6GL7/6EM tubes

Also
(1)Halo A23 amp, (1)Parasound 5250 amp. Oppo 95 , Sony ES777, (2)PPPs, Little Dot MarkIII amp

Speaker system
Builder of custom very high end Dynaudio's 2 Main towers, 4 surrounds and a custom 5 speaker center channel to compliment my 2 300lb custom subs
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Old 04-22-2012, 10:30 PM
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This has worked on occasion to get the "Speaker Whisperer's" attention.

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Ivan

FLORIDA
MX136, C15, MC206, MC162(2) MC402, MC1.2KW(12) MC2KW(2) MR85, MS300(2) MCD301, MCD1100, MS750(2) MVP881, MCD1000, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT3F(2) WS350(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) XCS350(2) OLIVE 04HD, PS AUDIO PPP(8) PUREPOWER 2000(4) RGPC 1200(20) RGPC POLE PIG(4) JL GOTHAM SUBS(2) SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, GRACE M903 HEADPHONE AMP, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U PROJECTOR, SVS SCISSOR LIFT, STEWART STUDIOTEK 120" MOTORIZED SCREEN, HRS DAMPING PLATES, ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, CINEMA-TECH SEATING, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM STARLIGHT HDMI, GOLD ECLIPSE CABLES & SILVER ELECTRA PC'S
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CAPE COD
MX150, MC501(2) MC1.2KW(10) MC2301(2) MR88, MS750(3) MVP881, MEN220, MCD1100, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT3F(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) BENCHMARK DAC-1 HDR, OPPO-BDP95, OLIVE 02M, PS AUDIO PPP(8) PUREPOWER 1050(4) RGPC 1200(15) JL GOTHAM SUBS(2) JL FATHOM F113 SUBS(4) SOUND ANCHOR SUB STANDS(2) LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U PROJECTOR, STEWART STUDIOTEK 120" SCREEN, SONUS FABER STRADIVARI, URC MX-6000 REMOTE, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, OLIVE 02M, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, FORTRESS SEATING, HRS DAMPING PLATES, GOLD LION TUBES, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD GOLD & PLATINUM ECLIPSE CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...0&d=1327845807 - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...d-dsc_3310.jpg
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Analog Rig: CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD TT, CA OUTER RING & CLAMP, UNIVERSAL ARM w/ Da VINCI' CART, 2nd UNIVERSAL ARM w/ GOLDFINGER STATEMENT CART, DOUBLE MATRIX LP CLEANER, FURUTECH LP DEMAGNATIZER, HRS-MXR REFERENCE 4V RACK-GLOSS BLACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, HRS DAMPING PLATES, AESTHETIX RHEA SIG PHONO-PRE, PS AUDIO PPP, RGPC 1200, SPL PHONITOR HEADPHONE AMP, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE CABLES & SILVER ELECTRA PC'S
http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...e-dsc_2528.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...d-dsc_3313.jpg

Game Room: BRYSTON BP-26 PRE-AMP, BDA-2 DAC, BDP-2 MEDIA PLAYER, BCD-1 CD PLAYER, MPS-2 POWER SUPPLY, 28B-SST^2 MONOBLOCKS, MAGNUM DYNALAB MD-105T TUNER, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, OLIVE 04HD, CAMBRIDGE UNIVERSAL BR PLAYER, FURUTECH DEMAGNETIZER, KRELL KID DOCK, RGPC 1200(4) PS AUDIO PPP(2) SONUS FABER AMATI FUTURA'S IN RED VIOLIN FINISH, SALAMANDER SYNERGY TRIPLE 30 RACK, HRS DAMPING PLATES, CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD TT w/ TT2 ARM, URC MX-980 REMOTE, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD SILVER ECLIPSE CABLES & SILVER ELECTRA PC'S
http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...n-dsc_5175.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...s-dsc_2736.jpg

Reference System: BURMESTER 911MK3 AMP(3), 088 PRE-AMP, 089 CD PLAYER, 100 PHONO PRE-AMP LOADED, 948 POWER CONDITIONER, AVID ACUTUS REFERENCE SP TT, GRAHAM PHANTOM II SUPREME ARM, BENZ MICRO LP-S CART, ESOTERIC K-01 CD/SACD PLAYER, ESOTERIC G-01 RUBIDIUM MASTER CLOCK, HRS-SXR CUSTOM 2V-3V-2V RACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, HRS DPX DAMPING PLATES & NIMBUS COUPLERS, SONUS FABER AIDA SPEAKERS IN RED VIOLIN FINISH, JL FATHOM F113(2) SOUND ANCHOR SUB STANDS(2) ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, GIK PICTURE PANELS, ACOUSTIC REVIVE 777, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, FURUTECH POWERFLUX 18, WIREWORLD PLATINUM CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S

http://www.audioaficionado.org/membe...2236-image.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...s-dsc_4449.jpg

Library System: ALL ESOTERIC SYSTEM A-02 AMP, C-03 PRE-AMP, K-03 CD/SACD PLAYER, E-03 PHONO-PRE, OLIVE 04HD, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, AERIAL ACOUSTICS 20T V2 IN SANTOS ROSEWOOD, AERIAL SW12 SUBS IN SANTOS ROSEWOOD w/ BASES(2), VPI HRX TT w/ ORTOFON CADENZA BLACK CART, FURUTECH SILVER ARROWS PHONO CABLE, KLAUDIO RCM, BRYSTON BIT-15 POWER CONDITIONER(2) RGPC 1200(2) HRS DAMPING PLATES, STEVE BLINN COMPLETE CUSTOM RACK, ASC STUDIO TRAPS, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD SILVER ECLIPSE CABLES & SILVER ELECTRA PC'S
http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...g-dsc_4145.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...g-dsc_4143.jpg


Vintage System: JBL L300 LOUDSPEAKERS, ACCUPHASE E-460 INTEGRATED AMP, DP-550 CD/SACD/DAC, T-1100 FM STEREO TUNER, OLIVE 04HD, BRYSTON BIT-15 POWER CONDITIONER, RGPC 1200, AERIAL 7T GLOSS CHERRY SPEAKERS, TAD CR-1 MK2 SPEAKERS, SALAMANDER SYNERGY 402 RACK, TEAC UD-501 DAC, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD SILVER ECLIPSE CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...y-dsc_4172.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...d-dsc_5210.jpg
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Old 04-22-2012, 10:38 PM
djwhog's Avatar
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Yes that is it Ivan it is like the entire bottle size wine Venturi but I need it for the room to open the room like the wine
__________________
Dave's Cave
MX150 control center, (3)McIntosh 601 mono block amps, (1)7270 McIntosh amp & (1)452 McIntosh amp, Esoteric K-03

Headphone Rig
Sennheiser hd 650 & Sennheiser hd 700 cans, and Woo Audio WA-6SE with Sophia Princess & matched pair of 6GL7/6EM tubes

Also
(1)Halo A23 amp, (1)Parasound 5250 amp. Oppo 95 , Sony ES777, (2)PPPs, Little Dot MarkIII amp

Speaker system
Builder of custom very high end Dynaudio's 2 Main towers, 4 surrounds and a custom 5 speaker center channel to compliment my 2 300lb custom subs
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Old 04-22-2012, 10:42 PM
Masterlu's Avatar
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You may need more ammunition for Bill.

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Ivan

FLORIDA
MX136, C15, MC206, MC162(2) MC402, MC1.2KW(12) MC2KW(2) MR85, MS300(2) MCD301, MCD1100, MS750(2) MVP881, MCD1000, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT3F(2) WS350(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) XCS350(2) OLIVE 04HD, PS AUDIO PPP(8) PUREPOWER 2000(4) RGPC 1200(20) RGPC POLE PIG(4) JL GOTHAM SUBS(2) SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, GRACE M903 HEADPHONE AMP, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U PROJECTOR, SVS SCISSOR LIFT, STEWART STUDIOTEK 120" MOTORIZED SCREEN, HRS DAMPING PLATES, ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, CINEMA-TECH SEATING, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM STARLIGHT HDMI, GOLD ECLIPSE CABLES & SILVER ELECTRA PC'S
http://www.audioaficionado.org/membe...9-dsc-1198.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...d-dsc_1208.jpg

Reference System: ACCUPHASE A200 MONOBLOCKS(2), C3800 PRE-AMP, DP900 CD/SACD PRECISION TRANSPORT, DC901 PRECISION DIGITAL PROCESSOR, DG-58 DIGITAL VOICING EQUALIZER, T-1100 FM STEREO TUNER, PS520 POWER SUPPLY, HRS-SXR CUSTOM 4V-4V RACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, HRS NIMBUS COUPLERS, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S [CURRENTLY UNDER CONSTRUCTION]

CAPE COD
MX150, MC501(2) MC1.2KW(10) MC2301(2) MR88, MS750(3) MVP881, MEN220, MCD1100, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT3F(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) BENCHMARK DAC-1 HDR, OPPO-BDP95, OLIVE 02M, PS AUDIO PPP(8) PUREPOWER 1050(4) RGPC 1200(15) JL GOTHAM SUBS(2) JL FATHOM F113 SUBS(4) SOUND ANCHOR SUB STANDS(2) LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U PROJECTOR, STEWART STUDIOTEK 120" SCREEN, SONUS FABER STRADIVARI, URC MX-6000 REMOTE, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, OLIVE 02M, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, FORTRESS SEATING, HRS DAMPING PLATES, GOLD LION TUBES, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD GOLD & PLATINUM ECLIPSE CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...0&d=1327845807 - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...d-dsc_3310.jpg
http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...d-dsc_5267.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/membe...re2413-now.jpg

Analog Rig: CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD TT, CA OUTER RING & CLAMP, UNIVERSAL ARM w/ Da VINCI' CART, 2nd UNIVERSAL ARM w/ GOLDFINGER STATEMENT CART, DOUBLE MATRIX LP CLEANER, FURUTECH LP DEMAGNATIZER, HRS-MXR REFERENCE 4V RACK-GLOSS BLACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, HRS DAMPING PLATES, AESTHETIX RHEA SIG PHONO-PRE, PS AUDIO PPP, RGPC 1200, SPL PHONITOR HEADPHONE AMP, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD PLATINUM ECLIPSE CABLES & SILVER ELECTRA PC'S
http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...e-dsc_2528.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...d-dsc_3313.jpg

Game Room: BRYSTON BP-26 PRE-AMP, BDA-2 DAC, BDP-2 MEDIA PLAYER, BCD-1 CD PLAYER, MPS-2 POWER SUPPLY, 28B-SST^2 MONOBLOCKS, MAGNUM DYNALAB MD-105T TUNER, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, OLIVE 04HD, CAMBRIDGE UNIVERSAL BR PLAYER, FURUTECH DEMAGNETIZER, KRELL KID DOCK, RGPC 1200(4) PS AUDIO PPP(2) SONUS FABER AMATI FUTURA'S IN RED VIOLIN FINISH, SALAMANDER SYNERGY TRIPLE 30 RACK, HRS DAMPING PLATES, CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD TT w/ TT2 ARM, URC MX-980 REMOTE, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD SILVER ECLIPSE CABLES & SILVER ELECTRA PC'S
http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...n-dsc_5175.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...s-dsc_2736.jpg

Reference System: BURMESTER 911MK3 AMP(3), 088 PRE-AMP, 089 CD PLAYER, 100 PHONO PRE-AMP LOADED, 948 POWER CONDITIONER, AVID ACUTUS REFERENCE SP TT, GRAHAM PHANTOM II SUPREME ARM, BENZ MICRO LP-S CART, ESOTERIC K-01 CD/SACD PLAYER, ESOTERIC G-01 RUBIDIUM MASTER CLOCK, HRS-SXR CUSTOM 2V-3V-2V RACK w/ M3X 1921 SHELVES, HRS DPX DAMPING PLATES & NIMBUS COUPLERS, SONUS FABER AIDA SPEAKERS IN RED VIOLIN FINISH, JL FATHOM F113(2) SOUND ANCHOR SUB STANDS(2) ASC ACOUSTIC PANELS & BASS TRAPS, GIK PICTURE PANELS, ACOUSTIC REVIVE 777, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, FURUTECH POWERFLUX 18, WIREWORLD PLATINUM CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S

http://www.audioaficionado.org/membe...2236-image.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...s-dsc_4449.jpg

Library System: ALL ESOTERIC SYSTEM A-02 AMP, C-03 PRE-AMP, K-03 CD/SACD PLAYER, E-03 PHONO-PRE, OLIVE 04HD, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, AERIAL ACOUSTICS 20T V2 IN SANTOS ROSEWOOD, AERIAL SW12 SUBS IN SANTOS ROSEWOOD w/ BASES(2), VPI HRX TT w/ ORTOFON CADENZA BLACK CART, FURUTECH SILVER ARROWS PHONO CABLE, KLAUDIO RCM, BRYSTON BIT-15 POWER CONDITIONER(2) RGPC 1200(2) HRS DAMPING PLATES, STEVE BLINN COMPLETE CUSTOM RACK, ASC STUDIO TRAPS, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD SILVER ECLIPSE CABLES & SILVER ELECTRA PC'S
http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...g-dsc_4145.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...g-dsc_4143.jpg


Vintage System: JBL L300 LOUDSPEAKERS, ACCUPHASE E-460 INTEGRATED AMP, DP-550 CD/SACD/DAC, T-1100 FM STEREO TUNER, OLIVE 04HD, BRYSTON BIT-15 POWER CONDITIONER, RGPC 1200, AERIAL 7T GLOSS CHERRY SPEAKERS, TAD CR-1 MK2 SPEAKERS, SALAMANDER SYNERGY 402 RACK, TEAC UD-501 DAC, SONOS ZP90-W4S MOD, FURUTECH FLUX-50 FILTERS, WIREWORLD SILVER ECLIPSE CABLES & PLATINUM ELECTRA PC'S
http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...y-dsc_4172.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...d-dsc_5210.jpg
http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...y-dsc_4368.jpg - - - http://www.audioaficionado.org/attac...y-dsc_4377.jpg


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Old 04-23-2012, 09:21 AM
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Ivan do you have anyone you call point me to to call, or maybe Dan has a contact of a person that can help me get into the room treatment fixes?

thanks guys
__________________
Dave's Cave
MX150 control center, (3)McIntosh 601 mono block amps, (1)7270 McIntosh amp & (1)452 McIntosh amp, Esoteric K-03

Headphone Rig
Sennheiser hd 650 & Sennheiser hd 700 cans, and Woo Audio WA-6SE with Sophia Princess & matched pair of 6GL7/6EM tubes

Also
(1)Halo A23 amp, (1)Parasound 5250 amp. Oppo 95 , Sony ES777, (2)PPPs, Little Dot MarkIII amp

Speaker system
Builder of custom very high end Dynaudio's 2 Main towers, 4 surrounds and a custom 5 speaker center channel to compliment my 2 300lb custom subs
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Old 04-23-2012, 09:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Masterlu View Post
You may need more ammunition for Bill.


My kind of room treatments!!
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Old 04-23-2012, 11:09 AM
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Are your speakers set up on the 'short' wall? If so, you may want to switch them to the 'long' wall.
my concern about room treatment would be that you don't want to overdamp the room with absorbative treatment, and creating more reflective surfaces is the opposite of making the room walls disappear. Diffusers might do the trick, combined with some science.
You are right, the room is often the biggest factor and the one given the least attention.
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Old 04-23-2012, 08:59 PM
djwhog's Avatar
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Is there a go to company to call and talk to a person that is an expert on this?

thank you for the feedback,...

Well they are on the shorter wall, but it is still fairly large, and I can not do to the furniture tv etc move the stuff.
__________________
Dave's Cave
MX150 control center, (3)McIntosh 601 mono block amps, (1)7270 McIntosh amp & (1)452 McIntosh amp, Esoteric K-03

Headphone Rig
Sennheiser hd 650 & Sennheiser hd 700 cans, and Woo Audio WA-6SE with Sophia Princess & matched pair of 6GL7/6EM tubes

Also
(1)Halo A23 amp, (1)Parasound 5250 amp. Oppo 95 , Sony ES777, (2)PPPs, Little Dot MarkIII amp

Speaker system
Builder of custom very high end Dynaudio's 2 Main towers, 4 surrounds and a custom 5 speaker center channel to compliment my 2 300lb custom subs
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Old 04-23-2012, 11:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djwhog View Post
Is there a go to company to call and talk to a person that is an expert on this?

thank you for the feedback,...

Well they are on the shorter wall, but it is still fairly large, and I can not do to the furniture tv etc move the stuff.
while i'm sure there are others, and travel may factor into the price, I know that Rives Audio does this. Their site shows a fairly modest fee -$1200 to do a consult and design for an existing room. They did one guy's dedicated room- Lavigne is his name, and the room is in many places on the Internet, including on A-gon- but that was a ground up custom job.
Depending on where you live, there may be acoustic consultants near you- I live not far from NYC and i think there are many, given the number of performance spaces, halls, studios, etc. in the Gotham area. (But recognizing that what works for a recording studio isn't necessarily what you need).
Let "us" know what happens, this is interesting to me, since I am planning to move at some point, and will need to start with a new room- my existing room isn't bad, but there are many compromises that I'd like to avoid if I have the choice in a new place (short of building a separate building which is in effect what Lavigne did- and no, I haven't heard his system).
Best
bill hart

Lookee here: Rives Audio competitors?
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Kuzma XL/Airline Arm/Airtight PC1/Allnic H3000 phonostage/Veloce LS-1 Line stage (Lithio)/ Lamm ML2 amps
Avantgarde Duos;Crosby Quads/Kubala Sosna cables/Grand Prix Monaco stands and HRS platform

Last edited by Whart; 04-24-2012 at 01:31 AM.
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Sound Earphones
Sound Anchors
Sound Anchors
Acoustic Sounds Inc
Acoustic Sounds Inc
GIK Acoustics
GIK Acoustics
Esoteric
Esoteric
Steve Blinn Designs
Steve Blinn Designs
Pitch Perfect Audio
Pitch Perfect Audio
Krell
Krell
Legend Audio & Video
Legend Audio & Video
Audio by E
Audio by E
Vivid Audio
Vivid Audio
Bryston
Bryston
WireWorld Cables
WireWorld Cables
Aerial Acoustics
Aerial Acoustics
Accuphase
Accuphase
Aluminati Sound
Aluminati Sound
Shunyata Research
Shunyata Research
Delicious Decibels
Delicious Decibels